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A brutally honest suspension comparison...

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englewoodcowboy

englewoodcowboy

Lick Creek Restorations
Joined
Jul 25, 2010
Messages
4,200
I see you discovered the dreaded front axle hard brake line interference issue:)

Wish we could get a longer "stainless braided" soft line and avoid all that by setting the hard line bracket closer to pumpkin.

I really like that torque tamer, I have an exact "version" of it on mine. Again, only drawback is frame mounted stuff needs to go on top because of the mount into the side of the inside of the frame, and again, the rear brake line hard line interference.

If you look closely I moved the brackets to the inside of the mount and then twisted them slightly with an adjustable wrench. Ive done this on the other broncos we have installed the TRex arms on with no issue.
 
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englewoodcowboy

englewoodcowboy

Lick Creek Restorations
Joined
Jul 25, 2010
Messages
4,200
Nice write up and thanks for taking the time to do the comparison, but I'm a little confused on that caster thing as well... The caster would be measured at ride height which the 2-1/2" lift dictates, and which one droops more would be irrelevant.
Also, it's not super clear to me, were the WH's springs only tested on the stock arms and the duff springs only on the t-Rex arms? So no direct comparison of springs with all else being equal?


I understand your concern and as far as comparison we have done straight up systems with stock arms running both Duffs and WH 2.5" There is a difference when on stock arms in ride, as the Duffs still feel more absorbing rather than reacting like the WH. This is contributed to 2 things, spring rate and stages as I touched on before. What the TRex add into the equation is freeing up pivot bind and limited travel caused by that bind. The Duffs springs take full advantage of that in every aspect whereas the WH cannot simply because they become the limiting factor in droop when compared to side by side. This was not meant to be a comparison for which is better, the WH system is great for what it is, the Duffs is better when using all of the components that are designed to work in unison. The TRex will enhance whatever spring you want to use but when it is designed to work with the full travel capabilities you really begin to unlock the full potential of every component.
 
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englewoodcowboy

englewoodcowboy

Lick Creek Restorations
Joined
Jul 25, 2010
Messages
4,200
So when you were done did you get a pretty even 2.5" lift or more or less?

Pretty much even. The Duffs sits a tad higher but they are new so I am expecting some settle over the next few months and miles so they ultimately will sit the same.
 
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englewoodcowboy

englewoodcowboy

Lick Creek Restorations
Joined
Jul 25, 2010
Messages
4,200
I had the same question in mind when reading about it.

If I thought there would be a good reason to test them I would have but when you lay the springs on the floor and test total droop I saw no need to waste time in doing so. If some are going to be skeptical at this comparison over them, then if I have time to swap out the front coils to flex it I will while I still have the old ones here.
 

Rustytruck

Bronco Guru
Joined
Feb 24, 2002
Messages
10,875
Box up your old front coils when your done testing them and sell them to me.
 
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englewoodcowboy

englewoodcowboy

Lick Creek Restorations
Joined
Jul 25, 2010
Messages
4,200
Box up your old front coils when your done testing them and sell them to me.

They are already sold. Thanks. I may have another WH 2.5 coils and leafs coming up for sale. They are less than a year old, customer is debating on switching to our new setup.
 

suckerpunched

Sr. Member
Joined
Aug 24, 2006
Messages
882
If I thought there would be a good reason to test them I would have but when you lay the springs on the floor and test total droop I saw no need to waste time in doing so. If some are going to be skeptical at this comparison over them, then if I have time to swap out the front coils to flex it I will while I still have the old ones here.

I'm not doubting your findings, well, maybe I am. I certainly do not intend to be offensive and hope you don't take it that way. I also am not trying to defend any vendors product. I have read your posts in the past and know you are on top of your game. I wish I had your knowledge when I had my AOD gone through, but that's another subject. I think a guy could make the argument that the design of the fabricated radius arms, landing at the axle at a higher point than stock arms do. causing them to sit slightly closer to parallel to the frame could potentially put the small end of the arm in less of a bind to start with and allow a little more droop. I always thought a guy should cut the radius mounting tabs off the frame and weld them on angled down in a more neutral position to start with
 

Rustytruck

Bronco Guru
Joined
Feb 24, 2002
Messages
10,875
Ford may have wanted a bind in the rubber bushings to help stabalize the truck for on road handling. Its the chase for better offroad capability that leads the desire for extra droop and a more flexable suspension system. Then you start thinking about sway bars to get back better road handling.
 
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englewoodcowboy

englewoodcowboy

Lick Creek Restorations
Joined
Jul 25, 2010
Messages
4,200
I'm not doubting your findings, well, maybe I am. I certainly do not intend to be offensive and hope you don't take it that way. I also am not trying to defend any vendors product. I have read your posts in the past and know you are on top of your game. I wish I had your knowledge when I had my AOD gone through, but that's another subject. I think a guy could make the argument that the design of the fabricated radius arms, landing at the axle at a higher point than stock arms do. causing them to sit slightly closer to parallel to the frame could potentially put the small end of the arm in less of a bind to start with and allow a little more droop. I always thought a guy should cut the radius mounting tabs off the frame and weld them on angled down in a more neutral position to start with


No worries and no offense taken. I will try to swap coils to see if there is a difference if I have time before I install them on another customers Bronco that I sold them to. I get the question as initially I had it myself but when we had the WH coils on the factory radius arms and tried to pull them down past their natural rest, they didn't want to move much at all, when I laid them on the ground side by side I initially thought I may have got 3.5" coils from Duff by mistake but man what a difference between the two in plush ride qualities. I know for a fact that removing the double angle from the factory arms to the TRex is directly responsible for less binding at the pivot and allowing the 3" gain in droop. I am also certain that reducing that bind has freed the suspension up to do its job more efficiently as well, the proof is int he seat feel of driving it and hitting bumps etc. and it is very evident. Again not knocking WH their stuff was fantastic, just Duffs is better to my likings is all and it may not be the thing everyone is looking for. After major back surgery and being wheeled in prior and being told it is literally a toss of the coin if I will walk again after the surgery due to the location of the damage, I am very keen on anything that impacts my back and I try my hardest to not give up the things I love but make them better suit to my needs and this certainly has done that in a huge way. I will try to swap and test so we have a straight up comparison if time allows and will add it here. As far as my opinion goes, it is mine and the TRex arms will now be on every build we do because the advantages simply outweigh not taking them in overall performance.
 

toddz69

Sponsor/Vendor
Bronco Guru
Joined
Nov 28, 2001
Messages
10,079
One other point of note, from an engineering standpoint, on the springs. I believe the coils we use on our trucks are at best, 2-stage springs. The differences in spacing between the first 4-5 coils in the soft range are not enough to consider them separate stages, in my opinion. Duffs springs have an additional active coil in that range, but I wouldn't consider it another stage.

Todd Z.
 

Glass Pony

Contributor
Bronco Guru
Joined
Feb 13, 2012
Messages
1,817
Loc.
Sussex County Delaware
Now if I want to add more caster I will have to go back to 7° bushings and then I will be dealing with needing a high angle drive shaft to make it work and not bind at full droop.
I wonder if Duff's still has some of their old 6.25 degree bushings laying on a shelf somewhere. It might be an option for somebody wanting not to go to 7 degree.
 

vtboy51

Sr. Member
Joined
Aug 26, 2016
Messages
383
I'm in the market for a 2.5" lift this fall so I'm subscribing. I just looked on Duff's website and it appears their system comes with 2 shocks up front on each side, requiring a bracket to be welded on. I'd prefer a single shock, has anyone run this kit with only a single, does it effect the ride much? I know the WH comparable kit is a single shock.
 

Monster Mike

Sponsor/Vendor
Bronco Guru
Joined
Dec 29, 2010
Messages
1,768
I'm in the market for a 2.5" lift this fall so I'm subscribing. I just looked on Duff's website and it appears their system comes with 2 shocks up front on each side, requiring a bracket to be welded on. I'd prefer a single shock, has anyone run this kit with only a single, does it effect the ride much? I know the WH comparable kit is a single shock.

We have done so much with our suspension kits in the last two years. We have several options not listed on the website. Give us a call, we have almost every option you need and soon we will have another shock option that will be nothing short of mouth watering.

contact info below in my signature line

MM
 

Bogar

Full Member
Joined
Sep 18, 2014
Messages
174
We have done so much with our suspension kits in the last two years. We have several options not listed on the website. Give us a call, we have almost every option you need and soon we will have another shock option that will be nothing short of mouth watering.

contact info below in my signature line

MM

I'm also in the market for a 2.5" lift and would prefer a single shock. Will your site be updated soon?
 

Monster Mike

Sponsor/Vendor
Bronco Guru
Joined
Dec 29, 2010
Messages
1,768
I'm also in the market for a 2.5" lift and would prefer a single shock. Will your site be updated soon?

I'll see what I can do but I honestly don't know. At this point we all have been hanging on for dear life as the economy continues to strengthen. We are a small operation and very few people here do very many jobs.

I can tell you this much though, Even if you could view the suspension system you want on our website you would still have to speak to one of our sales guys. There are several variables that make up our kits and the info these guys exchange with you is just as important as purchasing the lift. Plus we calculate the shipping for 95% of everything we sell manually. A lot of people call just to get a shipping quote which is a great thing to do because we have a few different options including Fed Ex flat rate freight. Our Monster suspension systems can take a ride to the west coast for a better deal than UPS ground using the Fed Ex flat rate freight option. call for details.

MM
 

bronconut73

Bronco Guru
Joined
Aug 7, 2012
Messages
9,916
When you go to a really expensive restaurant with a renowned chef you get what is being served for each course. You often do not get to order. You are eating what the chef has designed in the order he has determined.

When you stroll past Superlift, Skyjacker, Rancho, Rough Country, Trail Master, Pro-Comp, etc, etc...you will end up at these boutique fab shops like Duffs that cater specifically to the eb (51 bucking years in fact).

If you are here at CB and you're considering Duffs you're already pretty f'n smart. But don't stop there....
Call Duffs and ask the "Chefs" there what will work best for you.

They know better than anybody else. Whatever new problem you may think you are having with your eb was encountered by James Duff (OG) back in the late 60's and early 70's during his Baja runs. He was coming up with eb solutions before many of us were out of elementary school.

And by the way,

Maybe what they suggest for you includes far more equipment at greater costs than you were expecting....
Remember that you can buy nearly all of this equipment piece by piece. You save money buying it all at once but I had to buy it in chunks though....


You will never regret buying Duffs well engineered high quality parts....I love all my Duff Tuff Stuff...been buying Duff stuff for nearly 30+ years.

Duff, always a good decision.

Steve in O'Town
 
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