Hi bad 68, what is the voltage of your YellowTop when it goes into storage for 30-45 days? You also mentioned your batteries in the plural form, so would it be correct to assume you are running a dual setup? If that is the case, dual batteries in parallel configurations should always be the same type, size and age.
RRRAAAYYY2, we haven’t omitted mentioning our continued use of 99.99% virgin lead in any of our literature, although we don’t always mention every feature of our batteries in every ad or document we create.
Here is a link to the actual patent- http://www.google.com/patents?id=t7...urce=gbs_overview_r&cad=0#v=onepage&q&f=false Gates later sold Optima to Gylling, who then sold Optima to JCI in 2000. Hopefully, that will clear up the confusion you might have on that issue.
Do you still happen to have any of the YellowTops with the questionable weight? We occasionally hear stories from folks who claim a difference in weight, but we’re still searching for the batteries attached to these stories. Without them, there’s not much we can do to further investigate those stories, other than to state that YellowTops have never had a weight reduction.
I understand your concerns about gel vs. AGM batteries, as we also share them. Unfortunately, you are asking me about a timeframe that pre-dates JCI’s ownership of Optima. I would say that the science of the two technologies hasn’t changed, in that it has always been harmful to treat AGM batteries like gel batteries. With that being the case, I can’t imagine any manufacturers intentionally wanting to confuse consumers in that regard. Is this timeframe of 15-20 years ago the same timeframe in which you were dealing with the YellowTops?
As for the increase in CCA ratings with the RedTop, I didn’t claim that the increase in cranking amps was equated to an increase in quality. I did state that the performance specs have increased and cited those numbers (650CCA then vs. 800CCA now) as an example. I suppose a correlation could be made between the increase in cranking amps and an increase in quality, but I would probably prefer to cite the use of modern tools, material efficiency, a state-of-the-art production process or continually improving warranty return rates as more appropriate barometers of quality.
It’s important to remember that the original Optima batteries were designed in the 1970s, before CAD. Current RedTops were designed with extensive testing and modeling, using state of the art equipment. Taking nearly any design from the 1970s, one can use modern tools to achieve a material efficiency improvement of less than 5% with no performance loss. Look what a small block Chevy can do today, compared to 35 years ago. This also assumes manufacturing was held constant during this time, which is not the case. The batteries we manufacture now are rarely touched by human hands during the assembly process, which has dramatically decreased variability and dramatically increased consistency and quality.
I’m glad ransil went through the trouble to weigh and photograph his battery. I decided his effort was worth duplicating, so I weighed the 34/78 RedTop out of my pickup truck (it is date-stamped from early-2008).
As Paul mentioned, the 34/78 is the equivalent battery to the 800U, which stood for “Universal,” due to the dual post configuration. As Paul indicated, even digital bathroom scales aren’t exactly known for precision measurement. Mine suggested I lost two pounds, just by carrying the scale downstairs to my garage. I did weigh the RedTop several times and it weighed as little as 40.4 lbs. and as much as 40.8 lbs. My battery no longer has it's strap, but 40.6 lbs. seemed to be the most consistent weight and this battery has a specified minimum weight 38.8 lbs.
Even though this might seem to indicate that our current batteries weigh more than they previously did, I would suggest the variation and inconsistency in the scales would make any weight difference negligible.
Jim McIlvaine
eCare Manager, OPTIMA Batteries, Inc.
www.facebook.com/optimabatteries
RRRAAAYYY2, we haven’t omitted mentioning our continued use of 99.99% virgin lead in any of our literature, although we don’t always mention every feature of our batteries in every ad or document we create.
Here is a link to the actual patent- http://www.google.com/patents?id=t7...urce=gbs_overview_r&cad=0#v=onepage&q&f=false Gates later sold Optima to Gylling, who then sold Optima to JCI in 2000. Hopefully, that will clear up the confusion you might have on that issue.
Do you still happen to have any of the YellowTops with the questionable weight? We occasionally hear stories from folks who claim a difference in weight, but we’re still searching for the batteries attached to these stories. Without them, there’s not much we can do to further investigate those stories, other than to state that YellowTops have never had a weight reduction.
I understand your concerns about gel vs. AGM batteries, as we also share them. Unfortunately, you are asking me about a timeframe that pre-dates JCI’s ownership of Optima. I would say that the science of the two technologies hasn’t changed, in that it has always been harmful to treat AGM batteries like gel batteries. With that being the case, I can’t imagine any manufacturers intentionally wanting to confuse consumers in that regard. Is this timeframe of 15-20 years ago the same timeframe in which you were dealing with the YellowTops?
As for the increase in CCA ratings with the RedTop, I didn’t claim that the increase in cranking amps was equated to an increase in quality. I did state that the performance specs have increased and cited those numbers (650CCA then vs. 800CCA now) as an example. I suppose a correlation could be made between the increase in cranking amps and an increase in quality, but I would probably prefer to cite the use of modern tools, material efficiency, a state-of-the-art production process or continually improving warranty return rates as more appropriate barometers of quality.
It’s important to remember that the original Optima batteries were designed in the 1970s, before CAD. Current RedTops were designed with extensive testing and modeling, using state of the art equipment. Taking nearly any design from the 1970s, one can use modern tools to achieve a material efficiency improvement of less than 5% with no performance loss. Look what a small block Chevy can do today, compared to 35 years ago. This also assumes manufacturing was held constant during this time, which is not the case. The batteries we manufacture now are rarely touched by human hands during the assembly process, which has dramatically decreased variability and dramatically increased consistency and quality.
I’m glad ransil went through the trouble to weigh and photograph his battery. I decided his effort was worth duplicating, so I weighed the 34/78 RedTop out of my pickup truck (it is date-stamped from early-2008).
As Paul mentioned, the 34/78 is the equivalent battery to the 800U, which stood for “Universal,” due to the dual post configuration. As Paul indicated, even digital bathroom scales aren’t exactly known for precision measurement. Mine suggested I lost two pounds, just by carrying the scale downstairs to my garage. I did weigh the RedTop several times and it weighed as little as 40.4 lbs. and as much as 40.8 lbs. My battery no longer has it's strap, but 40.6 lbs. seemed to be the most consistent weight and this battery has a specified minimum weight 38.8 lbs.
Even though this might seem to indicate that our current batteries weigh more than they previously did, I would suggest the variation and inconsistency in the scales would make any weight difference negligible.
Jim McIlvaine
eCare Manager, OPTIMA Batteries, Inc.
www.facebook.com/optimabatteries
Seems like I spent way too much of my engineering career Unf###ing others f### ups.
