Lift Question - Does this look right?

[Gweiner]

Happy Friday everyone - time to start turning some wrenches!

While working on another project under the bronco, I noticed the the extended radius arm brackets appeared to have an extra set of bushings. I have been trying to get the steering dialed in since putting a WH 3.5" premiuim SL. I had the lift installed by a local shop with a good reputation for working on EB's but this looks odd to me. I have 7 degree c bushings, trac bar drop bracket, drop pitman, trac bar riser and an adj trac bar.

 

[Whoaa]

Oppps....

From the pic it looks like it has both the front and back old bushings, plus one new bushing in front

Do you have a better pic w/ better lighting?

Interestingly the castle nut appears to be in the right location, including the carter pin and just a few threads past the end of the nut

 

[Broncobowsher]

Looks like a built up drop bracket. The middle bushing looks to be metal and welded to the bracket. I don't know who's drop brackets those are, but that does look correct. Due to the different design it looks different than stock.

With the drop brackets and 7° bushing the U-joint angle of the front driveshaft at the differential is probably quite steep and will vibrate if spun at speed.

 

[Gweiner]

Heres another pic.

 

[savage]

I agree with Broncobowsher,the angle on that drive line is extreme. The drop on the brackets, seem extreme for a 3.5 inch lift. I have a 3.5 inch lift with duff adjustable drop brackets and the are not that extreme and the driveline angle is pretty good .You may want to go 4 degree c bushings, to bring the axle angle up more.

 

[savage]

The drop brackets look like WH.If you go to their web sit, it says ,Our nonadjustable radius arm drop brackets will allow 4" of drop over stock brackets. These weld on over the existing factory brackets. This is the least expensive way to gain proper caster on 5" or taller suspension lift.http://www.wildhorses4x4.com/product/Radius_Arm_Drop_Brackets

 

[Gweiner]

Thanks guys, good info. Thought these radius drop brackets were a bit overkill for a 3.5 " SL. Shop ordered em and put them on to get more caster. Better to grind them off and go back to stock location or just install 4 degree bushings? Not sure which is the better (proper) solution here. Truck is a road queen and really wont see much offroading.

 

[Broncobowsher]

Get your caster measuered now and see what it is. Once you know that you can make corrections. Keep in mind factory specs are very minimal for manual steering. Power steering works better with more.

 

[OX1]

Agree to have caster measured, but I would fix that DS angle just for the fact it looks horrible and you may some day want to use 4WD, if for even short periods (or you need to sell, which many say never, but that would be a big detriment if/when).

If you had approx 1 degree before lift (guessing from years of reading these boards), the extra drop of the 4" drop bracket vs 3.5 lift nets you another 2. Then add another 7 and you are most likely in the 10 degree range caster, unless your factory setup started with negative caster (possible, as some have found out).

10 is a little much usually, but more important is how does it drive? Tracks OK, steers OK in parking lots, wanders? If it drives great, I might consider leaving it. Or if you want to do "someting", slap some 4 degree bushings in and see how it is. That is the easiest way to back off on caster some and fix DS angle a bit, while not changing anything permanent, yet.

 

[Gweiner]

Here are some pics. Yes I have both trac bar riser and trac bar drop bracket (and drop pitman). Went on the recommendation from WH when I bought the premium 3.5" SL. My steering is "darty" and i am afraid to drive it padt 50mph. Have been tweaking nd trouble shooting for a while. I run KM2 33" x 10.5 on stock 5.5" wide steel wheels which probably doesnt help. Was thinking of buying wider aftermarket steel wheels and going to a less aggressive (KO) tire. May try less caster first but the extra bushings on tbe radius arms just look weird to me. Appreciate any advice from tbe gurus.

 

[savage]

The bracket for the trac bar is stock. I have a drop bracket on my 74, this is what it looks like. I think you have to much caster, between the radius arm drop brackets and the 7 degree c bushings. Gweiner , have you pushed on what you think is a extra bushing, on the arm drop brackets? I think it is a metal bushing and is part of the bracket, look at the post 6 and go to the sit and you will see the bracket with a metal bushing on it.

 

[Gweiner]

Thanks Savage. Will get an alignment and try some different c-bushings after measurement of tbe caster. Thinking i should remove the extra bushings in the radius arms too...

 

[savage]

Gweiner , have you pushed on what you think is a extra bushing, on the arm drop brackets? I think it is a metal bushing and is part of the bracket, look at post 6 and go to the sit and you will see the bracket with a metal bushing welded on them.Here's a pic from WH site.

 

[Gweiner]

I havent. Will check in the morning. Thanks again.

 

[DirtDonk]

Looks like you might also want to use the next lower hole in the riser. Not 100% sure of that, but you can tell by using a tape measure to compare the pivoting points (trackbar upper and lower to draglink upper and lower) to see if the bar is parallel.
With a bar that is not straight, you can't go by the angle of the bar itself. Rather you have to compare an imaginary straight line between the pivoting points to get your parallel angles.

In the pics, the uppers look closer to each other than the lowers do.

Paul

 

[DirtDonk]

Some reasons, other than caster, to go with radius arm drop brackets are spring bow and trackbar mount orientation.
When you use springs to lift, and C-bushings to correct caster, that's the most commonly accepted way, but you still have a tilting lower coil platform (the cups) in relation to the upper towers. Hence coils bowing out at the front. Shimming the lower cups is an option, but not one that has many makers of parts.
When you tilt the axle housing, you misalign the holes in the upper trackbar bracket to the eye of the bar. An adjustable trackbar is the easy solution to that, but not everyone goes that route.

The main disadvantage to radius arm drops is the loss of ground clearance. Which in the days of hard-wheeled Broncos, was a deal-breaker for more owners back then than it is now. Not as many EB's get used for off-roading as much as tooling around on the road.
Extra flex is a possibility too, but I don't remember ever hearing of anyone bring that up saying there was an issue they felt.

A real world worry though, is using max C-bushings PLUS an extra 4 degrees of bracket can very easily put the front pinion joint in a bind.
If your Bronco needs both big offsets in the bushings and drop brackets, then it's probably time to cut and rotate the steering yokes.

Paul

 

[Gweiner]

Update: I was finally able to drive it over and get the alignment adjusted and checked. Rides/tracks a little better but not sure if it as good as it can be. Alignment stats attached. Looks like 8 degrees of castor. Do I have too much castor with the radius arm drop brackets on? If so, which C bushings should I switch to (currently have 7 degree)? Hoping to avoid having to turn the knuckles because I have no idea what I am doing!

 

[Justafordguy]

I run with 8 degrees of caster and it tracks great and has very good return to center.

 

[DirtDonk]

that's a lot of cross-camber I would think. Not an alignment guru, but seems like that would at least make itself known somehow in the way it tracks.

why the '89 Bronco chart? That as far back as the computer would go?

Paul

 

[Gweiner]

Yes, that was as far back as they had in the computer Paul.