Shackle Flip / Relocate Question

[DanWheeler]

hey guys, i've been reading through all the shackle flip threads and have some questions.

I want to move the rear axle back 3.5". I have removed all my spring/shackle hangers.

If I move both the front and rear hangers back exactly 3.5" and flip the rear, will my leaf spring and shackle hang correctly?

I saw a couple pics of shackle flips that were moved back 3" but their rear shackle is nowhere near where mine would need to be if I moved it back 3.5".

Here you can see where the stock rear bracket was:

and here is the bracket flipped and moved back 3.5"

you can see why 3.5" is a good number to go back because it puts the edge of the bracket between 2 holes in the frame.

and in the front 3.5" just happens to be right in front of the body mount:

so I'm hoping I can just move both brackets back 3.5", flip the rear upside down and everything will be as it was stock but higher and further back.

thanks,
dan

 

[br0nc0xrapt0r]

I hope Sabas chimes in I was around when he did this to his bronco. He didn't do a shackle flip but he did move the hangers about 3-4 inches. He said it was a worth while mod and it seemed about as strait forward as what your showing.

 

[blwngsket]

I say box in the frame rails at the end and go back as far as you feel comfortable when trimming the sheet metal for the wheel openings. Remember you still have to open the wheel wells up rearward to center the wheels without it looking goofy. Since your doing it get as much wheel base as you can. You wont be disappointed. Roll the axle with the springs under it and see where everything lines up. I made a new crossmember that sits on top of the frame in the space created by the bodi lift and removed the stock one. This and the tank all the way back gave my axle the room it needs if I ever reach full compression.

Looks like fun.

 

[DanWheeler]

yeah, thought about moving the tank (BC Broncos 23 gallon) back but it already sits so low and to go back further I'd have to drop it another 3-4" so it would sit under the bottom of the tailgate.

blwngsket - what fuel tank do you have?

 

[blwngsket]

Its a non BL 23 gal I got from Bronco Pete in Sacramento about 10 years ago. What I did was cut one side of the bed stiffener at the rear of the bed (the side closest to the tank) about 1" wider than the tank. I then bent that side up into the channel of the stiffener and welded it into itself (clear as mud?) This allowed me to move the tank all the way back to the tail gate and keep it up against the bed. It was a tank that used the old tank strap to hold it in place. I welded brackets to it, plated the frame. I drilled and tapped the frame so I could toss the strap.

http://www.norcalbroncos.com/forum/showpost.php?p=38968&postcount=219

Dont have a pic of the rear bed support mod but when you look at it I think you'll get it. It will buy you about 3" more to the rear for the tank.

 

[DanWheeler]

I just tacked the front hanger on 3.5" back from stock. I then attached the leaf spring with the rear hanger/shackle attached and set the rear hanger on the frame in different positions. These pictures would be at full droop since the leaf is hanging (but no axle attached - not sure if that makes a huge difference)

All of these positions are with the front hanger moved back 3.5"


Rear shackle mount NOT flipped moved 3.5" back from stock (both shackle mounts moved back 3.5" - like stock but back 3.5")

Rear shackle mount NOT flipped in stock position: (front shackle mount moved back 3.5" and rear shackle mount not moved at all)

Rear shackle mount FLIPPED in stock position

Rear shackle mount FLIPPED moved 3.5" back from stock

Rear shackle mount FLIPPED moved 2" back from stock

by the looks of this I think i'll want to relocate the front hangers back 3.5" and the rear hangers back about 2".

 

[mavereq]

i looked into doing a shackle flip before i decided to link the rear. from what i read if you move your front back then you want to move your rear back slightly less that the front because you need more of an angle on your shackle with it flipped. you need that angle to ensure your shackle doesn't try to go forward and up instead of back and up when you go from drooped to compressed.

does that make sense?

 

[DanWheeler]

yeah, thats what the bottom pic shows. The rear is back 2" and the front is back 3.5"

I just tacked everything up and it looks like it may be back too far because my Sterling axle will probably hit the tank if I hit a big bump. It is right under the crossmember but I'll use bump stops to make sure it doesn't go up that high.

I might leave it as is and try to move the tank back or even move it another inch or two back and try to move the tank back 3-4"

I'm really getting carried away with this stretching business... hope it makes a difference.

 

[hartbronco]

i looked into doing a shackle flip before i decided to link the rear. from what i read if you move your front back then you want to move your rear back slightly less that the front because you need more of an angle on your shackle with it flipped. you need that angle to ensure your shackle doesn't try to go forward and up instead of back and up when you go from drooped to compressed.

does that make sense?

I moved my hangers back the same , and just welded a stop on the hanger so the shackle can't come forward worked like a hot dam !

 

[blwngsket]

Since your there you may as well get as much rearward movement as possible.

 

[hartbronco]

yeah, thats what the bottom pic shows. The rear is back 2" and the front is back 3.5"

I just tacked everything up and it looks like it may be back too far because my Sterling axle will probably hit the tank if I hit a big bump. It is right under the crossmember but I'll use bump stops to make sure it doesn't go up that high.

I might leave it as is and try to move the tank back or even move it another inch or two back and try to move the tank back 3-4"

I'm really getting carried away with this stretching business... hope it makes a difference.

Dan ..... I built my own tank and I just welded a pice of 16" (1/3 moon if you will)steel pipe into the tank to make clearance for the diff . I could take some Pics tomorrow and send them to You ,if You wish ?

 

[blwngsket]

Found a pic of the mod to the rear bed stiffener mod.
Nothing fancy.

http://www.norcalbroncos.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=7723&d=1195700550

 

[DanWheeler]

Since your there you may as well get as much rearward movement as possible.

yep... you are right. You've been down this road before, haven't you?

I decided to take it back 5". I figured, if I'm gonna extend the wheel wells, and move the tank back... might as well make it worth it.

driver's side:

I can move the tank back 3-4" (I'll have to change the mounting system for that bumper)

and I'm going to need every inch of it

and to move the tank back, i will either need to cut that channel across the back under the tailgate or lower the tank about an inch

wow - I had no plans for extending the front or rear and now I'm going 5" forward and 5" back making all kinds of changes I didn't expect to be making.

102" baby!

 

[DanWheeler]

What is the disadvantage of having to much angle on the shackle when compressed? (top of the shackle leaning forward)

I went 5" back on the front hanger and left my rear hanger at 2" back which is where I tacked it in when I was 3.5" back on the front hanger. It sat perfect when the front hanger was at 3.5" back but now that I moved the front hanger back to 5", the shackle is at a 45 degree angle.

 

[mavereq]

the problem you'll run into with that short shackle is that it might not be able to move back far enough and allow the spring to become as long as it needs to when the axle moves upward.

i racked my brain about that setup and finally figured that relocated the hangers and building a wrap trap is about as much work as the link setup.

i'm not sure who makes a longer shackle. you could fab one up. the downside is that you'll end up with more lift.

 

[carter2772]

bronko69er, palmer and WSU have all done this before. I know you have to move the rear shackles location farther back, but I dont know how much for sure. I know you want the shackle leaning towards the rear under load. Sorry I am not much help, but I know 9er would have some good info for ya.

Here is something I saw the other day surfing around. I wondered if it would work for our applications, or at least something similar instead of reusing the cut off mount. I have always thought about doing a shackle flip on one of my ebs...

http://www.wildhorses4x4.com/product/11562

 

[trailbound]

A buddy of mine pushed 5" back and his rear mount was welded at the end of his now completely boxed frame end. But he didn't flip the rear. Most shackle flips I see have 6" long shackles, very easy to make 3/8 plate and a bushing. But the shackle it self is in a 45* cant to the rear at ride height. IMHO I like shackle flips with stock springs, they are super soft and cheap to free to get a hold of.

 

[DanWheeler]

I moved the rear hanger back to the next available location that would get me a full weld. I had to go past the square hole where the body mount is.

Now I have a little bit of leanback angle when the leaf is hanging:

here's what it looks like when flexed:

Will that angle in the first picture when the spring is not compressed be a problem? I tried to get the shackle to flip the wrong way by pushing on it with my feet and it took a lot of effort to get it to go backwards. I'm not sure it could happen accidentally.

what do you guys think?

 

[73stallion]

i think careful not to melt your body mount when you weld it!

 

[hartbronco]

I moved the rear hanger back to the next available location that would get me a full weld. I had to go past the square hole where the body mount is.

Now I have a little bit of leanback angle when the leaf is hanging:

here's what it looks like when flexed:

Will that angle in the first picture when the spring is not compressed be a problem? I tried to get the shackle to flip the wrong way by pushing on it with my feet and it took a lot of effort to get it to go backwards. I'm not sure it could happen accidentally.

what do you guys think?

Weld a stop across the hanger at 7 o'clock so the shackle can't flip on you .... It works . And the only time it hits is under full droop .