Starter Solenoid, is everything hooked up correctly?

mattyq17 · Jan 29, 2018

Good morning all. This is the starter solenoid on my 66 bronco. It starts and runs fine, but I was wondering if the cable going to the starter should be on the post on the far right as that is how I have seen it in pictures. Will it hurt anything running it this way? The new red wire is running to the starter relay on top of the starter, then there is the battery positive cable, ammeter wire I believe, and bigger cable going to the starter on the left post. As you can see nothing on the right post. Is this how it should be wired or do I need to change it? Thanks

Also does anyone know what the cut wires coming out of the voltage regulator do?

B RON CO · Jan 29, 2018

Hi, the starter solenoid should not be hooked up that way. Put it where it should be on the large lug. I think it will burn out the solenoid or ignition switch and related wiring like that.
It has been mentioned that the plug on the regulator harness is for a radio noise suppressor. There is a long post on the chat side starting with "What are these"
That looks like an old original voltage regulator. When you need a new one you can upgrade to a newer electronic one. Good luck

surfer-b · Jan 29, 2018

Put the "new RD wire" that goes to the solenoid on the starter on the large RT post on your solenoid you have in the pic. The way you have it now all the current is having to flow through the Ign switch to power the solenoid on the starter. The large wire going to the starter is where it should be, on the BAT + side of the solenoid in the pic.
*** the starter you have is not a factory type, the OE does not have a solenoid on the starter body itself, that is the reason for the fender mount solenoid in the pic, I would guess someone has installed a aftermarket High Torque or an Explorer unit

mattyq17 · Jan 29, 2018

Thanks guys I will move the red wire to the right post, and take a picture of the starter to see exactly what kind it is.

Steve83 · Jan 29, 2018

This photo's caption describes how the starter relay (on the fender) should be connected (either style of relay):

(phone app link)

This shows how each type of starter should be connected:

(phone app link)

mattyq17 · Jan 29, 2018

Thanks Steve

mattyq17 · Jan 30, 2018

I snapped a quick photo last night, looks like I will be replacing the starter cable, as it is missing some sheathing and looking at the rest of it going up, the sheathing is cracked the whole way.

DirtDonk · Jan 30, 2018

Yep, later model (called a PMGR, for "permanent magnet, gear reduction") starter.
And the PO obviously had the right idea, but the wrong method. They used the old START signal post where the small Red w/blue wire goes, but as the others said that's not a robust enough circuit and puts more load on the ignition switch than would be recommended for a long and happy life.
Putting the new Red wire on the empty big lug is the way to do it. Takes most of the load off of the ignition switch.

For clarification, you're correct in calling the fender-mounted part a "starter relay" but the one piggybacking the starter IS actually a "starter solenoid" in the truest sense of the word.
This is why the different wiring scheme too. An actual solenoid pulls more load through the wire than does a simple relay, because it's doing physical labor other than just closing contacts in an electrical switch.
Which is why the older your ignition switch is, the more trouble it has with the heavier load asked of it from a real solenoid.

So even though yours was working as expected, glad you asked!;D

Paul

mattyq17 · Feb 1, 2018

So I removed the red wire to the empty post on the side. When I was removing the nut on the S terminal the whole threaded piece would move but not come all the way out but I could move it around pretty good.

Now when I went to try and start it it fired up then died which is normal when I haven’t started it in awhile. When I tried again all I get is a clicking noise. I didn’t have time to check the battery but it should have a full charge. Is it possible that the starter solenoid is bad, I can’t think that the S post being loose like that is a good or normal thing.

Justafordguy · Feb 2, 2018

Sounds like it's bad to me too. If the s post turned in there it probably broke the wire inside.

DirtDonk · Feb 2, 2018

Yep, most likely. You can test pretty easily with a jumper cable or spare battery cable though.
If you jump the wire between the two large posts (straight from battery to starter basically) and the starter spins normally, then your battery and starter and their cables are fine, and it's just the connection to the S post, or the S post itself.

You can double-check the S-post by simply jumping a wire (can be a small one of 10ga to even 16ga) from the battery side big lug, to the S post directly.
If you get a consistently good click from the relay and the starter spins, then it's got something to do with how the Red w/blue wire is connected to the post, or something went wonky between the ignition switch and the relay.

But my money is on the spinning post being a clue to a bad starter relay.
It's a more common failure than the ignition and wire probably. Especially with newer vintage relays.
And especially when the PO attaches an additional wire there that needs a nut.

Paul

DirtDonk · Feb 2, 2018

Oh, and at this point, even if you can get some action from the starter relay with the jumper method, I'd still get a new one to replace it with. The existing one has just been too compromised to have much more of a life I would think.
Any ability for it to work at this point is likely due more to luck than anything else.

And because the new ones are junk more often than not it seems, it would not hurt you to find one that says it's made in maybe Mexico or Japan, rather than China. Or even in the USA (a real score!) if you can.
Some Motorcraft units are made in the US, but many are made in China and Taiwan. I have to hope that as long as we've been in good relations with Taiwan and have been their trading partner, that their stuff is better than mainland China or some of the other countries. But that's just a hope, and not based on any known facts.
We only know here that so many of the Chinese ones fail after the first or second start, that it pays to pay more.
I literally just paid 60 bucks for a new one recently, to get a USA made, marine grade unit. In the hopes that it will last longer. Not that I like to discourage buying from your local source, but you can find the US ones online at what I consider reasonable prices. More in the $30 to $50 range.
Just say "pass" on the ones that you can get for $15 to $25 though.

Good luck.

Paul

mattyq17 · Feb 14, 2018

I replaced the solenoid, moved the wire to the correct post, got a new starter cable, positive and negative cable and she fired up. Now I am getting intermittent power loss at the ignition switch. Sometimes when I turn the key I get nothing other times works like a charm. The whole ignition switch seems loose to me on the dash as I can turn it side to side about 1/4 inch. I am thinking that is the problem since when I get it in just the right spot I can get it to work. I am wanting a new wiring harness and know I will probably replace all the switches so the painless seems like the best bet. But that won’t happen till next winter most likely. I am going to try and tighten up the ignition switch and see if that helps out for now.

ransil · Feb 14, 2018

mattyq17 said:
I replaced the solenoid, moved the wire to the correct post, got a new starter cable, positive and negative cable and she fired up. Now I am getting intermittent power loss at the ignition switch. Sometimes when I turn the key I get nothing other times works like a charm. The whole ignition switch seems loose to me on the dash as I can turn it side to side about 1/4 inch. I am thinking that is the problem since when I get it in just the right spot I can get it to work. I am wanting a new wiring harness and know I will probably replace all the switches so the painless seems like the best bet. But that won’t happen till next winter most likely. I am going to try and tighten up the ignition switch and see if that helps out for now.

looking at all the crimp on splices, you are gonna have lots of problems.
keep chasing them until you can replace the harness.

mattyq17 · Feb 14, 2018

ransil said:
looking at all the crimp on splices, you are gonna have lots of problems.
keep chasing them until you can replace the harness.

Ransil, you don't know how correct you are. The more I dig into the wiring the more splices and bare wire I find. Maybe my tax return will be able to go towards a new harness.....just have to convince the wife......

DirtDonk · Feb 14, 2018

Why not replace the ignition switch now anyway? Rather than fight a known (or at least suspected) issue.
A switch alone is probably available for less than 20 bucks just about anywhere (we sell them for 19), and even a full "kit" with new chrome bezel, lock cylinder and key is $50-$60 or so.
The parts and (if you're lucky) a half-hour of your time and you're back on the road hopefully.

Now, if the switch is very cooperative, you can replace it in 15 minutes. If it fights you, or your back and neck don't like twisting around under the dash(!) the job could take the better part of an hour while you fight it.
But even at that it still seems worth it.

If you suspect that it's at least in part due to the lock cylinder though, might as well go all-in and buy a switch, and the the cylinder with new keys for another $12 bucks.
Besterest yet though would be to get the cylinder AND new door locks version so that all your keys still match.

Might be worth it before you do your whole harness. And at the worst you will have a spare switch for when the next one eventually fails.

Paul

sprdv1 · Feb 15, 2018

DirtDonk said:
Why not replace the ignition switch now anyway? Rather than fight a known (or at least suspected) issue.

X2... won't hurt

Rustytruck · Feb 16, 2018

Fix your known problems one step at a time and sooner than later you will have no known problems. There are no big problems unless you let them all stack up and wait for the time to fix it all in one big project. By then you are fully frustrated, pissed off and then the truck sits for years. The Bronco is not a complicated beast unless you make it so. Almost everyone here has been where you are with your truck. There is so much support on this site you never have to feel you in over you head without any back up.

mattyq17 · Feb 16, 2018

Thanks guys I think I am going to try the new ignition switch first and work back from there. I just can’t swing a new wiring harness at this point and will be working nights for the next few weeks. I will report back once I get time to work on it. Thanks for all the help.

Starter Solenoid, is everything hooked up correctly?

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