Doubler vs. Stak, Atlas

[Silverhorse]

What are the pros and cons of having one over the other? Weight,cost,gear selection, crossmember build etc..

 

[zeeman1]

One pro of the doubler is the super-cool look of having an extra shifter. That, with a doubler would blow the mind of your average honda-driver.

 

[BUCKETOBOLTS]

I would say length of the drivetrain would be the biggest advantage of the Stak. If you use the WH 203 doubler on either the NP435 or the shorty C4 you get a pretty reasonable length drivetrain and still run the stock wheelbase. A Klune adds about 7 1/2" to your length. The NP435/D20 is about 36" and the WH NP435/203/D20 is 37 1/2". The C4/D20 is 35 1/4". A short C6/203/205 measures 47". I have a few more lengths for different combos and individual lengths of the pieces for several tranny/transfer/doubler set ups.

 

[av8rds]

I'll just suggest Atlas 4sp. Thats all.

 

[SpareParts]

A short C6/203/205 measures 47

I knew mine was long but I never had it measured. ;D

Strength and having many gear selections is the great thing about it. Heavy and like mentioned before, real long. The doubler was by far the cheaper way for me to go because of the parts I had avalible. I already had the C6 and 205, so the adapter, 203 and the DS were the only things to purchase. I started from scratch so I did not have the D20 or stock DS anyway.



Like said before, it's great answering why you have so many shifters.

 

[Silverhorse]

I would say length of the drivetrain would be the biggest advantage of the Stak. If you use the WH 203 doubler on either the NP435 or the shorty C4 you get a pretty reasonable length drivetrain and still run the stock wheelbase. A Klune adds about 7 1/2" to your length. The NP435/D20 is about 36" and the WH NP435/203/D20 is 37 1/2". The C4/D20 is 35 1/4". A short C6/203/205 measures 47". I have a few more lengths for different combos and individual lengths of the pieces for several tranny/transfer/doubler set ups.

A 435/203/205 is what i'm thinking about or maybe a C6/203/205

 

[Broncobowsher]

Doubler is thrown out there many times, but there are many versions. 203/205 combo is bulletproof as they come but that is a ton of weight, not the shortest thing ever concived, only gives 3 ratios (205 and 203 are the same so you get 1,2or 4:1). Using a D20 can really ramp up the torque and require stronger and pricer output shaft. Really starting to push the limits of what a D20 can take. I saw mention of a shorty C4 adaptor, keep in mind that removes the governor so it can only be driven as a manual valve body, no auto shifting anymore. Then there are the collection of aftermarket boxes that I know I couldn't name all of them. And collecting all the adaptors, finding just the right boxes here and there, not any 203 will do, has to be from... , so it can be inteeresting. My biggest issues, lots of weight hung off the adaptor and they can get long.

atlas, been around forever. Generally bulletproof. Bolts right up mostly. But you are only getting a 2-speed or a 4 speed. 2-speed can lack the proper gearing, either not low enough or so low that you have no middle ground. 4-speed is a doubler in front of the Atlas, which adds to the overall length. also the 4-speed can be more gearing then you can use. 10:1 in just the transfer case can be so much you will never use it.

The Stak looks to be a nice near perfect fix. 3 speeds of proper gear spacing in a single compact package. But if you want a mechanical speedometer to work, you are hosed. I also here the shifter need some reinforcment to work good.

As for crossmembers that is usually more dependent on the adaptor you use. Atlas and Stak will bolt in place of the original D20 and what ever crossmember you run should still work. Doublers are hard to say, too many versions possible. then you get into clocking it, which could also play games with the crossmember.

so you have cost, driveshaft length and angle issues to address as well.
Lightest to heaviest, probably Atlas-Stak-doubler(cast iron based)
Most cost to least, probably Atlas 4speed-Stak-Atlas or Stak 2speed-doubler
Gear selection worst to best Atlas/Stak 2-speed-Doubler-atlas 4-speed-Stak 3-speed. I will note that the gearing options in the Atlas 4-speed are not the best spaced which is why I rank it worse then the Stak 3speed which I think is spaced better

 

[Apogee]

The added transmission length of a doubler setup can be a plus as it does give you a longer front driveshaft, but at the cost of shortening the rear. It would be fun to play with the wheelbase and drivetrain length such that the front and rear shafts were the same length...only have to carry one spare.

 

[Silverhorse]

The trails I run, Grayrock and morris mountain Ala., are rocky hill climbs (wheel speed) so I'm thinking I need a higher gear more than a lower?

 

[av8rds]

also the 4-speed can be more gearing then you can use. 10:1 in just the transfer case can be so much you will never use it.

ney ney!!! not true. I've used the low/low in more places than I would have ever thought. Its 100% usable! I'm at 150:1 in L/L with the 4L60. I didnt buy it thinking I would ever use it but now I wouldnt be with out it!

 

[SpareParts]

ney ney!!! not true. I've used the low/low in more places than I would have ever thought. Its 100% usable! I'm at 150:1 in L/L with the 4L60. I didnt buy it thinking I would ever use it but now I wouldnt be with out it!

I don't have that low of low, but I also agree. When I'm on the trails, L/L is all I ever use. I do occasionally shift into 2 gear but usually find that its too fast even for the simpler trails.

 

[Tito]

My 2 cents, if you can afford it, get the atlas and throw it behind a 435 or 5 speed. If $$$ is an issue do the doubler and move the rear axle back to make it more reasonable of a length. I forget how tall you are, are you running 5.5" SL? If 3.5" I think the doubler is definitely doable. I like it as mr zeeman said, that extra stick is fun to show off and play tricks on people wanting to drive your Bronco!

I have only used my low low (120:1) for playing around so far.

 

[Silverhorse]

My 2 cents, if you can afford it, get the atlas and throw it behind a 435 or 5 speed. If $$$ is an issue do the doubler and move the rear axle back to make it more reasonable of a length. I forget how tall you are, are you running 5.5" SL? If 3.5" I think the doubler is definitely doable. I like it as mr zeeman said, that extra stick is fun to show off and play tricks on people wanting to drive your Bronco!

I have only used my low low (120:1) for playing around so far.

5.5 sl, the rear is already back 4" so driveline shouldn't be an issue. How much length does the double add over the stock set-up?

 

[Tito]

Not sure as I have the zf in there too. I know with the zf it adds...hmm...I think 12" since I am 5.5 lift, stretched 12" and my driveline is 34" in the rear.

Dont forget if you want to do a 5 speed, now would be a good time as a ford 203 is 31 spline input as well and will directly bolt up to a zf, dont even need to clearance for the shift rail. FWIW I used a ford 203 input guts inside of a dodge 203 range box (dropped right in). It put the shifter on the pass side, made it easy for me to do my shifters.