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Coyote non-automatic trans options???

sailopus

Newbie
Joined
Mar 31, 2020
Messages
9
Ok Coyote builders out there....I have been looking all over this site and the internet to find a solution. Seems most people are going the auto route via 6R80 or 5R70W. But I want to still shift and have fun. I have looked at the NV3550/AX15/MR52, but I don't think they can handle the power from the 2016 mustang Coyote I am using (500hp). I heard that the ZF5 S5-47 can bolt right up to the modular motors, but when I had one in front of me it is 7.5" across the top of the bell housing, where the bolt holes on the back of the motor are only 5". So....here are my questions (beyond the obvious)...

1) was I looking at the wrong ZF5 trans? Anyone know for sure of a year model Ford that one comes out of and fits?
2) Is there an adapter that would let one mount up to the Coyote?
3) Other transmission options I am missing?

Thanks in advance for your help!
 

Broncobowsher

Total hack
Joined
Jun 4, 2002
Messages
34,835
The ZF came in many different flavors. Most of us are after the small block version used behind the 351W. There is also the big block version that has the 460 bolt pattern. Don't forget the diesel versions. But what you are looking for is a modular V8 version. The 5.4 V8 and 6.8 V10 have the modular bolt pattern that is also on the coyote.

There is also a Mazda 5-speed used behind the 4.6 in the F150. It is a pretty stout transmission and a bit more car like in the shifting and gear spacing.

They do make a modular to traditional Ford transmission bellhousing. You could bolt up your old 3-speed if you like, or a top loader, NP435...
 
OP
OP
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sailopus

Newbie
Joined
Mar 31, 2020
Messages
9
Thanks for the insight. That helps me start to look in the correct direction. Just need to research which vehicles had that combo now.
 

Broncobowsher

Total hack
Joined
Jun 4, 2002
Messages
34,835
'98 and newer (to '12 maybe?) F250. F350. for the ZF. There is also a 6-speed, but that is HUGE. One of the 6-speed transmission had an oil pump and an oil cooler. But it is still a wide ratio HD truck transmission. Not a sports car.
The F150 Mazda 5-speed will feel a lot more like driving a car. That is '97 to '12(?) F150 but only with the 4.6 engine.
 

nvrstuk

Contributor
Just a Bronco driver for over 50 yrs!
Joined
Jul 31, 2001
Messages
8,614
"But I want to still shift and have fun." THIS is the OP's orginal quote.

Driving a Coyote engine and shifting a TRUCK transmission (Mazda) with gear splits 1/2 mile apart (nothing like a ZF tho with a one mile gap between gears). I can't think of a worse combination for "fun".

Broncobowsher is correct that the Mazda is much better than the ZF, but it's a truck tranny! Anyway, that's my thoughts. I drove a ZF for a dozen years in my Bronco. Get's around but driving a 3 spd with a compound low gear and overdrive isn't "fun".

I just pulled a 4r70W out and am putting in a 6r80. I can "manually" shift it all day. Just don't need my left foot. Gear splits are super close.

But if you want to drive a clutch then there aren't many options. Good luck
 

nvrstuk

Contributor
Just a Bronco driver for over 50 yrs!
Joined
Jul 31, 2001
Messages
8,614
6:1 first gear. I've heard it shifts smoother than other truck tranny's but its gear splits are not street friendly. Essentially a 3spd w/OD for street. Guess I don't equate just the act of shifting fun... having car gear ratios is what makes it fun. But the more guys I know that switch from 435's and ZF's to 4r70 type autos with good splits are admitting the same- not just me anymore.

I won't say anymore on this. Not knowing your background I just want ed to point this out. Good luck-wish ya the best.
 
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OP
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sailopus

Newbie
Joined
Mar 31, 2020
Messages
9
ok, now you all have me questioning the manual and thinking about going with an Automatic. Decisions.decisions.......I guess I can just drive my little M3 when I want to do some shifting......so now to start researching whether to go with the 4R70W or the 6R80....I think I remember seeing some write up on a different post.

Thanks everyone!
 

nvrstuk

Contributor
Just a Bronco driver for over 50 yrs!
Joined
Jul 31, 2001
Messages
8,614
I've been driving a 4r70w with a stroker in front and a doubler with atlas's and/or NP205. I ran a Optishift controller for 10 yrs and just upgraded to the Quick 4.

I am installing a 6r80 now but it's for drivetrain angles, etc, etc and with my stroker I don't need a doubler anymore.

6R80 is 2-3x the cost of a 4r70. The 4r70's acan handle 500/500 every day with 40" tires so don't let anybody tell you they can't.

Ask away, lot of knowledge with these guys on here.
 

thiswildbronco

Jr. Member
Joined
Jun 3, 2016
Messages
128
I’ve got an AX-15 in mine, though I’m not yet to the driving stage of my 2+ year build ��. Topped with a B&M short throw shifter, I’m expecting a nice blend of stout tranny with manual “fun”. My goal is to preserve some of what makes a 50 year old vehicle such a blast (I’m also keeping my window cranks manual - I hate the idea of putting too many soft touches into the build).

And, for what it’s worth, I know Jonathan Ward at Icon uses the AX-15 for all of his manuals. That’s a fairly decent vote of confidence.

Good luck!
 
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OP
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sailopus

Newbie
Joined
Mar 31, 2020
Messages
9
Ok fellow coyote builders. Need some schooling on the 6R80 trans now....since
I guess I will be going that route instead of a manual. Anyway, here are my questions:

1) Is there a difference between the 11-14 and the 15 and up trans? I have a 2016 mustang coyote, so want to make sure I get the right 6R80.
2) Does it have to be a 6R80 out of a 5.0L 4x4, or do the other engine bolt patterns line up...i.e. - 5.4L or 3.7L use the same bolt pattern to bell housing as the 5.0L?

Appreciate the help so I don’t go down the wrong road on this build.

Thanks!
 

nvrstuk

Contributor
Just a Bronco driver for over 50 yrs!
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Messages
8,614
Get the '15 and later F150 4x4 6r80. 2012-14 fits but there is supposed to be a pump difference and something else (small item).

Nothing other than F150 interchanges easily. You'll need an adapter to fit a 205, D20 or Atlas with the 6r80.
 

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Cactus killer

Sponsor/Vendor
Sr. Member
Joined
Dec 22, 2005
Messages
736
Go with the 6r80 light years ahead of the 4r70w. It has to be out of the 5.0 and 4x4 (you can't convert 4x2 like the old trans missions) Don"t get anything before 2013. 11 and 12 were recalled for random 1 gear down shift, imagine that at 80.
 

jamesroney

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Sr. Member
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Sep 11, 2007
Messages
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Fremont, CA
Ok Coyote builders out there....
But I want to still shift and have fun.
Yup, you were doing fine with "Coyote Non-automatic trans options..."

Don't let anyone fool you. Automatics are lame. They disconnect you from the car, and suck the joy out of spirited driving.

The only manual transmission that I can think of for the Coyote is the T56 / TR606 platform. Rockland Standard Gear has found a way to adapt the output to the common 6-round pattern in 32 spline for a 4x4. So it should be possible to fit one in a Bronco.

It will shift like a car.
 

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nvrstuk

Contributor
Just a Bronco driver for over 50 yrs!
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If you don't think manually shifting an auto isn't fun.... hmmm...

I am positive that I can prove to you if you actually went for a ride that an auto is much more efficient, effective and much less frustrating to drive than a manual when wheeling like I do (one example) in deep, heavy, wet snow. When I am frustrated when wheeling, it's not much fun. Every manual will frustrate you and make you want an auto. Steep sand dunes that need a shift during the climb are another. That's just two examples... I can list more and preference is important but for me practicality beats the snot out of having to move your left leg to enjoy "spirted driving". lol I ran a top loader four speed for 5 years in my Bronco and it was fun... but it couldn't match what my 4r did for a decade and what the 6r has been doing the past 2 1/2 yrs.. The top loader was a fun trans but definitely experienced it's drawbacks (not just a lack of low either) when wheeling. Torque converters are magic!

My local buddy's that have switched still have their testosterone and love their quick shifting manually operated when needed, autos. Just saying I might be more vocal about it here on this forum :) but they are sold and have told everyone that they'd never go back.


That would be pretty slick to have the output shaft of the TR changed to the std 6 bolt output of a Ford 4x4 design. Be a nice setup
 
Last edited:

jamesroney

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Messages
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Fremont, CA
If you don't think manually shifting an auto isn't fun.... hmmm...

I am positive that I can prove to you if you actually went for a ride that an auto is much more efficient, effective and much less frustrating to drive than a manual when wheeling like I do (one example) in deep, heavy, wet snow. When I am frustrated when wheeling, it's not much fun. Every manual will frustrate you and make you want an auto. Steep sand dunes that need a shift during the climb are another. That's just two examples... I can list more and preference is important but for me practicality beats the snot out of having to move your left leg to enjoy "spirted driving". lol I ran a top loader four speed for 5 years in my Bronco and it was fun... but it couldn't match what my 4r did for a decade and what the 6r has been doing the past 2 1/2 yrs.. The top loader was a fun trans but definitely experienced it's drawbacks (not just a lack of low either) when wheeling. Torque converters are magic!

My local buddy's that have switched still have their testosterone and love their quick shifting manually operated when needed, autos. Just saying I might be more vocal about it here on this forum :) but they are sold and have told everyone that they'd never go back.


That would be pretty slick to have the output shaft of the TR changed to the std 6 bolt output of a Ford 4x4 design. Be a nice setup
I’m sorry, but I don’t understand.
What is snow? I think some fell on my house back in 1976.

Tee hee hee…
 

nvrstuk

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Just a Bronco driver for over 50 yrs!
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Got me there.... got super soft SAND close by (closest comparison)?? :)

Basically any time you have super high load or drag when you push in the clutch it's like hitting the pedal with hydroboost brakes as hard as you can... it really is almost that much drag. Then trying to use two hands to crank the wheel back and forth repeatedly you can't do it with one hand. Which means you can't be shifting and sliding sideways and cranking the wheel all at once. Tried it for decades.


Enjoy your sunshine! :) I just got back from snowmobiling yesterday... hard to decide which toy to take out on the snow.
 

1sicbronconut

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Bronco Guru
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Dec 26, 2006
Messages
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Got me there.... got super soft SAND close by (closest comparison)?? :)

Basically any time you have super high load or drag when you push in the clutch it's like hitting the pedal with hydroboost brakes as hard as you can... it really is almost that much drag. Then trying to use two hands to crank the wheel back and forth repeatedly you can't do it with one hand. Which means you can't be shifting and sliding sideways and cranking the wheel all at once. Tried it for decades.


Enjoy your sunshine! :) I just got back from snowmobiling yesterday... hard to decide which toy to take out on the snow.
Cool!! a good old EBML auto vs manual fight :)
 

nvrstuk

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Just a Bronco driver for over 50 yrs!
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Yeah, this ain't nothing compared to those threads!!
 
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