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Boat motor

joshua

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I found a really great deal on a rebuilt 302 But it was in a boat. I’m just concerned it will spin in the wrong direction. I know on some boats they would reverse the rotation. Out of single engine boat though. No clue if any 302s did. Is there anyway to tell? Or any other things that would give me fits? There is a 302 under the hood of the bronco right now.
 

DirtDonk

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If it’s got a distributor you could note the firing order and that might tell you.
Otherwise I’m not sure.
 

bronco t

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Do you have the starter motor from the boat engine that you could compare rotation to your stock 302?
 

Eoth

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Reverse rotation boat motors are fairly rare in the first place. Reverse rotation on a "single engine boat" is super extremely rare. If the seller knows that it came out of a single engine boat, he should be able to tell you which one... Easy research from there... While reverse rotation 302s exist, most of the Ford ones are 351s... Logic is that if you need two engines, they better be big...
Obviously if the engine is running or you can jog the starter you can just look at the rotation of the flywheel or the belts. Here is a good site...
https://bpi.ebasicpower.com/faq/rotate.htm
The only other way is to look at the starter gear. Here is a good explanation of what to look for...
https://arcomarine.com/pages/arco-correct-starter-rotation
I think you are pretty safe that it is a "standard rotation".
 

bmc69

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What Eoth said...reverse rotation engines are almost never found in single-engine boats. What you need to pay close attention to is the cooling method. If it was closed-system cooled, no worries. If, as many were, it was raw-water cooled, then check carefully for corrosion of heads, intake, block, timing cover etc. That's especially true if it was raw salt water cooled. If that was its history, I wouldn't touch it with a 10 foot pole.
 

Broncobowsher

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What BMC said.

Being a 302 it is likely too new. The reverse rotation was used a bunch on twin engine boats for counter rotating props, to cancel out the prop torque. There is overlap, but around 1970 they started making gear boxes that could run in reverse just as well as forward. Now the counter rotating props could be done in the transmission instead of the engine.

I have a reverse rotation small block ford in the corner of my garage right now. The number of parts needed is amazingly small. Cam, distributor gear, starter, flywheel. Flywheel is the biggest surprise, but the chamfer of where the starter gear goes the other way. Would probably work just fine the normal way. The distributor turns the normal direction. If you pull the distributor and look at the helix of the drive gear. If it is wrong from a normal gear, it is a backwards engine.

What brand was the engine boat drive? Eaton and Interceptor had reverse rotation outdrives. I don't think Mercruiser or OMC ever ran reverse rotation in this class of drive. Can't say anything about V-drive or pure inboard engines.

History lesson. The original 302 HO engine used in '82 for the Mustang was a regular 302 (even had the standard 2-barrel carburator) but had the marine cam in it. I worked with a guy that was at Ford at the time. They were discussing making a higher output engine (GM was coming out with the 3rd gen Camaro at the time) and one of the guys (I had his name at one time) told the suits they already have the parts in production. Just put the marine cam in. They listened, they did, and the 5.0 HO engine was born. With nothing more than a production marine cam into a standard 302. It evolved from there, but the start was just a boat part.
 
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joshua

joshua

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What BMC said.

Being a 302 it is likely too new. The reverse rotation was used a bunch on twin engine boats for counter rotating props, to cancel out the prop torque. There is overlap, but around 1970 they started making gear boxes that could run in reverse just as well as forward. Now the counter rotating props could be done in the transmission instead of the engine.

I have a reverse rotation small block ford in the corner of my garage right now. The number of parts needed is amazingly small. Cam, distributor gear, starter, flywheel. Flywheel is the biggest surprise, but the chamfer of where the starter gear goes the other way. Would probably work just fine the normal way. The distributor turns the normal direction. If you pull the distributor and look at the helix of the drive gear. If it is wrong from a normal gear, it is a backwards engine.

What brand was the engine boat drive? Eaton and Interceptor had reverse rotation outdrives. I don't think Mercruiser or OMC ever ran reverse rotation in this class of drive. Can't say anything about V-drive or pure inboard engines.

History lesson. The original 302 HO engine used in '82 for the Mustang was a regular 302 (even had the standard 2-barrel carburator) but had the marine cam in it. I worked with a guy that was at Ford at the time. They were discussing making a higher output engine (GM was coming out with the 3rd gen Camaro at the time) and one of the guys (I had his name at one time) told the suits they already have the parts in production. Just put the marine cam in. They listened, they did, and the 5.0 HO engine was born. With nothing more than a production marine cam into a standard 302. It evolved from there, but the start was just a boat part.
Glastron
 
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joshua

joshua

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And I figured it was rare. But it would be my luck
 
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joshua

joshua

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I have a different motor set up in mind. Just have no motor right now. But this guy inherited it from his father in law. I would only be paying 900 for it until I find all the pieces for the final swap. Motor I have now is junk. I’ll figure out how to become a contributor again and post some screenshots. I’m pretty sure it’s raw water cooled. But we have no salt water around here.
 

BanditBronco

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I have a 351 in my rig right now that was a boat motor, I ended up with it because a shop in town had the short block on a shelf already machined. My bet is that the cooling system will be rusty and have some scale in it. If you aren't planning on pulling it all the way apart, definitely hook a hose up to it and try and clean it out at high pressure best you can. If you are going to have the block machined, make sure they tank the whole thing. Check all the freeze plugs, honestly, I would just do them all while the engine is out and accessible. While you are cleaning it out, you will probably get a lot of yellow water, once it starts coming out clear you are good to go. I wouldn't be scared of it, a little more work but I haven't had any issues with mine because it was a boat motor.
 

jamesroney

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I found a really great deal on a rebuilt 302 But it was in a boat. I’m just concerned it will spin in the wrong direction. I know on some boats they would reverse the rotation. Out of single engine boat though. No clue if any 302s did. Is there anyway to tell? Or any other things that would give me fits? There is a 302 under the hood of the bronco right now.
1. remove the distributor cap.
2. rotate the crankshaft at the harmonic balancer in a Clockwise direction. (Tightening the bolt.)
3. Observe the distributor rotation.

Every Small Block Ford will turn counter clockwise at the distributor. EXCEPT reverse rotation marine engines.

It makes sense if you think about it. For commonality of parts, and so that Ford didn't have to invent a CW distributor and oil pump. (with a CW mechanical advance, and a CW vacuum advance, and backwards points.) Keeps the "backwards" parts count low.
 

71 CA Bronco

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What Eoth said...reverse rotation engines are almost never found in single-engine boats. What you need to pay close attention to is the cooling method. If it was closed-system cooled, no worries. If, as many were, it was raw-water cooled, then check carefully for corrosion of heads, intake, block, timing cover etc. That's especially true if it was raw salt water cooled. If that was its history, I wouldn't touch it with a 10 foot pole.
XX two here. If its been in salt water service run. I've been bit on that one before. It wasn't pretty.
 

Timmy390

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Raw water on cast iron equals internal rust and corrosion. I wouldn't pay a dime over scrap for it till it was taken apart and looked over.

JMO....

Tim
 

bmc69

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What BMC said.

Being a 302 it is likely too new. The reverse rotation was used a bunch on twin engine boats for counter rotating props, to cancel out the prop torque. There is overlap, but around 1970 they started making gear boxes that could run in reverse just as well as forward. Now the counter rotating props could be done in the transmission instead of the engine.
Reverse rotation Chrysler 318, 360 and 440 marine engines continued production in to the 80s, as did the Ford 351W and 460 engines sold by Commander. I don't recall seeing a reverse rotation 302 for a very long time...Waukesha made them from 70-74.

Since I've never encountered one, I can't say if the 302 crank has the wiper slits on the main bearing surface facing the opposite direction to those on standard rotation 302. Woe be unto anyone who tries to run one the opposite direction..LOL. Experienced that with a marine Ford 427 way back when....lesson learned..
 

Broncobowsher

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That is the boat maker. What drive did Glastron use in the boat?
Still 99% sure it is regular rotation. As mentioned above there are ways to check.
Being a fresh build, just ask what cam they put in. That will tell even more.
 
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joshua

joshua

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Well I shot from the hip and took a chance and bought that boat motor. The gentleman I bought it from inherited it from his father in law who had just passed in a motorcycle accident. All he knew is that it was rebuilt. Knew nothing on the parts or what was done. I took a chance at 500 bucks, bought it yesterday. I just wanted to throw something in it to make it move on its own. And figured I build something better later. Today I’m not so sure. After pulling a few pieces off, might have gotten a gem here. Check out a few pics. Lmk what you guys think. I’m thinking everything from the heads up is brand knew. Also anyway to tell if it’s a roller cam without pulling the intake? I kind of doubt that it is. Because the block has a glastron plate on it. But seeing the rockers makes me wonder. Also the intake might be a little to tall idk.
 

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DirtDonk

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Nice. Could be a lotta new stuff on there.
Roller rockers are a nice bonus but mean absolutely nothing about the cam itself.
Lots of engines have roller tip and full roller rockers and still use a flat tappet cam.
 
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joshua

joshua

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Nice. Could be a lotta new stuff on there.
Roller rockers are a nice bonus but mean absolutely nothing about the cam itself.
Lots of engines have roller tip and full roller rockers and still use a flat tappet cam.
Ya like I said it’s definitely the original block so I doubt it’s a true roller. Would like to know tho. I’m sure I will have to pull the intake to find out. Was just hoping there was trick where I didn’t have to. I’m going to change out the distributer anyway so no biggie, I’ll pull it then.
 
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