Shock Absorber advice needed

[BRONCITIS74]

I lifted my 74 Bronco with a 3 1/2" lift kit from WH. I also have a 1" body lift. I added the dropped pitman arm and trac bar bracket. The tie rods and drag link are new. My C bushings are 7 degree. I have had the front end aligned and my caster angle is about 3 1/2 degrees. The toe-in is set at 3/8". I have had the steering box rebuilt at West Texas Off Road. I have looked at the front end with a helper turning the steering wheel and see nothing moving that shouldn' t be moving. Yet when I drive, especially when I put in the clutch, the front end wants to wander. I talked to Wild Horses yesterday and 2 things were suggested. Either I could go with Bilstein shocks, or add front stabilizer bars. The shocks are the least expensive way to go. So, I'm wondering if any of you guys have had this problem and added the Bilstein shocks and if it made the problem better. I would like some input before I spend the money. Thanks

 

[blubuckaroo]

If your tie rod and track arm are parallel, o each other, I'd dismiss bump steer.

Is the front axle centered on the chassis?
If your track arm is too short, and not running in the center of the track bar radius, any nose dive will cause the axle to shift to one side then back again on rebound.

 

[needabronco]

Post a picture of your front end. Specifically the drag link and track bar.

 

[Apogee]

What size and type of tire are you running? How much pressure?

 

[DirtDonk]

Yes, those questions and more!
While I like the Bilstein shocks, I certainly don't think different shocks are going to be a cure-all for this type of motion. It's possible of course, and if your shocks are a little soft right now, the extra movement you get in the front end will make the problem more noticeable. In which case firmer shocks will maybe not cure it, but likely reduce it. But shocks stiff enough to stop something like this are not always the happy medium for street running.

Definitely get us some pics of your angles.
You said you have new steering linkage. What style is it? Factory original stuff, or one of the fully adjustable types like we sell? If the latter, you need to make sure that the centerlink is adjusted so that the draglink end is pointed up at an approximately 60° angle. If this is not done, your trackbar and draglink will no longer be parallel, and the tie-rod will have more tendency to roll during maneuvers.

Also, the trackbar bracket needs to be fully welded in place (instead of simply bolted) for the tightest steering.
Not being welded will not cause your issue, but it won't help anything either, as the vehicle tends to wander a little more with the road irregularities. So it's just another thing to dial in.

Is the draglink adjustable? If not, was your steering wheel off-center when you put it all back together? An off-center steering box is one more reason your steering won't be a precise as it should be.

Good luck. Lots of stuff to fiddle with yet.
Firmer shocks might help, but let's figure out just what is causing it before spending more (of your!) money.

Paul

 

[metal1]

I`m trying to figure what pushing in the clutch has to do with a wondering issue ?

 

[Joe473]

I lifted my 74 Bronco with a 3 1/2" lift kit from WH. I also have a 1" body lift. I added the dropped pitman arm and trac bar bracket. The tie rods and drag link are new. My C bushings are 7 degree. I have had the front end aligned and my caster angle is about 3 1/2 degrees. The toe-in is set at 3/8". I have had the steering box rebuilt at West Texas Off Road. I have looked at the front end with a helper turning the steering wheel and see nothing moving that shouldn' t be moving. Yet when I drive, especially when I put in the clutch, the front end wants to wander. I talked to Wild Horses yesterday and 2 things were suggested. Either I could go with Bilstein shocks, or add front stabilizer bars. The shocks are the least expensive way to go. So, I'm wondering if any of you guys have had this problem and added the Bilstein shocks and if it made the problem better. I would like some input before I spend the money. Thanks

Before going further try lowering tire pressures. Do the chalk test or try going down a couple of psi at a time. If wide tires on narrow rims too much pressure will give you that feeling.

Also what is your camber? What condition are rear spring bushings in?

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk

 

[DirtDonk]

I`m trying to figure what pushing in the clutch has to do with a wondering issue ?

Weight shift with incorrect steering geometry, or something else loose in the suspension and/or steering.

Pretty common with lifted Broncos. Especially if equipped with a full locker in the rear end.

Paul

 

[DirtDonk]

And speaking of which, BRONCITIS... Do you have a locker in the back?

Paul

 

[BRONCITIS74]

Here are pics of the front end. Am using the stock Trac bar but I have an adjustable one.

 

[BRONCITIS74]

Pics didn't go on first try. I am running the stock trac bar and measuring from the tire to the fender flair, the right side sticks out 1" more than the left. The tires are 33x12.5x15 BFG K02 tires. When I push in the clutch, and there is no torque as in acceleration, thats when the front end wanders. Tires are all at 30 psi. There is no locker in the back. All bushings in the back are new polyuerathane bushings that came with the WH kit.

 

[BRONCITIS74]

If I use my adjustable trac bar and make it longer than the stock one, won't it push the body even further to the left side of the truck? The left side from the edge of the tire to the flair is 5/8". The right side measures 1 5/8". Am I thinking backwards with the trac bar or does it need to be longer? Thanks, Mike

 

[blubuckaroo]

Y

If I use my adjustable trac bar and make it longer than the stock one, won't it push the body even further to the left side of the truck? The left side from the edge of the tire to the flair is 5/8". The right side measures 1 5/8". Am I thinking backwards with the trac bar or does it need to be longer? Thanks, Mike

The issue isn't the athstetics of having an off center axle.
The issue is, if It's off center, you'll be riding on the slope of the track arm's radius rather than in the center of the radius. The further off center it rides, the more the axle will move from side to side when the nose dips.

 

[BRONCITIS74]

If that's true, how then do I center the body over the front axle?

 

[Broncobowsher]

Is it just when you press in on the clutch? Or will the same thing happen by getting on/off the throttle?

Don't rule out the rear spring bushings (mainly the front ones) being sloppy. A little axle shift in the back will make the front feel very wandery. Different rear tires side to side (even just wear) and a locker and do weird things.

 

[DirtDonk]

You could probably stand to lose a few pounds (sorry, not getting personal) in the rear tires initially. But that's not likely enough to be a notable cause of your issue.

The parallelism of the bars is very good. Even the angles are not that much different from stock, so it's unusual to be having this reaction so noticeably from the geometry.

So we get back to the axle being centered.
You should find another point of comparison. Bronco bodies, especially out at a fender flare, are notoriously inconsistent and not the best to use. Not to say they couldn't be right on the money, but you might look at the frame instead.

As far as the adjustable bar being only longer, have you measured it at fully collapsed and compared to your stock one? Maybe you can actually make it shorter than your old one.
Sorry I don't remember for sure. I just put one on a few months ago and took lots of measurements for the fun of it, but don't remember if they can be used to pull the axle left or not. Maybe after this I'll remember!
Officially it'll go as short as 28" but not really sure why we ascribe only a 2" adjustment range to it. Anyone that's ever had to screw one of those things all the way out will attest to the length of the threads!
So get out your tape and see if the indicated 28" is short enough.

Then just to be sure, measure the bar itself to see if it doesn't actually go shorter after all.

Paul

 

[DirtDonk]

Oh, and while we're on the subject of an off-center axle from lifting, I've always maintained that most people would never notice 1/4" or maybe even 1/2" offset. Unless they'd spent years driving their Bronco before a suspension lift, it would be hard to tell the difference, even though in theory there would be one.
But at 1" or more, you might start to feel things for sure. However, this shifting while shifting, so to speak, is hard to quantify from a given amount of offset to a given level of shifting to the side when the load changes.

Maybe this will be a good test. Hopefully you can get it down to being precisely centered and feel the difference. Frankly I'm surprised that your passenger side is sticking out farther anyway. Usually it's the other way around. Even with the drop brackets a lifted Bronco's axle shifts to the driver's side more often than not it seems. At least in my experience.
Haven't measured every lifted Bronco I've ever come across though. So generalities are the rule here. For now at least...

Crossing fingers you can do something with the adjustable bar, and that it actually helps reduce the shift.
If not, then perhaps stiffer shocks are actually called for, to keep the front end from moving up and down so much while driving. I've driven Broncos that were lifted without the drop brackets and didn't shift as much as yours sounds like.

My '68 is lifted and currently does not have the drops on it. Been driving it that way to get a feel for it before adding the drops even though it's only a 2.5" lift.
It's not as likely to ever have as much of the issue because it's an automatic, but the throttle response is so crisp you would think it would still occur.

The old one with manual steering probably would have done it more, with it's uneven linkage lengths, but I know I got used to just letting the steering wheel move in my hand instead of holding on tight. This let the vehicle stay straight and the wheel move back and forth instead. Just became habit.
Easier to do on manual vs power steering though I bet.

Paul

 

[DirtDonk]

Oh, and one more thing...
Even before you mess with the trackbar you could mess with the toe-in. That 3/8" does work well for some, but it's at the max of the recommended range and mine always worked better at 3/16" instead.

Easy enough to play with a tiny bit of adjustment, lock it down and drive it for a bit. I used to do that for weeks after changing wheels and tires to come to a sweet spot I liked.

So things you can do while you're figuring out if the trackbar will help:
1. Play with air pressures in the tires. More often than not, the rears can be 4-8lbs lower than the fronts. Not always of course, but often.

2. Play with toe-in settings. Nothing is etched in stone other than the fact that "every Bronco is different. And everyone sets theirs up different, and everyone has different tastes.
What size tires and wheels are you running?

3. Remove the steering stabilizer. Nothing wrong with having one mounted in the stock location like yours is. Just that sometimes it changes things enough to notice and it would be nice to see how yours feels afterwards. With and without.

4. Drink more...

Paul

 

[SteveL]

Is it just when you press in on the clutch? Or will the same thing happen by getting on/off the throttle?

Don't rule out the rear spring bushings (mainly the front ones) being sloppy. A little axle shift in the back will make the front feel very wandery. Different rear tires side to side (even just wear) and a locker and do weird things.

.
^^^like he said. If it also wanders on acceleration it could be in the rear. On one occasion I had your wandering issue and it ended up my rear carrier was cracked almost all the way around the ring gear ready to grenade. The next time I had the issue it was a broken U-bolt on the rear. To center the front end take some string with weights on the ends. Run it across the frame so the weighted ends hang down in front of the front axle. Each end should hang down on the outsides of the frame. Then measure to the c-caps or a common point on both sides of the axle.

 

[68ford]

Start by removing some toe in. 3/8 in is very excessive. We have a Hunter alignment machine at work and it has 3 different specs from 66 to 77. None of which are anywhere near 3/8 for the toe.