Broke down @ the gas station - Starter Prob's?

[Slumlord]

Gang,

Tonight is the night I have been waiting for, the night in which my EB brakes down for the first time. I mean, I’m no fool, I purchased this truck knowing full well that this day would happen (I’m almost glad it came, I finally got it over with! Ha ha). Either way, I got it towed (thanks to my roommate) back home, so she’s safe, however, she is still out of commission. :-[

Now that I have made it crystal clear that I have a problem, I was hoping that I could get the groups advice and help.

Lately, I have been noticing that my ’69 has been a little slow in starting. It takes a little cranking to get her started, especially after I have already driven it, strangely enough. Usually, in the AM, it fires right up but if I get out, kill the engine and come back later (like, 20 minutes) to drive her, she really has a hard time starting. This has really been no big deal nor caused me any major problems, I have just been figuring that I need a tune up (which is coming very soon!).

Anyway, tonight, I head to the gas station, fill her up then get in to leave. I turn the key and the familiar grumble of her trying to start comes on, but then quickly stops. I stop turning the key. I turn it again to hear some strange noise that can only be described as a really loud buzzing, almost like a vacuum cleaner when the belt comes off. While it’s buzzing, there is no cranking from the engine itself at all. I let her sit while I look over the engine, mainly the electrical and ignition area (distributor, cap, wires, etc). Nothing is out of place and when I turn the key the lights come on no problem and the gauges move back into their normal positions easily. This leads me to believe that the battery/alternator is not a factor in this scenario. I try and fire her up a coupe of times when all the sudden there is nothing, just a single click. No turnover, no weird buzzing just a single click.

So, there you have it. She’s sitting in my carport just waiting for the AM and me to buy the new part(s) needed to get her back on the road.

After thinking about it for awhile, the only real conclusion that I can come to is that my starter may be bad. I’m not sure though, that’s where ya’ll come in

Any comments??

Thanks gang.

 

[Skuzzlebutt]

Certainly sounds like the starter to me.
Don't buy a re-man from NAPA or you'll need another in a couple years. You can get a brand new Autolite from Schucks/Kragen/Checker for not too much more.

 

[broncnaz]

You may want to get the battery and alternater checked also, I'm leaning more towards the alt. if its not charging your run to the gas station at night with lights on may have drained the batt. enough to cause it not to start. Then over night the battery builds itself back up thats why it fires right up drive around more drain on batt harder to start. Then again skuzzlebutt may be right with the starter heat it up a little and the worn out starter dont work so good. does it restart if you jump it?

 

[jpoore]

I agree- take it to a autostore with the battery/alt. tester. They can load test both the battery and the alt.

Don't over look the simplest part of the whole system- the selenoid. I've had these crap out with the same effect. Cool thing is, you can jumper these and get rolling. A set of jumper cables (you have these in the truck anyway, right? Right?) does the trick nicely.

JP

 

[Slumlord]

Thanks for the tips, gang.

As for the jumping, I didn't try it tonight. Ummm.. I hate to say it, but I don't have cables in my truck... :-[
Trust me, I'll be picking up a set here really soon though. I mean, I carry a good amount of tools, why not cables too!?

Anyway, I'll see if she fires up tomorrow AM but something tells me that my EB is dead as a doornail. We'll see.

As for the selenoid, isn't that located ON the starter itself? Either way, I'd just love to figure out what the problem is then fix it.

Keep the suggestions coming!

 

[SteveL]

even more simple than the solenoid is the voltage regulator. I thought the alt went on our 66 and is was just the regulator. Far cheaper than an alternator. Jump it and disconnect the battery. If it still runs the alt is ok.

 

[Skuzzlebutt]

Thanks for the tips, gang.........
<EDIT>.........
As for the selenoid, isn't that located ON the starter itself? .....
<endEDIT>......

AH HAH! Oh what a give away! You're a chebby lubber aren't you?!?!

Solenoid on the starter? Indeeeed

 

[flint_knapper]

It should be on the pass. side inner fender,
can't miss it. the cable to the starter runs to it.

 

[cro_bronco]

Sounds to me like the starter is bad. That whining noise you heard was most likely the starter spinning but not engaging the flexplate. I would pick up a starter solenoid while you are at the store they are cheap. If it turns out you don't need it throw it in the spare parts box. I hate being stranded for a $10 part. Double check all your battery cable connections as well. I have had some pretty weird things happen just to find out it was a bad ground to the engine block. Good Luck!

 

[supermottl]

I had similar problems. I brought my starter in to NAPA and they tested it and it was super fine. So, I went home and put it back in and it worked. 1 week later same shit. Next, I go back to Napa, and buy 1gauge starter wires from battery to Solenoid (new solenoid also), and from solenoid to Starter. All my old connections were junked up and by replacing all the wires, the starter actually cranks faster. Definately make sure all connections are tip top or that sucker won't crank.
DO THIS IT WORKS!!!

 

[joules]

My starter quit working. I would only hear a click under the hood. I replaced the starter, no dice. It ended up being something as easy as cleaning the cable connections.
J~

 

[Slumlord]

Gang,

Here's what I can tell you. This AM I went out to try to see if I could get her to crank and I found that the same thing still happens, "CLICK" and nothing.

I located the starter next to the engine block, between the block and the pass. side wheel well, so that's good. I checked my battery terminal connections and they are nice and tight with no corriosion around them.

That's all I could really check before work. I think what I may do is pick up a new starter, a starter solenoid and the 1 gauge wires from battery to solenoid, and from solenoid to starter. I guess I'll have to see how much it all costs but I figure if I'm under their, I might as well replace anything that it could. I mean, I don't want this to happen again, at least not for awhile.

Keep the comments coming...

 

[Yellow75]

I'd get a set of jumper cables and try jump it before changing the starter. they aren't fun at all.. If you do replace it get a gear reduction and you'll thank yourself. 100% easier to install!

 

[Rustytruck]

Turn on your head lights and hit the starter if the lights dont dim it is bad wiring /loose connections or a bad solinoid. if the lights dim and the starter doesnt crank bad starter. If the lights go out then its a bad battery or charging system. get a digital volt meter check battery voltage. 12-1/2 to 13 volts good. anything less than 12 bad. turn on head lights check voltage should be close to 12 volts if under 11.7 bad battery or alternator. Start engine voltage should be 13-1/2 to 14-1/2 turn on all lights and heater with engine running voltage should be 14 volts or so if not the regulator or alternator is bad. to check the regulator turn off engine and unplug the plug to the voltage regulator the regulator is marked at the plug with letters with the regulator un plugged run a jumper between wires marked A and F this simulates the regulator full on now climb in the cab and start the truck and look at the amp gauge on the dash it should be pegged at fully charging imediately turn off engine. this test is only for a few seconds. if the needle was pegged the alternator is good if the needle wasnt pegged replace the alternator. if the alternator tests good but the previous tests showed low voltage then replace the voltage regulator.
always replace the regulator if you replace the alternator and always replace the solonoid if you replace the starter.
you will replace solonoids and regulators at a 2 to3 to one ratio to the starter and alternator. solonoids and regulators wear at a much faster rate because they do all the switching and the contacts wear out inside so keep a spare with you to keep from getting stranded someplace and getting a $50.00 tow for a $15.00 part.
The biggest failure and the most common problems with the electrical system is bad connections. even a clean battery can have a hard black crust under the cables. and remember a wire has two ends!!!
Sorry for the long post.
Steve

 

[supermottl]

I'd wait on the new starter. I bet that's not it. The cables and solenoid are relatively cheap. Do them first. Hopefully, the parts store is close to you.

BTW< My connections all looked good too, but obviously they were not.

 

[m_m70]

same thing happened to me 2 weeks ago.
tuned out that the wire that connects to the positive side of the battery was loose. not the terminal itself, but where the cable connects to the terminal. everything worked since after a cranking down on the connector. be sure to check all above mentioned, might save a buck.
Mike

 

[Slumlord]

If the lights go out then its a bad battery or charging system. get a digital volt meter check battery voltage.

Well, I just tested my EB and found that when the key was turned over, the "CLICK" happened and the lights simply went out. Now, Rustytruck, I do thank you very much for your in depth post, it helped tremedously but I really think that the battery/alternator is the least of my problems. However, that may just be my "greeness" coming out in me. I have had no previous signs of depleating battery power. The only previous signs I have had was a long crank to get the spark I needed for her to fire up. Would you still put your money on the battery or charging system?

On another note, I talked to Napa, Checker and Car Quest today. I found that Napa has a Raylock starter in stock for $67 and Checker has an Autolite starter in stock for $55 with lifetime warranty. Anyone have any experiance with any of these brands?

I think I am going to take some of the advice given above and simply purchase a new solenoid (which I may buy 2 of because as posted above, it's good to have that part handy!), wires and a battery terminal cleaner and start with that. Hopefully, my problem clears up, if not, I'll execute another route and post my results here.

Thanks again gang for all the help, please keep the info coming, your help is greatly appreciated!

 

[flint_knapper]

a weak battery hates the cold weather. try to jump it. and then get the charging system checked out.

 

[Rustytruck]

For a fact if the headlights go out there isnt enough power to turn the starter but it proves that the solonoid is transfering the limited power that is there. Borrow a good battery or jump start the truck. Fords hate to jump start due to starter design and they only turn in a narrow voltage and amp load. Yes you could have a bad starter that draws too much current but it is so rare compared to all of the other possible causes. Once you get it started check for alternator out put. One thing to try with problematic starters is smaking the outside edge of a starter with a hammer, if the brushes hang up this will sometimes get you going and if this works get a new starter as soon as possible. This isnt your problem but may help in the future.

 

[supermottl]

Yeah, let us know what fixes it...