best battery to buy?

[zombie66]

i want to buy two batteries for a dual setup. but i know that alot of people are disapointed with their optimas. overall is there a new or old brand of battery that has been the most dependable. and which kind (deep cycle, standard, etc.) for my application using a winch, lights, etc. thanks for any help!

 

[jarrod]

Get a standrad and a deep cycle IMO

 

[Kaw-Liga]

I sell Trojan and Deka deep cycle batteries at my boat shop, top of the line in the marine industry. Trojan makes flooded lead cell and agm(absorbed glass mat) while Deka only does the agm. Of course the agm would be better for the EB cause of vibration resistance, they are maintinance free and they are completely sealed(will never leak!) They also come in diff. sizes, 24,27,and 31...this just denotes their physical size, with larger size comes more room for more glass mat, more mat, the more potential to store energy, you get the point. Some trolling motors that I sell are so big that they need 2,3,even4 12volt batteries, and thats when you go to the big boy 31 agm batt. You should get good life~3-5years from one. For power to winch and lights, maybe air compressor, etc... I'd say go with a 27 or 31 at which you will spend~100$ and ~170$ respectively. Hope I helped!

Rob

 

[zombie66]

i will check out the local marine store. thanks for the advice about the agm. being better for the e.b.

 

[Kaw-Liga]

No prob., but this is not an area to skimp on, Boater's World may push a good deal at you, but I would never buy their house brand batt. same goes for everstart that wal-mart sells, go top of the line(trojan or deka) or don't go at all. Might as well buy a good product than waste your money several times on bad ones.

Rob

 

[RRRAAAYYY2]

Trojan is the leader in deep cycle stuff, good old maroon batteries. Deka is North america's biggest manufacturer still left in North America of both AGM and flooded batteries. They are part of East Penn (Die Hard, GoodYear, Harley, Ford, and about 15 other big names). We frequently replace Optimas with East Penn/Deka's 7000 series wet cells and they out last the Optima in the same application. (Deka seats the plates in a bed of epoxy to hold the plates and the plates have some new silver something or other coating).

I posted already on the other thread, but the Intimidator from Deka is a really good battery. I always call them the Cadillac of AGMs. If you can afford the Rolls Royce of AGM then check out an Odyessy PC1200. More money, but you get what you pay for. Here is a good comparission for the three batteries, they have the same foot print.
Red Tops 36-38lbs (the fact that this varies says quality control is gone)
Deka Intimidator 44lbs (6lbs more lead=more power and thicker plates)
Odyessy PC 1200 54lbs (that is 40% more lead by weight than an Optima)

 

[RRRAAAYYY2]

Everstart is a low end Excide battery, Excide is owned by Johnson Controls (the masters of buying American/Canadian companys and taking them off shore). Some other notable holdings of theirs are: Interstate, Optima, and really unfortunately Delphi.

 

[zombie66]

im thinking anout going with the deka battery from the replies. i had two excide oribital batteries that are a couple years old and built a dual battery tray with them as the working models. the fit in the stock battery location is a tight one at this point. is the deka batteries going to be alot bigger or roughly the same size? anyone know?

 

[RRRAAAYYY2]

They have the same foot print, i.e. they are a group 34/78 battery. Here are some links:
Hawker Odyessy: http://www.remybattery.com/ProductInfo.aspx?productid=PC1500DT
Deka (up in price now)
http://www.remybattery.com/ProductInfo.aspx?productid=9A78DT
here is another:
http://www.autobarn.net/eas9a78dt.html

Might bug Remy Battery and remind them that this website has bought a lot of batteries off of them, might cut you some slack.

 

[SaddleUp]

They have the same foot print, i.e. they are a group 34/78 battery. Here are some links:
Hawker Odyessy: http://www.remybattery.com/ProductInfo.aspx?productid=PC1500DT
Deka (up in price now)
http://www.remybattery.com/ProductInfo.aspx?productid=9A78DT
here is another:
http://www.autobarn.net/eas9a78dt.html

Might bug Remy Battery and remind them that this website has bought a lot of batteries off of them, might cut you some slack.

If I recall right (It's been several years) the Group 34 is more or less just a shorter group 24. Is that correct? We use to build and sell more group 24's than any others which probably gives you an idea of how long ago that was.

Or maybe they are identical with the only difference being the side hold down?

 

[Apogee]

DEKA (East Penn Mfg) Intimidator...best value IMO but hard to get on the West Coast.

Hawker Odyssey...best performance and longest life but spendy

Optima...proven performance but possibly not as good a quality as in the past.

Exide...wouldn't ever buy one of their batteries. Junk IMO.

 

[RRRAAAYYY2]

If I recall right (It's been several years) the Group 34 is more or less just a shorter group 24. Is that correct? We use to build and sell more group 24's than any others which probably gives you an idea of how long ago that was.

Or maybe they are identical with the only difference being the side hold down?

You are right, they are basically the same except for the height. The group 24's are 1/4 longer and 1.88" taller, and 1/8" narrower. The group 24 also comes with the posts on either side. i.e. you can get it + and - or - and +.

Other common ways to tell them apart, the group 24 is primarily a Ford vehicle battery, as well as a lot of Industrial applications pre 1980 (guessing at date). The group 34 is a GM vehicle battery.

 

[SaddleUp]

You are right, they are basically the same except for the height. The group 24's are 1/4 longer and 1.88" taller, and 1/8" narrower. The group 24 also comes with the posts on either side. i.e. you can get it + and - or - and +.

Other common ways to tell them apart, the group 24 is primarily a Ford vehicle battery, as well as a lot of Industrial applications pre 1980 (guessing at date). The group 34 is a GM vehicle battery.

In addition to 24F's we also did 27F's. I do recall that The 24F and 27F were because Ford put the battery on the opposite side and reversing the posts keeps the positive terminal away from he fender. I only built them for about a year (It was a 3 way family partnership) and then we all kind of got nervous working around so much lead all of the time so we got out of that business.

sandhorse, Sorry about going off in an odd direction here. Just remembering times long past is all. Getting back on topic RRRAAAYYY2 will steer you in the right direction. I plan to take his advice on battery choices when I replace mine. I just need to find a local supplier for them is all. (I want to get them locally)

 

[SaddleUp]

Get a standrad and a deep cycle IMO

I would avoid getting one standard and one deep cycle. The charging rates on each one are different which will result in either one being undercharged or one being overcharged. (Or perhaps both at the same time) For that matter I would avoid getting 2 different batteries even if they have identical specifications. I.E. I would get two identical batteries and I would buy them both at the same time.

 

[RRRAAAYYY2]

Good call Saddleup, I thought I had mentioned that already, but it was on the other thread, so I am glad you spoke up.

When purchasing two batteries or any group of batteries you should make sure they all have the same manufacturer, same date of production, and are within 1/100 of a volt of each other. i.e. one can be 12.72 and the other 12.73 on a volt meter.

Never mix and match unless you are using an isolater. I have also seen not too many problems if the batteries are along ways away from each other. i.e. Deep Cycle in the trunk is lastng a few years. (side by side, I would give them less than a year). But it is still not a perfect way of doing it. Hawker Odyessy have both high crank power and superb deep cycle capabilities. So if you need both, speed the money on the Hawkers.

Guys doing EV racing will normally order a skid of batteries even though they may only need 28. Then go through with a multimeter and check them to the thousandths of volt. i.e. 12.721 to 12.729, picking the 28 that are the closest. Then send back the remainder of the batteries. Most battery companies are onboard with this, some will even do it for you. The closer they are to being the same, can make a couple of years difference in how they last.

 

[zombie66]

rrraaayyy2,
i love all the descriptions of each batteries size and function. im trying to let this all sink in, so your saying that side by side they will loose their strength in less than a year? would it be better if one was in the stock location and the other was on the other side of my radiator? i just want to do this once and right. thanks for chipping in everyone!

 

[RRRAAAYYY2]

If they are the same battery it doesnt matter. I was referring to when you have two dissimilar batteries, they need to be far apart. An example would be late model Ford vans with one group 65 and then another group ?? (cant remember) behind the seat. Though the group 65 seems to fail 3 times more often than the other one. But it is an example of OE manufacturers doing it.

Bottomline is if you have two nearly identical batteries, you will have the best possible chance of getting long life and top performance from them.

 

[zombie66]

i understand, thank you.

 

[jarrod]

My bad. Now I know thanks.

 

[RRRAAAYYY2]

My bad. Now I know thanks.

I wouldnt get worked up over it, Ford does in late 90's vans. There are a ton of websites that would recommend it as well. I have been in the auto electric field for almost 30 years (on and off, my family's business is a lot like Orange County Choppers).

It wasnt until I started racing EV's and hanging out on the net with those guys that I learned a lot about batteries and their role in the charging system. That is a lot of tech seminars with OE spooned feed information, that could have been better. Education in my industry really, really sucks. There is tons of conflicting information, and really no authoritive bible so to speak. Especially not one in a common language that the average person can understand.