Results: 3.5 11 pack level remove leafs (Update Pics)

I'm posting some leveling results from my leaf removal today. I'm adding as much info as I think would be useful to others.

1977 3.5 11 pack devers. 6 degree shim plate. Duff 3.5 coils, single shocks and rubbers. Soft top/Duff plate rear bumper/tire carrier w/34/11 spare tire/jack. Stock front sway bar.

My truck never settled after a year. The rear was jacked up a bit. To the point of being really noticeable looking and driving. I removed the two smallest leafs from the 11 pack. Remember, I have the 6 degree plates which may account for a little more rear lift. Plates went back in.

The truck leveled perfect and a few other changes happened as a result. Even without degree plates, the level shouldn't be much different. Check your pinion angle and decide if you need them.

Inverted Y steering and wandering. The weight transfer to the rear helped this tremendously. While being ok at low speeds before, a bump at high speed was always unnerving. HUGE difference >>Letting off the gas or braking doesn't magnify the floaty feel like before. Drop pitman, no drop track bar bracket. Adjustable track bar.

Softer ride. My tailgate doesn't sound like its going to fall off hitting bumps at lower speeds. I do feel a bit more body roll as the rear is softer than before. I may just have got used to the stiff ride before.

Remove the whole pack from the truck to take out the leafs. A good vise is useful to clamp the leafs together, to get the bolt out and back in. Total time was about 4 hours.

In short, while trying to make my truck look better. I made it drive a lot better.

These are my results based on my combo. I wanted to put this on paper for others searching around for info, as I did. Hope this made sense or helps.


EDIT INFO: Bed/Back weight items,

Soft top
Standard 4 pt roll bar behind seat.
Heep fold tumble seat
Plate Duff bumper w/swinging tire mount w/16x7 285/75 (34x11.2) tire.
High lift jack.
15 lb tools
Empty box turtle shell? Who put that back there.

I removed the left leafs first, buttoned back up. Stood on bumper and jumped up and down. Left side soft. Right side even with tire/jack/carrier weight barely bounces up/down until I did this side. Bounces equal to left after removing rt leafs.

Before *Note* left of the concrete line is heading up hill. Illusion of the truck being level.

*On level ground the truck is level. This looks slightly saggy because driveway is sloped. Look close at the rear shock. Then look at the other pic. Here you can see the couple inches.
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***UPDATE 2 June 2014 added Wildhorses T conversion and few days later Duffs drop radius arm brackets.

Wildhorses T conversion clears at the tie rod the same as the stock tie rod did. So if a wheel fits your stock 76/77 Bronco, it will still fit with the WH T conversion. The truck still wanders and high speed is a no no.

* Drop Radius bracket cured the wander. I set them in the middle hole of the bracket. Happy as a clam now.
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Also, E150 2004/05/06 4.5 backspace 16x7 285/75-16 tires FIT a 1976/77 just fine.

Thanks for the write up!

Very helpful info right there....thanks!

Good information. I had the opposite problems with the same Deaver springs in 2.5". Threw them on and it initially sat level. Then with the weight of a 200lb cage, 200lb hardtop, and 200lbs carrier, they sag and now it squats. I had to add 3/4" lift blocks just to get it close to level again. Hopefully some more weight in the front with a new winch bumper will help balance it out.

Thanks I have the same issue and was curious. I have a brand new WH 3.5 set up which is tail high but I pulled the motor to redo the engine compartment and now it sits perfectly level. But when the motor goes back in I will have the same prob.

Nice write up. I did the exact same thing and pulled the lower 2.

I have not shimmed the spring perch yet with the 6 degree shims. Can I ask what trans and transfer case combo you have? Also what was your before and after pinion angle? I have a slight vibration over 60 and I am 99% sure I need those shims.

So you pulled the two small bottom leafs and it made the spring pack softer??

Alot of guys say to pull the 3rd leaf down to make it softer. I wouldnt think the bottoms would do that since there basically just like a lift block i thought.

iwas gona pull the 3rd down but ill have to thinnk about what you said now.

Maybe them bottom leafs dont allow the longer leafs above them to flex in a negative arch? Removing them allows the spring pack to compress as well as arch upwards??

I did the same but with the 4.5 lift springs.

It is pretty easy to do it with the springs still on the truck and a lot quicker. It took me about an hour.

I just supported the diff and then removed the u bolts. Then just use a G clamp either side on the last leaf that is staying on.

Thanks BRONKTN. Good info.
And good to add that you have the stock '77 steering still. LOTS of members are curious when they lift their '76's and '77's on how it's going to feel and steer.

Would you mind adding some further info to your first post too though? Add what general stuff you're carrying in the rear. Info like full cage, spare tire, bumper, back seat or not, big tank or not, that kind of stuff.
Might just make your post a full-on comparison for others.

Thanks

Paul

WorkerBee said:

,,,I have not shimmed the spring perch yet with the 6 degree shims. Can I ask what trans and transfer case combo you have? Also what was your before and after pinion angle? I have a slight vibration over 60 and I am 99% sure I need those shims.

Click to expand...

Sounds like you might, but a mismatched pinion angle (too high at least) will often lead to a felt vibration while accelerating as well. Do you feel any of that?

Once you're familiar with the layout too, you can easily eyeball your pinion angles to see if they're kosher or not. When you look straight through at your pinion and shaft from the side, what do they look like?
Is the pinion pointing above, below, or straight into the centerline of the driveshaft?

Paul

DirtDonk said:

Sounds like you might, but a mismatched pinion angle (too high at least) will often lead to a felt vibration while accelerating as well. Do you feel any of that?

Once you're familiar with the layout too, you can easily eyeball your pinion angles to see if they're kosher or not. When you look straight through at your pinion and shaft from the side, what do they look like?
Is the pinion pointing above, below, or straight into the centerline of the driveshaft?

Paul

Click to expand...

I did a quick and dirty measurement the other day and came up with about 10 degrees. I can see the mismatch with the naked eye. I am actually surprised I don't have more of an issue. It's kind of been on the back burner considering the tick that I have going on...for now, I just drive slow. Thanks Paul!

If your measurement was even close though, that 10° is at the very least shortening the life of your u-joints every time you drive it. Naturally, when you can actually feel a vibration, you're shortening it even more.

So I would correct it as soon as possible. Getting it just right can do wonders.
Optimal is roughly 1 - 2 degrees down. Some even like to do it at zero, but I don't. I prefer that 1-2 myself.
If you have a 4-link rear suspension or some very robust anti-wrap device back there, zero would work fine. But most of us experience quite a bit of pinion climb each and every time we accelerate even mildly. Hence the slight down-bubble settings I prefer.

Paul

WorkerBee said:

Can I ask what trans and transfer case combo you have? Also what was your before and after pinion angle? I have a slight vibration over 60 and I am 99% sure I need those shims.

Click to expand...

C4 Dana 20.

About -1.5 before. Now about -1.25

I'm measuring 34.5 length driveshaft. Center of end bearing cups. The cardon has a slight tilt, so maybe add .5 to length. This is a stock driveshaft.

UPDATE Addco Rear Sway bar.

I have the stock 77 front sway bar.

In a turn it was still a little goofy. I could slowly turn the wheel and then it seemed the wheels turned to far. I felt like the rearend was loose in the turns causing me over steer.

So, I put on the addco rear sway bar. Took me about two hours and had to drill four holes. Didn't interfere with anything once mounted.

Results, my rig sticks in the twisties. Huge difference and money well spent.

Great news!
Now we need pics!

Paul

I've got the same issue. Adding the 6 degree shim seems to have jacked up the rear enough to make it really noticeable in a hard stop. It has a noticeable rake too.
I have a 2.5" lift with an 11 leaf Deaver spring pack.
I'd like to remove leaves, but I don't think removing two adjacent leaves is a good idea. Each leaf is spaced to support the body of each longer spring. Removing two adjacent springs will leave the next larger spring unsupported for too much of its length.

I also agree with skipping a leaf when taking out 2 or more. I use Dever race pack for a Ford ranger and I took out the bottom spring and 3rd up. Usually the short springs don't make a big difference. Removing 2 will lower 1/2 in just for the thickness of the springs. On mine it lowered it 1inch. But I'm also extremely rear heavy compared to average EB.

When I had my old bronco, I removed the 3rd from top. That was good for about -1.25, I think. The bottom two were good for about -.5 total. As the springs settled in more, I ended up putting the 3rd from top back in to get the stance I wanted. Note that the hard top weight, or lack of a hard top makes a difference.

blubuckaroo said:

I've got the same issue. Adding the 6 degree shim seems to have jacked up the rear enough to make it really noticeable in a hard stop. It has a noticeable rake too

Click to expand...

Ditto for me.

Acceleration then the let off gas , my truck even got goofy feeling. Same motion as braking. I attribute it to body roll. I have progressive springs up front and that may make braking worse.

The front springs settled more than the rear and add the shim I was too tall in the rear to start, IMO. That's why I removed two small leafs. In hind sight I think I loosened the rear roll. Maybe the sway bar brought it back and then some.

If anyone anyone understands/has the cornering I describe, GET a rear bar. My truck handles great now,tight.

I took a pic or two of the new bar on but can't post them. Basically the bar mounts to the frame in front on the rear axle. The bar hump goes up toward the bed. The mount plate to the axle U bolt goes on the front left bolt on drivers side, the U bolt nut holds down the plate. Two holes in the plate. One for the U bolt and the other for the sway bar link. The sway bar link hole is forward of the U bolt hole. The plate faces the wheel. Link up your bar then raise up the the front part to mark your holes to drill. This way you can orientate the bar where the links are fairly 90degrees.

Hindsight , I might set the sway bar plate on top of the U bolt nut, then add a extra hold down nut. The kit came with two extra nuts that dont fit anything. I assume it for what I described.

I have a 3.5 lift minus two small leafs, but add shim plate. Bar fits fine.