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Converting wheels from mag to taper lug nuts?

brewchief

Sr. Member
Joined
Feb 11, 2007
Messages
871
Anyone ever convert a set of aluminum wheels from mag style to a taper style lug nut? I've got a set of slots that I like but I dislike the mag style lug nuts, I also plan on going to a longer and larger stud. Is it as simple as using a tapered counter sink to add a taper?
 

siderbox

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Nov 5, 2007
Messages
1,119
First problem that comes to mind is the lack of material in the lug hole.
Ya putting the right taper to match the acorn lug nuts sounds to be easy. But the hole in the mag wheel is larger to make room for the mag lug shank.
So the contact area for the acorn to wheel would not be as much as a mag wheel that was made for an acorn.

Does that make any sense. I sure sounds good in my head.%)

I could see a 'taper spacer/insert' that would go into the hole and take up the space between the stud and the hole and allow a seating surface for the acorn nut.
 

broncnaz

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Joined
May 22, 2003
Messages
24,341
X2 some type of steel spacer/seat would be needed. Might have to have the wheels machined to do it properly and in the end might cost more than its worth. Older aluminum wheels typically dont have any steel seats and require the locating type of lug nuts.

Still with those lug nuts suggested you need a steel insert for them. ET wheels were 2 piece wheels usually with a slotted bolt pattern that had a slotted steel insert for the lug nut.
 
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brewchief

brewchief

Sr. Member
Joined
Feb 11, 2007
Messages
871
First problem that comes to mind is the lack of material in the lug hole.
Ya putting the right taper to match the acorn lug nuts sounds to be easy. But the hole in the mag wheel is larger to make room for the mag lug shank.
So the contact area for the acorn to wheel would not be as much as a mag wheel that was made for an acorn.

Does that make any sense. I sure sounds good in my head.%)

I could see a 'taper spacer/insert' that would go into the hole and take up the space between the stud and the hole and allow a seating surface for the acorn nut.

I'm planning on running 5/8" studs, they should just about fill the hole.

Lugnuts would be 5/8" race nuts that have a large taper and 1" hex.

I can't stand the balance the tire and try to start the lug nut game, I've managed to strip several lugnuts because they felt like they were good but weren't really lined up right.
 

siderbox

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Nov 5, 2007
Messages
1,119
I'm planning on running 5/8" studs, they should just about fill the hole.

Lugnuts would be 5/8" race nuts that have a large taper and 1" hex.

I can't stand the balance the tire and try to start the lug nut game, I've managed to strip several lugnuts because they felt like they were good but weren't really lined up right.

5/8" studs...That'll do it.

In that case. I'm not seeing a problem.

I'm with ya on the balance the tire start the lug nut trick.
I stripped one on my dad's truck when I was way younger, lets just say I'll never forget that or do that again.:eek:

Another thought. How bout the newer Ford style with the washer/nut combo??
 

broncnaz

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Joined
May 22, 2003
Messages
24,341
again the wheels need steel inserts or you'll run the risk of wallowing out the aluminum and destroying the wheels or loosing one due to the lug nuts loosening. I wouldnt run tapered lug nuts on aluminum with out steel inserts. Siderbox may have a point but the newer wheels are usually located by the hubs not by the lug nuts as older wheels are. So newer stuff located by the hubs can use lug nuts with flat washers.
 

DirtDonk

Contributor
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Nov 3, 2003
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Used to be a readily available steel cone seat insert for some of the larger truck wheels I used to see in the catalogs back when. Seems to me that Gorilla used to sell something like that. Maybe even Weld. Search up the lug nut companies and see what they offer.
If I remember, I thought they'd be perfect for converting an aluminum wheel to tapered nuts. They were thick, wide, and had a slight "shank" to them to center in the hole. So in essence, you would not even have to machine the face of the wheel if it was already flat. Only if you wanted to recess the thick washers so they weren't proud of the hub surface.
Either way though, I thought they'd be great.

Paul
 

70EB

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Aug 31, 2003
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Loc.
Gig Harbor
Thought about doing this for my slots. Here are some links that I found. Not sure which ones would be correct and whether they are press fit or something else.

http://www.prestigewheel.com/RetaiWheelInserts.asp

This company also makes special bores for drilling the wheels.

This is about as far as I got in thinking about it and would like to hear if anyone actually got the steel inserts installed.
 

Greg_B

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Apr 15, 2010
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Loc.
Cohutta, GA
I dont mean to hyjack this thread but along this same line I have some Centerline Aluminum wheels that use the tapered lug nuts. I worry about these since they do not have the steel inserts. I always make sure and hand tighten them myself. Even when I take it to a shop I tell them I want to either watch them install the lug nuts or let me do it myself. I ruined one of these wheels when I first got them but just taking the air wrench and zipping them on. The lug did not seat properly and the wheel came loose.... I have asked many people if a steel insert is available for these but I have never been able to find a good answer. The link above looks interesting but which one of those options do I have? Are the acorn style nuts conical or ball shaped? I think conical but I am not positive.

I also wonder if those inserts require machining the wheel to install.

If they need machined what kind of shop does this?

Greg
 

Steve

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Loc.
Grand Junction, CO
Siderbox may have a point but the newer wheels are usually located by the hubs not by the lug nuts as older wheels are. So newer stuff located by the hubs can use lug nuts with flat washers.

This. The older style wheels were lug centric, meaning the long lug nuts centered the wheel on the hub and held it on. Most newer wheels are hub centric, meaning the large center hole centered the wheel on the hub and the lug nuts simply held it on. Unless you're also changing somehow from lug centric to hub centric (not likely) I don't think changing to a tapered lug nut is a good idea.
 

broncnaz

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Joined
May 22, 2003
Messages
24,341
Some of the Forged aluminum wheels wont have the steel inserts as the forged wheels are much stronger than cast wheels some wheels may even use forged centers. Its rare that any of the older wheels were forged its mostly the newer stuff.
It is especailly important that the lug nuts for aluminum wheels be torqued to proper spec. And if they are new wheels the torque should be rechecked after the first 100 miles of use.
 
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brewchief

brewchief

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Joined
Feb 11, 2007
Messages
871
Well I ordered steel inserts today, I passed on the matching drill due to cost(166$). I'm going to see if a local machine shop can drill the wheels for the inserts using standard tooling, worst case I'll buy the drill.

I think I'm going to stick with 1/2" studs, I'll just swap longer ones in as needed.
 

Apogee

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Nov 26, 2005
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Well I ordered steel inserts today, I passed on the matching drill due to cost(166$). I'm going to see if a local machine shop can drill the wheels for the inserts using standard tooling, worst case I'll buy the drill.

I think I'm going to stick with 1/2" studs, I'll just swap longer ones in as needed.

If you go to a machine shop with CNC milling capabilities, drill size shouldn't matter since they can interpolate the hole size with a smaller diameter endmill to whatever interference press-fit you would like. Drills don't exactly cut a very accurate hole anyway, so I would stick to either interpolating it on a CNC or in the very least reaming it with the appropriate sized ream.

Tobin
 
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