Update Axle housing end sleeveable or do you have to replace?

Timmy390 · May 20, 2012

My 74 Bronco is in parts all over the shop to address a few issues I’ve been putting off for sometime now. I posted some months back abut my axle housing ends being “oblonged”. They started giving me trouble again so it’s time to fix it for good. While it’s apart, it’s getting 4:11 gears and a Trac Lok to replace the 3:50/open but that’s a different topic.

With much research I’ve come to the conclusion I have 66-75 STD Duty (Large Bearing, Large Brake) Bearing size 3.150 Brake size 11x 1 3/4 Axle length PS 29.250 DS 26.937 Axle flange 3 1/2 x 2 3/8 x 1/2

Now for the questions.

1. Can the axle housing ends be machined and sleeved like cylinders in an engine block?
2. When looking for housing ends, do I have to worry about axle tube ID/OD or are all Ford 9 axle tubes the same?
3. Anyone ever bought these? http://www.ebay.com/itm/9-Inch-Big-...Parts_Accessories&hash=item5649d387d3&vxp=mtr
4. What is the axle tube ID on a 74 STD duty large bearing Bronco?
5. Does anyone know what the axle end tolerance should be in relation to the axle bearing size. If axle bearings are 3.150 how much bigger (in thousands) should the ends be to accept the bearings to insure a nice snug no spin fit.

Tim

73azbronco · May 20, 2012

For that much trouble and work, you may want to check out currie and buy some axle tubes.

This may not tbe the exact one you need, but for $450, you get the idea.

http://www.currieenterprises.com/cestore/productsRE.aspx?id=1573

Or, start craisgslisting for busted axles with good housings.

misterkeebler · May 20, 2012

By the time you buy the tubes and pay to have it retubed you may as well buy the currie housing which is a direct bolt in and has larger diameter tubes and you won't have to worry about bending the factory housing later on. There is something to be said for turn around time and leg work also. Housing ends by themselves are almost a hundo iirc. If you retube your axle you will have to set up your spring perches too. Since you are asking the question I am assuming (correct me if I'm wrong) you won't be doing the work yourself, unless you know someone that can do it for a decent price the currie housing is probably the best choice in my opinion everything taken into consideration

Broncobowsher · May 20, 2012

Doable, probably.
Good idea, probably not.
If this was a rare axle and it had to be done, it could. But you are looking at big time machine shop bills as this is a real odd and custom job. The sleeve you talk about is not an off the shelf part, it would be a custom part fabed in house.

They do make replacment housing ends. But getting them installed square and true without the proper jig work is difficult. Makes the idea of a new HD housing look pretty good. Probably cheaper then sourcing the parts and getting them swapped onto your existing housing. And you get a better housing out of it as well.

Apogee · May 20, 2012

New housing ends run $75/pair and up. Strange is the cheapest, followed by Currie then Moser. Proper installation with an alignment bar of said ends tends to run about $120 to $200 labor depending on who does it, whether you drop off a bare housing or one with a differential, etc. Stick with reputable shops who either build, narrow or modify housings all of the time and have the tools to do it right as you probably won't know it's been done wrong until it keeps eating axle bearings. Alternatively, buy a new or good used housing. I wouldn't even think to retube a Ford 9" given it's design and the amount of work that would take...it's not like it's a D44/60/70/80 with tubes pressed and plug welded into a cast center section, it's a fabricated housing.

As for tolerances, really? If you are a machinist and have a lathe large enough to spin a Ford 9" housing, I would th ink that you wouldn't be asking these questions, however most housing ends I've measured have been about .002 inches larger than the bearing, so a relatively snug slip fit assuming decent roundness. The bearing is ground 52100 steel, so you can be fairly confident in it's size and roundness.

Timmy390 · May 20, 2012

Thanks for the suggestions. I guess I'm just trying to keep the cost as low as possible. Right now every dollar counts so I'm looking at every option on the table.

A new housing after shipping is $500 plus depending on where you buy it from.

A used housing (can't find one local and I've been looking for some time now) is $400 shipped in and there is a chance it's no better than what I have.

I got a quote of $350 to replace the ends from the only place that I can find local that does that kind of work.

Jig (alignment bar and pucks) to do the job myself is $500 plus and that's not including shipping or the ends. I ask about the tube ID because the ends come in different sizes to fit different tubes (so I've read)

Machine shop quoted $300 over the phone to sleeve the ends but I've never heard of anyone doing that before. Seems like it would work but at the same time if it were that easy, why hasn't anyone done it before.

Might talk to them about making me an alignment bar and some pucks while I'm there. See what that costs.

Tim

Apogee · May 21, 2012

You might add your location to your user profile so that we know where you are, because you never know, some guy on here might live down the street and have three decent housings in his garage. There is a "Wanted" section in the classifieds forum, have you posted there? If you truly want to test all of your options, I would definitely give that a try.

Timmy390 · May 21, 2012

Apogee said:
You might add your location to your user profile so that we know where you are, because you never know, some guy on here might live down the street and have three decent housings in his garage.

Good call.....Done

Tim

Bronchole · May 21, 2012

If you go the rout of haveing new ends put on to a housing then you may consider getting a newer housing (80's Bronco or F150) and having the ends put on that. You would still have to have the spring purches replaced though. At $350 to put new ends on I would be looking pretty hard at that Currie housing though. I think I paid $150 to have my ends replaced (on an 85 Bronco housing).

Timmy390 · May 24, 2012

Well after bouncing ideas around and pricing all the options, I went the "sleeve" route. Housing was dropped off at the machine shop yesterday afternoon. Hoping to have it back today or Friday at the latest. $300 was the cheapest way to go. Also found out it's the labor rate that puts the price so high. $70 an hour is the minimum quote I got.

Thanks for all the suggestions and advice on this.

Tim

Timmy390 · May 29, 2012

Win some lose some. Machine shop called today and said the housing is warpped just enough they can't spin it and get a good cut for the sleve.

So I'm going to attempt the repair myself.

Plan to buy the ends, set the third member in the housing, take mesurments, cut one end off, use the axles with bearing installed as my alignment bar to position the housing end. Going to plug weld it change to the other side and do the same thing. Once I verify all the mesurments, install the axles bolting them up and then do a full weld on the ends.

If it works I'm golden, if not, looks like I'm buying new.

Tim

nvrstuk · May 29, 2012

I think you'll be buying new.

I just finished welding new Currie ends on a P/U housing I just narrowed. It was/is a lot of work to keep the housing true. This was with a jig.

My old H/D '77 housing was bent bad. The "new" pickup housing was bent enough that it took me about 2 hours to get it straight enough so I could weld the ends on.

Good to go now. Works great.

BTW, it takes about 1 1/2" of weld close to the flanges to warp the housing.

Broncobowsher · May 29, 2012

Don't weld the ends on with the axles in place. The heat will kill the bearings.

Bronchole · May 30, 2012

Don't be afraid to use your eye to judge how concentric the circles along the path are. Your eye can detect this down to a pretty good resolution. Basically if its not concentric by eye, then you got some more work to do. If it looks concentric, you are getting pretty close.

Timmy390 · May 30, 2012

Broncobowsher said:
Don't weld the ends on with the axles in place. The heat will kill the bearings.

Good advice. I'm changing the bearing anyway while I have it all taken apart so they'll be the sacrificial lambs on this project.

Tim

nvrstuk · May 30, 2012

My .02 is I want it closer than eyeballing. I'm within a couple thousandths of an inch right now. Speaking from the experience of having wheel/tire/bearing/axle assemblies walk out of the housing at 50mph you can't be safe enough doing this the correct way. I replaced 1 brg on one side and one on the other during one 6 week camping trip. I replaced the axle housing right after that trip. Pretty obvious that something was wrong and hard to replace when you're 1500 miles from home.

I've scrapped out 4 Broncos that rolled or crashed due to rear axle brg failure (back in the '80's). It's real obvious what the cause is when the Bronco gets towed to the shop and the axle/wheel assbly comes in on the back seat... :-[

Just saying, be careful as nothing holds the tire combo to your vehicle except the pressed on brg and retainer...no bolts or clips. Brg gets hot, axle breaks and you're day is over.

Kinda long but...

Bronchole · May 31, 2012

I would agree that you want it pretty close, my point was that if you can see it is out of whack by eye, you got some more work to do. Personally I can easily see (by eye) about 0.015" pretty easily in a configuration like this.

Timmy390 · May 31, 2012

I gave it the eyeball yesterday and it "looked" good. I also took several mesurments and everything came up square so maybe it's not off by that much. I know right, inches and it needs to be thousands but had to start some place.

I've read so much about people doing just what I'm doing that my eyes are bleeding. the only difference I can see is they all use a jig that consists of a hardend steel rod and alum pucks for the bearing and I'm using the bearings themselves as pucks and the axles and housing as the steel rod. Welding is not a problem. I got that covered.

I ordered the ends yesterday afternoon along with my 4.11's and a trac-lok rebuild clutch kit. Once it all gets in I'll start this project. I'll take some pic (hope to anyway)as I go and keep you posted. Waiting on USPS is such a downer..........

Tim

nvrstuk · May 31, 2012

The key to accuracy here is one long rod which is going thru the diff case brg bores, not two individual axle shafts to check for alignment.

If you're getting new axle flange ends then you're good to go because they can be offset quite a bit to aid perfect alignment.

Timmy390 · Jun 7, 2012

Well, I started replacing the ends today and ran into the first issue. After welding the housing (using the shock mounts) to the arms of a two post car lift to keep it rock solid and level during the process, we took measurments, cut the first end off and run into the issue. Only once the end was off did we find the end's I ordered will not fit in the axle tubes. To be honest i was worried about that and was hoping they would fit.

Taking them to the machine shop tomorrow to get them turned down to the right size. Good thing they're "beefy" and can be turned down to fit. I was shocked to see just how thin the originals were. I've got pic's and will post them once we finish the process.

Tim

Update Axle housing end sleeveable or do you have to replace?

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