Crank sensor needed, 3 wire, Hall Effect. Something US made?

[rocknhorse76]

Brian, let’s just wire it all up with the 3-conductor shielded cable I’m getting you, and use the stock Exploder sensors for now. If it works, then all is well. If not, we have the extra conductor to switch to Hall effect later. The most important part is making sure that the drain wire in the shielded cable is terminated correctly. I may or may not have 28 years of experience in wiring up industrial power and controls lol. We’ll get it all working.

 

[nvrstuk]

Good plan...

 

[lars]

So, how does it drive with the TermX?

 

[nvrstuk]

Here you go

I think I'll try the stocxk VR stuff before I put $700+ into 2 sensors... bit more than I want to spend. Thanks for the info tho.

 

[nvrstuk]

Holley tech confirmed a reference grd I had found that they didn't know was in my harness and I can splice it with the Canbus grd.

The Q on the Hall Effect compared to a stock type VR 2 wire sensors wentover like a lead balloon. All I could get from the guy was his recommendation to buy their HB kit which includes a reluctor wheel and sensor that they sell.

 

[yakelys69]

this is what I used. https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/ZF/GS100502?qs=%2BrIg/MSiRkGdf1qMOzs5Xg==

 

[yakelys69]

like ba123 said 2 wire can work with terminator, I did have it working with the 2 wire stuff but it was finicky and time consuming. Rather than screwing with it I spent $35 and it worked perfect without any screwing around and never errored again - worked good for me. Who knows maybe an intermittent plug wire interface or something but I did use shielded grounded wire and they really weren't close.

ok can't get at Autozone but just buy two so you have a spare. Still better than $700

 

[nvrstuk]

Sounds good.

 

[frdboy]

this is what I used. https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/ZF/GS100502?qs=%2BrIg/MSiRkGdf1qMOzs5Xg==

I am using the same one, planning on just keeping a spare with me JIC.

 

[ssray]

Here’s one with a metri-pak connector.

ZF automotive use

 

[nvrstuk]

Or the Holley one with a metri-pac for $160 + ouch!!

I have 2 coming.

Need to order metri-pac connectors now as nothing like this is available in my town... now if I needed a 26' wide seed rake... lol

 

[ba123]

I used Deutsche connectors and really happy with them. Use whatever makes you happy.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B09W2K7GP4/?tag=classicbroncos-20

 

[nvrstuk]

"Happy" would be one type of connector on my entire Bronco so I don't have to have 9 different tools to open 14 types of fasteners that require 22 types & sizes of pins. lol

Pipe dream- I know!!

 

[nvrstuk]

Here's the answer from probably the sharpest guy on Holley Tech forums. Quoted below-

" In my opinion, if a Holley EFI user isn't familiar with the Magnetic Ignition Type "Minimum Signal Voltage" &
"Filtering" parameters (in System Parameters/Custom Ignition Parameters), then they have no business using
VR/magnetic pickup type crank & cam sensors. This is the problem with using magnetic pickup type sensors,
there's more tuning work/adjustment involved. Hall-Effect sensors are "set & forget", very easy to use.

The more robust Hall-Effect sensors are preferred because they're not susceptible to EMI/RFI interference/noise,
and their digital square-wave signal strength is consistent, regardless of RPM (unlike the VR magnetic sine-wave).
Also, the VR magnetic pickup signal is weaker at cranking speeds.

Another problem with using VR Magnetic sensors, is there's more tuning work. Hall-Effect is "set & forget".
This sensor topic has been discussed many times. Use Hall-Effect sensors. Using a magnetic pickup sensor
involves the hassle of reading a System Log and its "Crank A/D" channel to determine the optimum value.
To make matters worse, the Sniper & Terminator X EFI don't even record System Logs, so you're guessing.
The VR Magnetic Sensor Type "Minimum Signal Voltage" & "Filtering" parameters need to be programmed.
http://documents.holley.com/199r10676rev.pdf (Magnetic Crank/Cam Input Filtering Parameters, Page 2)
http://forums.holley.com/showthread....4450#post54450 (Example: Wrong Magnetic Parameters, Post #25)

Also, I always use Digital Falling. Digital Falling is much preferred because it's a cleaner signal.
https://forums.holley.com/showthread...839#post224839 (Preferred Digital Falling vs Digital Rising)

Hall-Effect: 3-wire, square wave signal (digital), pulse generation
VR Magnetic: 2-wire, sine wave signal (inductive), voltage generation
http://www.electronicproducts.com/El...g_for_you.aspx (Hall-Effect vs VR Magnetic)"

Setting clearances for crank sensor- Hall Effect and wiring "B20" again. lol
chrome-extension://efaidnbmnnnibpcajpcglclefindmkaj/https://documents.holley.com/199r10923.pdf
Question clarification: Use "Digital Falling" (LINK), and the 7th tooth. The 36-1 trigger wheel is marked with an index line (LINK).
Answer: (On Holley Forum) I'm using the the Holley 36-1 kit and MSD cam sync, SBF. My head scratching is over some setup. In the EFI software Help, it says to set the sensor, 36-1 wheel, at the 6th tooth. In the KIT instructions, the 7th tooth. Both saying this will provide a 60° Reference Angle. The 7th tooth because the instructions say to trigger at "Digital Rising"? If I'm triggering on "Digital Falling", should I setup the sensor at the 6th tooth when at TDC? Thanks.

 

[ba123]

I'm sure the guy is sharp but there is no more tuning involved. That's dumb. I might be wrong but that doesn't make any sense at all. You need the angle at which tooth #1 is or some sort no matter which signal you use and it's not any different. It a sensor reading teeth and a missing tooth telling the ecu where it is in rotation.

As far as digital rising vs digital falling, I believe that has to do with which sensor you use and if I remember correctly, some work better one way and some others. I tried both and got a cleaner signal on rising, but it really does not matter. You can't say either is better than the other flat out. It's either at the start of the signal or at the end of it. That's all that means.

I am in no way saying Hall isn't better, cause it is, but just my .02.

The post above from @yakelys69 looked like the Explorer wheel with a hall sensor…is it?

If so, just do that if you're worried.

 

[nvrstuk]

I'm only worried enough to know that when I possibly have tuning issues now or down the road that it isn't caused by me not using the sensor that the Holley techs might not be able to help me tune it. That's pretty much it. Could happen at home with my computer handy and my helpers here on CB guiding me through the problem. BUT, if I'm not "here" and I have an issue down the road then I need the guys that are a phone call away will know how to fix it OR at least not blame it on that VR sensor and send me down a rabbit hole.

Ben- all I know is you know what's going on, the Holley tech guy has been answering highly technical questions for years on this exact system and I know enough to know that I should use what is recommended- not that something else won't work, but what they say will work the best.

Thanks and keep helping! Appreciated.

 

[yakelys69]

The post from the Holley forum is spot on and probably the guy I gleaned off of. Yes @ba123 that is an explorer wheel, I used the original explorer mounting bracket and fixed it for the cherry/zf hall sensor. Im sure in some systems the magnetic is fine but with the holly its a pia.

also notice I kept the original sensor tabs to keep everything aligned I just cut the ears off and used them.

 

[ba123]

If that's the case, then Brian, you should just do what Yakelys did and use the Explorer crank trigger with a Hall sensor, since clearly that works and you don't have the annoying negatives of an aftermarket wheel of pushing everything out further. Also low cost.

 

[yakelys69]

low cost and any bit as good or better .

So, how does it drive with the TermX?

mine drives great and doesn't stink like it did with the stock ecu. It does take some working to get the iac to behave, changing to liner sensors for oil, water and fuel pressure was better than calibrating for0d stuff. Lots of good YouTube videos if you tackle it one part at a time.

 

[latrucker]

I used the same one that Yakleys69 used, https://www.summitracing.com/parts/...MIgY31_fWhhQMV9Up_AB16RwJ1EAQYCCABEgIEDfD_BwE
or, same one but much cheaper. They are maufactured by ZF
https://www.newark.com/zf-electroni...d||ptaid||&CMP=KNC-GUSA-GEN-PMAX-Shopping-New