1969 uncut sport just purchased

sprdv1 said:

Amen... What he said

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I third this. I would fix any rust holes on the floor and consider buffing the paint. Maybe a new Centech wiring harness when the engine gets rebuilt.

Just be sure to keep that gas pedal. Classic!!

JAFHR said:

This even drives just fine with it's 3 on the tree and manual brakes with no power steering. That is a treat to drive as I have another 1974 fully modified.

I just want to keep it integrity. It's only original once...

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Why would you need to, or want to, change anything about it? I wouldn’t touch anything unless it needed to be repaired.

DirtDonk said:

Good question. And a tough one I think.
Obviously the real survivor has nothing changed. But I think that these days the pure definition is mostly overlooked and some things are "allowed" and still call it a survivor. Like seat covers alone might not change it's status, but a rebuilt engine would in my opinion.

Buffed out paint and cleaned up undercarriage keeps it's status, but new paint and it's not really a survivor even if the old paint is still hiding there underneath.
But a little black paint on the axles is not likely going to ruin most people's day I don't think.
But there will always be some...

Paul

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Wow, that was a great explanation of all of my questions. To answer the most compelling question. Flip or keep it. Hell, I'd love to hang on to for the next twenty years. I have a shop and can simply stick it there and forget about it. I think I'll try to clean up some surface rust as much as possible without it being noticeable. The issue is there is a lot of surface rust on the hard top below the drip rail. Not sure what can be done without it being very noticeable.

I appreciate all the answers. This is a tough one but I'll certainly take my time and not change it. I will try to preserve it as is. This is certainly not a long distance driver as was pointed out, not to mention I already have a fully modified one to play with.

One last question. I have a small VIN plate that is in the glove box. What was this for. Is this something that was extra to keep in the files when it was first sold?

techfab said:

Just be sure to keep that gas pedal. Classic!!

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There is also a sister pedal to that for the emergency brake. LOL, it's in the glove box.

JAFHR said:

Wow, that was a great explanation of all of my questions. To answer the most compelling question. Flip or keep it. Hell, I'd love to hang on to for the next twenty years. I have a shop and can simply stick it there and forget about it. I think I'll try to clean up some surface rust as much as possible without it being noticeable. The issue is there is a lot of surface rust on the hard top below the drip rail. Not sure what can be done without it being very noticeable.

I appreciate all the answers. This is a tough one but I'll certainly take my time and not change it. I will try to preserve it as is. This is certainly not a long distance driver as was pointed out, not to mention I already have a fully modified one to play with.

One last question. I have a small VIN plate that is in the glove box. What was this for. Is this something that was extra to keep in the files when it was first sold?

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if it's small and silver, sounds like a buck tag. normally tied in the engine bay to the firewall. they put them on at the assembly for??? can't remember lol

Either that, or it might have been one of those tags that the manufacturers used to stick inside the original owners manual cover, or the little vinyl owners manual folders.
Got pics of it?

Paul

Picture always helps...:l.

JAFHR said:

One last question. I have a small VIN plate that is in the glove box. What was this for. Is this something that was extra to keep in the files when it was first sold?

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DirtDonk said:

Either that, or it might have been one of those tags that the manufacturers used to stick inside the original owners manual cover, or the little vinyl owners manual folders.
Got pics of it?

Paul

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Here's the picture of the tag and the little foot in comparison
http://photobucket.com/user/gdief/media/IMG_7236.jpg.html
http://photobucket.com/user/gdief/media/IMG_7236.jpg.html

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Using CLR and a scotch brite pad or fine grit wet dry paper does wonders removing surface rust and the stains from it. It doesnt get rid of it all but it does a ton. and typically doesn't hurt the original paint unless you let it sit for too long.

Interesting. Could be one of those tags. Certainly not a leftover glovebox door tag, as it's the wrong design and has no holes.
Never seen an EB buck tag though, so don't know how they were attached. The one on my F350 looks like it's welded, but when I've had the chance, I've never actually had a look-see.

Nice little extra bit of Bronco-stuff for the file.

Paul

Well Houston we have a problem. I do remember people saying don't mess with this bronco and I haven't. I have simply taken apart the front hubs to check the brakes and shaft U-joints. I have found that the knuckle on the passenger side has a lot of play in it. I can't find anywhere how to replace the knuckle ujoint on the Dana 30. It's all on the 44. Since I've got it apart I thought about swapping out a set of disc's that I have on another Dana 30 axle assembly I have. The problem I just noticed is that where the break caliper is mount, the top of the edge of the knuckle (4 bolts) has been cut in so the caliper mounts in place of one of the bolts. Now this Dana 30 axle assembly worked on a previous bronco just fine.

I am concerned on 4 different plains. 1, should I be putting discs on this bronco. (the original brakes need renew and of course they suck) 2. Do I rebuild the knuckles etc and stay stock. 3. replace the whole axle assembly with discs I have for a swap out. Would it matter seeing that this bronco is all original. Oh and lastly, do I just say screw it and get a fully set up Dana 44. I'll never put bigger tires etc on it.

If it were me I would just do a disc brake set up on the Dana 30. I had some slop in my knuckles and rebuilt them. It was self-explanatory once I was taking it apart.

I considered updating to a Dana 44 as well but if you don't plan on doing crazy wheeling I think a Dana 30 is just fine.

JAFHR said:

1, should I be putting discs on this bronco. (the original brakes need renew and of course they suck)

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Are you going to drive it, store it, or flip it?
If the answer is even remotely number one and you're going to drive it, just swap in the disc brakes and be much better off.
And if the other two fall into the equation, simply save the old parts and any new owner will be tickled pink to take them off your hands.

Like you said though, they need renewing, so maybe they're not worth saving for the future either? Then the answer is still obvious to me anyway, that the discs should be your best answer.

JAFHR said:

2. Do I rebuild the knuckles etc and stay stock.

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Well, you'll have to rebuild the knuckles either way. So I still say go disc brakes.
And when you say rebuild, presumably you're talking about the king-pin bearings? And maybe axle u-joints?
If so, then yes, you would do all of that no matter what. Again, unless you're just going to store it for sale later.

JAFHR said:

3. replace the whole axle assembly with discs I have for a swap out. Would it matter seeing that this bronco is all original. Oh and lastly, do I just say screw it and get a fully set up Dana 44. I'll never put bigger tires etc on it.

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Forget the D44 for now. It's on one of my "why bother" lists for a Bronco that's not going to see bigger tires, or it sounds like off-road use either.
The cost and hassle of finding a decent 44 are not worth the trouble. Sometimes you find them easily, sometimes not. Usually they're semi-affordable, sometimes not. But no matter what, it's not needed for either disc brakes or strength.

Granted, if you find a reasonably priced one already built up and has the same gear ratio as yours, it could be less expensive to buy the 44 than renew the king-pin bearings. But unless that 44 is under $300 bucks or so (I haven't compared pricing) then I still say you're ahead of the game with the existing 30 unless it's truly and thoroughly trashed.

JAFHR said:

The problem I just noticed is that where the break caliper is mount, the top of the edge of the knuckle (4 bolts) has been cut in so the caliper mounts in place of one of the bolts. Now this Dana 30 axle assembly worked on a previous bronco just fine.

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Not sure exactly what you're describing. Got pics you can share by any chance?

Good luck.

Paul

I do plan to keep and drive/store the bronco.I'd really like to hold onto this one for a long time. If I drive it, of course I'll want it to be safe. I was driving it the other day and realized the braking needed help. This is why I decided to tear it apart.

DirtDonk, I have another fully assembled with discs Dana 30 taken off my 68 when I switched it to a Dana 44. I can drop that one in probably easier than rebuilding the King Pin (I think) not to mention the additional cost of the disc conversion. Green61bug mentioned the king pin replacement is self explanatory, yet I am having an issue as what to do after removing the top and bottom 4 bolts. How does it come apart.

Back to the disc brakes on the assembled Dana 30. I think someone put the caliper plate in a wrong position therefore the caliper is too high. It is encroaching into the King pin plate on top and someone took a grinder to it. I will get pictures tomorrow. That will help with the explanation. I think my choices are. rebuild the King Pin bearings, shaft Ujoints and purchase a Disc Brake Conversion for Toms Bronco's instead of taking apart the other dana 30 to use the disc brake set up, or simply swap out the axle assemblies. This might be the easier choice ???

Does the disc brake set up work well without changing the brake master cylinder to a power assist. I plan to rebuild and or get a new master cylinder just to make sure it's strong enough. I understand that I'd be putting on a compensator for the discs.

That's why I was curious to see what the old one looked like. The installation of a disc brake kit on a Bronco Dana axle requires some grinding of the knuckle. Sounded initially like the original installer took a little too much of a liking to the grinder during the process!

But you may be on to something if the parts were sourced from, say a Jeep or other year GM vehicle that the clocking was different on. Then they may just have had to remove too much to get where they needed to be.
But you do have to grind, no matter what. So keep that in mind for the new-installation option.

Paul

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Here you go, it worked. As you can see on the upper KingPin area has been severally ground down. Not sure I want to use any of this. May just order a new set along with the rebuild kit for the Kinpin. As for Green61bug, yes you were correct. The Kingpin removal is pretty much self explanatory. I just had a real stuck cap. I went to the other side and it came off much easier. Hey what is that white crystal/ plastic in the socket area and was crumbled. Do the lower bearing caps come out.

Is it a good time to replace the tie rods etc while have this down. Has a 100,000 miles on it. Seems ok but I'm sure it's worn.

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JAFHR said:

As you can see on the upper KingPin area has been severally ground down.

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Wow! Never seen that that I can remember. I heard what you were saying, but really wanted to see how bad it was with my own eyes. Now I'm sorry I asked!

I wonder.... Is it possible to put the caliper bracket on the wrong side? While you're fooling around with all this, try two things.
First, simply rotate it. With six bolts, it's possible it could be rotated a bit. Not sure though.
Second, if that doesn't net any obvious improvements, swap the bracket to the other knuckle and rotate it around the holes to see if it puts the caliper in a good position.

And three, wait for others to chime in with their theories!

JAFHR said:

Not sure I want to use any of this. May just order a new set along with the rebuild kit for the Kingpin.

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Not sure either. Seems to have worked for awhile already, but not sure how much it's weakened things.

JAFHR said:

Hey what is that white crystal/ plastic in the socket area and was crumbled. Do the lower bearing caps come out.

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Not seeing it in the pics. Do you mean something inside the king-pin socket area, under the cap? Both sides in the same condition? Guessing it was a plastic liner or shim/sleeve/spacer of some kind. Been a long while since I've been inside one though, so don't know yet.

JAFHR said:

Is it a good time to replace the tie rods etc while have this down. Has a 100,000 miles on it. Seems ok but I'm sure it's worn.

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Too bad you were not able to check them while it was all together. There's no way to know just by messing around by hand. By the time the rod-ends are loose to the touch, they're so far gone they should have been replaced thousands of miles ago!
When they're simply worn a little beyond their useful life, they're still pretty tight and the best way to find out is to perform the test where, with both tires on the ground under the weight of the truck, a helper racks the steering wheel back and forth while you watch all the linkage. In this way you can really see stuff that's loose, even when it's just barely starting down the path to old age.

If you know for a fact that these are originals and have 100k on them, it would be a rare end indeed that was not worn out. So yeah, at this point you can add some more money to the pit and replace them with some newer updated stuff.
But if this is just a fix-it-as-you-go kind of project, you could always put them back on and check it later.
It's easy enough to change out the linkage while everything is installed on the vehicle, so it's not completely necessary you do it all at the same time while it's out.

In other words... Up to you!;D

Paul