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High RPMs when coming to a stop.

WSM29

Sr. Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2010
Messages
371
So I have an NV3550 and the new 5.0 EFI. Used the A9P. I heard of guys needing the VSS sensor when using autos, but with adding a VSS to the RJM harness fix the high idle when coming to a stop? Don't wanna spend the money if there is another way to fix it. Thanks!
 

ScanmanSteven

Bronco Guru
Joined
Dec 19, 2010
Messages
1,129
My guess it's not the vss causing the problem. Does it idle okay otherwise? Sounds like it could be the IAC, which controls the idle, might be sticking.
 
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WSM29

WSM29

Sr. Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2010
Messages
371
I put all new sensors on it during the build. I know now a days new doesn't always mean it's good! I'll check into it. Some research I found talked about a neurtral switch? I don't think I ever hooked one of those up. Unless it's part of the RJM harness...
 
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WSM29

WSM29

Sr. Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2010
Messages
371
It seems to want to delay throttle response the first time you give it gas when it's in neutral, but once i put it in gear it's ready to run...
 
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WSM29

WSM29

Sr. Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2010
Messages
371
Haven't done anything with the TPS. I'll have to read up on that.
 

Broncobowsher

Total hack
Joined
Jun 4, 2002
Messages
34,944
Also check to see if the IAC is installed backwards. They are directional in function, but can be installed backwards (and sometimes done so for clearance, there are proper fixes).
 
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WSM29

WSM29

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Mar 29, 2010
Messages
371
I think it is on the right way. I remember looking at the diagram that came with the BC Broncos throttle cable. I am running a mustang engine with an explorer lower and upper gt40. I retained the mustang TB and MAF... But can't remember what IAC I used. Should it matter if it's for a mustang or explorer? Great info so far guys! Gonna check into some of this today if it warms up a bit...
 

roundhouse

Bronco Guru
Joined
Sep 5, 2003
Messages
2,886
Mine does that And when you shift gears it holds the engine speed high and it slowly drifts back down to idle
Takes about 10 seconds for it to get back down

Made it Un driveable and dangerous , take your foot off the gas and it keeps wantin to go

I never could solve it
New TPS new IAC. Etc

I just ran a switch to cut the power wire to the IAC
So I can switch it on for cold starts and then As soon as I start driving I switch it off

Works for me and I like the instant drop when you take your foot off the gas
 
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WSM29

WSM29

Sr. Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2010
Messages
371
Mine does that And when you shift gears it holds the engine speed high and it slowly drifts back down to idle
Takes about 10 seconds for it to get back down

Made it Un driveable and dangerous , take your foot off the gas and it keeps wantin to go

I never could solve it
New TPS new IAC. Etc

I just ran a switch to cut the power wire to the IAC
So I can switch it on for cold starts and then As soon as I start driving I switch it off

Works for me and I like the instant drop when you take your foot off the gas



That is interesting. I actually unhooked the IAC and gave the throttle a few pulls... No troubles at all.. Throttle response was quick and it died down like it was supposed to. Are there any concerns with not running the IAC during normal driving? Was it only made to help with cold starts?
 

roundhouse

Bronco Guru
Joined
Sep 5, 2003
Messages
2,886
That is interesting. I actually unhooked the IAC and gave the throttle a few pulls... No troubles at all.. Throttle response was quick and it died down like it was supposed to. Are there any concerns with not running the IAC during normal driving? Was it only made to help with cold starts?

I've not had any issues with the IAC unplugged
Except when you first crank it on a cold day
 

Broncobowsher

Total hack
Joined
Jun 4, 2002
Messages
34,944
If the engine will run with the IAC unplugged, the base throttle opening is too much.
Your "fix" is what is creating the problem in the first place. They work just fine in stock configuration. It's only after people go in and make things better that they turn out worse.
 

roundhouse

Bronco Guru
Joined
Sep 5, 2003
Messages
2,886
Works fine as long as the iac is unplugged

I can maybe upload a video showing how it takes 6-8 seconds to return to idle after you take your foot off the gas pedal

It drops instantly if it's plugged in , revving and I unplug It
So there is no problem with the operation of the iac
Itself
It's obviously the computer , which has been swapped
So apparently both computers are bad or it's some emission crap that can't be undone


So y'all are telling me It shouldn't even idle with it unplugged ?

So what's the adjustment screw on the throttle body for ?
 
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WSM29

WSM29

Sr. Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2010
Messages
371
Mine will also run fine with it unplugged... Awesome throttle response and no hang up... I guess I'm looking for the reasons not to do as roundhouse did... Switch in the cab for cold starts and then shut it off while driving..
 

EFI Guy

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Loc.
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If it runs fine with the IAC unplugged there is too much air entering the engine. It should stumble along at VERY low rpms if it runs at all. The extra air can be from a throttle body open too far, a vacuum leak, or a PCV system hooked up wrong.

The hanging idle is caused by the dashpot function in the PCM software. It is used to keep the engine from stalling on decel. It should hold idle speed just a tad higher for a couple of seconds when you let off the throttle. Like a dashpot on a carb would.

I'm going to use random numbers for this explanation, only to keep math easy because I'm tired and have a headache.

The PCM is programmed to run at 1 lb per minute at idle speed.

Without the IAC working, .5 lbs per minute flow through the throttle body and PCV valve. This value is also programmed in to the PCM.

The PCM knows that it has to command another .5 lbs per minute through the IAC valve to maintain idle speed at our 1 lb/min.

The PCM knows it takes a ducty cycle of 30% to add that .5 lbs/minute.

The PCM is also programmed to add .25 lbs/min during decel for dashpot.

The PCM knows it takes another 15% Duty cycle for the .25 lbs/min for dashpot.

So, because of how it's programmed, on decel the PCM will command 45% ducty cycle for dashpot for a few seconds (1.25 lbs/ min) , and then drop to 30% for idle (1 lbs/min).

Now, this works with absolute perfection if you actually have .5 lbs/min entering the engine without the IAC valve helping.

However, if the engine runs at idle speed with no help from the IAC then it's pretty safe to say that the engine is getting at least 1 lb/min without the IAC instead of the .5 lbs/min it's programmed for.

So now when we decel and enter dashpot mode our 45% duty cycle that is commanded is giving us 1.75 lbs/min instead of 1.25 lbs/min. That is where the crazy high idle speed hang comes from (almost double the amount of air as what it takes to idle). Correct the extra air and you solve the idle hang.
 

hardwork

Newbie
Joined
Mar 30, 2012
Messages
30
a-men on your explanation! back your throttle blade adjustment off as far as you can without the blade sticking in the bore and your high idle will disappear.
 
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