is there a big difference between 351W and 351C?

[eddie]

i wanted to know what is the difference between the 351 clevelend and 351 windsor? which is more reliable or better in one word? which has better p.s.i? any help will be appreciative? thank you. i have an eye on a beautiful bronco , it comes with a cleveland on it. i need some help.

 

[Unregistered]

351W is a small block ... essentially a 302 with a taller deck for increased stroke. This is a Low RPM Torquer.

351C is a big block. It's built for Horsepower ... a high RPM Screamer.

 

[Dusty]

351C is NOT a big block. Its considerably smaller than a big block (429/460). It has a small block bellhousing pattern. Its taller decked brothers in the Cleveland family, 351M and 400, have big block bellhousing patterns but they aren't considered big blocks either. It has some similarities to both the small block family and the big blocks, but it is a separate family of engines.

To put my $.02 in on the original question, I like both and both can be made to work well in an EB. A Cleveland is harder to do because of certain fitment issues and if you want to go EFI you would have to homebrew something or go TBI. Windsors are more "drop-in" ready, as almost a direct bolt-in swap for a 302. If you favor mud bogs, sand dunes or other high RPM endeavors, the Cleveland is the hands-down winner. If you favor slower speed crawling, the Windsor would probably be the optimum choice. Although, either can be built to perform well in any conditions. Since you're looking at a rig with a C already in it, I say go for it and have fun. There are a few Cleveland fans in this forum who can help with any tech issues you have.

Dusty

 

[tabascom16]

They are both small...or mid-sized blocks depending on how you want to look at them...extended decks. From what I can remember being told clevelands were more a high performance engine and had 4 valve cylinder heads. I have also heard that clevelands have oiling problems especially if running at high rpms constantly. Clevelands are also harder to find parts for. There is so much aftermarket stuff for a 351 windsor its probalby the enginer of choice. You can make one hot 351 windsor if you want to. For the reasons of flexibility in parts and upgrades on the engine, and the problems with the cleveland oiling system or maybe cooling system the 351 Windsor is probably your best bet. The cleveland will probalby not be do daily driver friendly. Some of this facts could be wrong, depending on the loyalty and expertise and others, but thats just what I've heard over the years from other guys.

 

[66roadhorse]

The cleveland is wider and taller and heavier. It also has huge ports on the heads. It did not have 4 valve heads. It had 3 different configuration of heads that were dependent on the model and carb, hence the 2v and 4v designation.

As far as which one is better? That is really up to you. Both can be made to make alot of power. You can be at 500 hp with basically a stock head with a cleveland, expect to spend several grand on a windsor to do that. As far as the torque issue, chances are that this is a 2v cleveland so low end is not really an issue. Oiling is a non issue also unless you are running at 6500+ rpms, for extended periods.

Hope I have helped, I have lots of info on both, heck I have a 400 hp cleveland sitting on a stand right now and know of a guy on the vintage mustang forum who is at @475 hp at the rear wheels with a streetable clevleand. Let me know if you have any questions.

 

[68beast]

With a cleaveland, parts availability is definitely an issue. If it runs okay than u wont have a problem. The oiling comment made above, which really doesnt apply to a DD can be easily solved with oil restrictors made by moroso, as long as you dont have hydraulic lifters. There are two types of clevelands, 4 and 2 barrel. The 2 barrel makes beater torque while 4 barrel makes higher horsepower. To id which heads it has just look for a two or 4 cast in the front corner by the valve covers. I just rebuilt my 351c and the only parts i had a really hard time finding were a timing cover and oil pickup. It sucks a$$ when u go to Kragen and they try and tell u theres nothin in their computers for a 351c. I say go for it, but im biased cause i have one.

 

[76Broncofromhell]

I've done an SEFI system on a '73 Pantera with my dad. Let me tell you it was a pain in the ass. But for your knowledge, it can be done. Apparently, now there are adapter plates to put a 5.0 upper intake onto a Cleveland head, but it will require some searching. A Cleveland can be made a torque motor, it really depends on the cam and head selection you choose

 

[Madgyver]

I'm not bias in this case. I like both motors and run both motors I raced the Cleveland HARD in my 71Torino back in the 90s and it ran really good in a heavy car with a 4sp T-loader. Used it to get groceries and take my young ones and their cousins to school. It can be built to whatever you want it to do low rpm torque or high rpm horsepower. I've put up a page for issues with putting the 351C in an EB. Pictures are gathered from members here. I'll be putting a 351C4V one of my 77s soon for the hell of it. It just so happens I have all the parts to do it.

The windsor is easier to install with more parts available. It can also be made to run both ways, low rpm torque or high rpm horsepower.

Here is a picture of the windsor;

Between the two parts will not interchange, They are two different animals. Here is a picture of one of my Clevelands

 

[cjjhalfcab]

Don't sweat the oiling issue, the area that Clevelands have the so-called oiling problems is an area where even the Windsors would have to have mods to live -- 6500+ sustained RPMs will kill any stock-oiler in time. As was said before; the biggest hassle with the Cleveland in an EB is initially getting all of the "hook up" bugs worked out. Since yours has already been done, I wouldn't hesitate to snatch it.

 

[TexasBronco]

I have a C. It was in my Bronco when I bought it and i am currently rebuilding it. I like it.