How to adjust positive camber

[Nowik35]

So I rebuilt by Dana 30 5 years ago and just today I noticed my front passenger wheel the top is leaning out a bit. I only drove it first time couple weeks ago. I just finished rebuilding the whole car. After some googling I learned I have to adjust my positive camber. Great. How do I do that? I can't find a straight answer? Is this something like a town fair tire can just adjust? Do I need some sort of shims? Offset kingpin bushings? Need help

 

[Broncobowsher]

First off, the stock spec has positive camber. Are you sure it is really off, or you just see an angle and it looks off? Stock has visible camber and running large tires makes it more apparent.

Adjusting it. Being a Dana 30 you don't have any of the ball joint options. King pins limit you. Start with checking the king pins that everything is still tight and none of the king pins are going away. Just because you just rebuilt it doesn't mean things are right. Often something just being rebuilt is a good place to start as it often didn't go together right. OK, everything is good and you still want it adjusted. Two ways. Bend the axle housing, which is the correct fix if the housing is bent anyway. The other way is spindle shims. The 6 bolts that hold the spindle to the knuckle, use the same shims as a drum brake Dana 44. Which do you need? An alignment shot that can measure both camber and SAI (kingpin inclination) and compare sides. If the SAI is fairly even side to side, axle is likely straight (or bent evenly).

Which brings you to the first steps. Inspect parts and get a pre-adjustment measurement done. So you know what you are starting with and where you need to go.

 

[spap]

Find a place like Firestone that has you pay once for unlimited alignments, you have to direct them on how it.
use the spindle shims as mentioned , it takes a bit to get it right , but it takes a bit. After what bowsher mentioned above

 

[Yeller]

The positive camber is part of the original alignment spec, like mentioned above along with get an alignment and print out of the final specs. Post the print out here and we can help you cypher through it and see what you really need.

The positive camber spec is there for a reason. It aids with return to center, reduces potential for “death wobble” and aids in tracking straight. Due to all of that it can’t be assumed it is all bad. With the Dana 30 being designed around manual steering they have very small amount of caster, 1-2 degrees, without the positive camber they are virtually undriveable. Get an alignment and let’s see where it really is. If there is an issue then start digging into it. My guess is if 1 side has visible camber and 1 side does not, the side you can’t see it is more of the issue than the one you can.

 

[ksagis]

First off, the stock spec has positive camber. Are you sure it is really off, or you just see an angle and it looks off? Stock has visible camber and running large tires makes it more apparent.

Adjusting it. Being a Dana 30 you don't have any of the ball joint options. King pins limit you. Start with checking the king pins that everything is still tight and none of the king pins are going away. Just because you just rebuilt it doesn't mean things are right. Often something just being rebuilt is a good place to start as it often didn't go together right. OK, everything is good and you still want it adjusted. Two ways. Bend the axle housing, which is the correct fix if the housing is bent anyway. The other way is spindle shims. The 6 bolts that hold the spindle to the knuckle, use the same shims as a drum brake Dana 44. Which do you need? An alignment shot that can measure both camber and SAI (kingpin inclination) and compare sides. If the SAI is fairly even side to side, axle is likely straight (or bent evenly).

Which brings you to the first steps. Inspect parts and get a pre-adjustment measurement done. So you know what you are starting with and where you need to go.

I’ve never seem a spec on SAI, anybody have an idea what factory SAI is? Or what the usual OEM variability is between sides?

(I have 10.2 deg left, 9.1 deg right for SAI)

 

[ksagis]

The positive camber is part of the original alignment spec, like mentioned above along with get an alignment and print out of the final specs. Post the print out here and we can help you cypher through it and see what you really need.

The positive camber spec is there for a reason. It aids with return to center, reduces potential for “death wobble” and aids in tracking straight. Due to all of that it can’t be assumed it is all bad. With the Dana 30 being designed around manual steering they have very small amount of caster, 1-2 degrees, without the positive camber they are virtually undriveable. Get an alignment and let’s see where it really is. If there is an issue then start digging into it. My guess is if 1 side has visible camber and 1 side does not, the side you can’t see it is more of the issue than the one you can.

Factory spec for camber is 1 - 2 degrees positive, is that right?

Not clear to me how camber (positive or negative) helps in tracking straight. Is it because it tends to promote a more defined tire contact area or something?

 

[Broncobowsher]

Most alignments are targeted to be less than ½° from side to side. This is for any angle. When I do alignments and can't get everything in spec, I start skipping the specs and bring in the cross caster and cross camber.

As for SAI (kingpin inclination) It looks like 8½° was the spec up to '79. Starting '90 it went to 13°, which would be another reason to not use TTB knuckles besides one of the ball joints not fitting. I wish I had a good spec of the '70's Dodge axles. I remember they make bad disk brake conversions on Broncos because the camber is all out of whack. I wonder if they were running steeper SAI back in the day?

The camber spec is 1-2° positive. That would put the taper in the knuckle between the kingpin centers and the spindle at 10°

 

[Yeller]

Factory spec for camber is 1 - 2 degrees positive, is that right?

Not clear to me how camber (positive or negative) helps in tracking straight. Is it because it tends to promote a more defined tire contact area or something?

As confirmed by others 1-2 degrees is correct.

This is my opinion on the camber helping. I believe it keeps more pressure on the outside of the tire keeping the tire from hunting so much in ruts, increasing the pulling force on the tie rod and consequently reducing death wobble. It also works with SAI or king pin inclination to self center so in theory it helps with tracking as well. I do know that low caster combined with negative camber will death wobble you till you know you are going to die lol.

 

[ksagis]

Most alignments are targeted to be less than ½° from side to side. This is for any angle. When I do alignments and can't get everything in spec, I start skipping the specs and bring in the cross caster and cross camber.

As for SAI (kingpin inclination) It looks like 8½° was the spec up to '79. Starting '90 it went to 13°, which would be another reason to not use TTB knuckles besides one of the ball joints not fitting. I wish I had a good spec of the '70's Dodge axles. I remember they make bad disk brake conversions on Broncos because the camber is all out of whack. I wonder if they were running steeper SAI back in the day?

The camber spec is 1-2° positive. That would put the taper in the knuckle between the kingpin centers and the spindle at 10°

Thanks for SAI info

As confirmed by others 1-2 degrees is correct.

This is my opinion on the camber helping. I believe it keeps more pressure on the outside of the tire keeping the tire from hunting so much in ruts, increasing the pulling force on the tie rod and consequently reducing death wobble. It also works with SAI or king pin inclination to self center so in theory it helps with tracking as well. I do know that low caster combined with negative camber will death wobble you till you know you are going to die lol.

I’m def on the light side on camber (0.2 degree positive left and 0.1 degree positive right). Never been totally happy with tracking, maybe worth playing with it. Any idea of what amount of camber begins to look wonky with larger tires? (35 x 12.5).

Appreciate the info.

 

[Yeller]

I think at that level is acceptable with a 35 but it may be because I think it’s normal.

I’d chase more castor to improve tracking.

 

[ksagis]

I’m doing good on caster, 7.1 degree left, 7.6 degree right.

And after thinking about it more on flight to Alaska, my included angle is actually pretty close to OEM since I’m high on SAI but low on camber.

From @Broncobowsher and others, OEM SAI was 8.5 and camber is spec’d at 1 to 2 degrees, those would combine to give 9.5 to 10.5 degrees included angle.

I’m 10.4 (left) and 9.2 (right) included angle, so if I increased camber to 1 degree, I’d have a whole lot of included angle.

Anybody know how SAI and camber work together to affect drivability?

I guessing I’m expecting too much for a short wheel base, modified suspension, 50 year old truck for tracking.

 

[Yeller]

Air pressure and tire width play factors as well. A wider tire tends to follow ruts more and air pressure can have an amazing amount of influence, often we find the pressure too high or too low causing tracking issues. The other thing not discussed is toe in, especially with wider tires factory setting for toe in is often not sufficient.