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Transmission pan leak woes

75ranger

New Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2004
Messages
87
Hey all-

I have been dealing with a leaky c4 pan for years. After determining that the stock pan was never really going to be straight again, I went for the B&M deep aluminum pan. Tried that, still leaked, maybe even worse..... Got the Moroso hard plastic gasket impregnated with metal(still leaking). Spoke to my local old school tranny guy and he said that he did not use gaskets anymore but instead uses Permatex Right Stuff(which is what he says Chrysler has done for years). So, I went to drain and pull the pan and noticed that the bolt holes are almost right up against the inside lip of the pan(maybe 1/16") which would not allow me to run a bead around the inside of the hole without some of the material potentially breaking off into the pan.

Thoughts on how to handle this. Anybody have experience with these pans?

Thanks
 

pcf_mark

Bronco Guru
Joined
Jun 11, 2010
Messages
3,648
You could run the bead around the holes about 1/8-3/16 high and let it dry leaving a silicone ribbon. I am just guessing mine leaks too.
 

Viperwolf1

Contributor
electron whisperer
Joined
Aug 23, 2007
Messages
24,348
I don't recommend any type of sealer on the pan because it can squeeze inside. Steel pans can be made flat again with a hammer and a dolly. Cork gaskets work well if they are not squeezed too tight.
 

OkieAggie

Jr. Member
Joined
Feb 12, 2007
Messages
198
Loc.
Edmond
X2 on what viperwolf said.

If you feel the need to use a sealer, use copper coat on the pan side. Flatten out the holes on the pan with a ball hammer. Then make sure the flange is flat with a good straight edge. Tighten only enough to see the cork gasket start to "pooch" out a bit. Alternate side to side, front to back. If that doesn't get it I'd clean it all up spic and span and look elsewhere.
 

BwoncoHowie

C-4 Wizard
Joined
Nov 11, 2002
Messages
3,571
My experience with C-4’s is… I started rebuilding transmissions as a career in 1978. All makes and models were included at the locations where I worked. During the first 5 years I was rebuilding between 5 and 9 C-4s a week. Those numbers gradually tapered off to the point where newer models began replacing older ones and by 1992 I was only repairing maybe 7 C-4s a month. I can honestly say I have probably rebuilt more than 2,000. I don’t do nearly as many as when Ford was mass producing them, but every once in a while I may find one on my workbench. Good hard parts for these are becoming rare and almost extinct, so unfortunately I have to charge a premium when they are severely damaged. Listed below are some things I have noticed over the years that may help some of my Bronco brothers and sisters to keep their classics alive and kickin’, and working like they should.

C-4 Transmission Pan Gasket Service for stock steel pans:
When removing the pan use a 7/8” flarenut wrench to get the dipstick tube loose first before loosening the pan bolts. Make sure all the pan bolts are the Ford flanged type. The incorrect pan bolt can also cause leaks due to improper or uneven clamp load in the areas surrounding the bolt holes. Choosing the right type of gasket is important.
PAPER GASKETS
Paper gaskets are not as friendly when used with older vehicles and usually require over-tightening of the pan bolts to make them seal. It is gaskets like these that cause steel pans to get bent and distorted in the areas surrounding the bolt holes, even to the point that they are difficult to straighten. Overtightening these bolts can also cause the aluminum threads in the transmission case to strip-out. As old as these C-4s are, you may find these aluminum threads to be pretty tired already.
RUBBER GASKETS
I have never seen a rubber pan gasket that didn’t leak on a C-4 no matter how tight it was. As far as I’m concerned, any C-4 pan gasket that comes packaged inside a box folded up, is absolutely worthless. Many auto part stores are notorious for selling them. Gaskets like these find my trash can very quickly.
CORK GASKETS
Your C-4 came with a cork gasket from the factory. It worked just fine for many years. There is no reason why it cant be the best suited material for the job as long as it is properly installed. Go to a transmission specialty repair shop or Transtar, and buy a cork gasket, and any other supplies if needed. The best way to prevent leaks is to spend some time preparing the gasket surfaces. The trick to making the pan seal is to make sure the pan surface is flat and free of any stray gasket material. I have a wire wheel on my bench grinder for getting these clean. A dry gasket surface, free of oil and dirt is important. Most all transmission pans on trucks this old will be distorted on the gasket surface. You will likely need to straighten your gasket surface on the pan before reinstallation. I usually straighten pans with a special punch that is larger diameter than the bolt hole but ground to a very shallow cone. The back of a ball peen hammer also works well for this. Brace the pan rail from behind with a straight block of hardwood, steel, or the edge of a workbench. By using a hammer with this punch you will cause the bolt hole to go beyond being flat and just slightly concave on the gasket side. But when you tighten the bolt it will draw the gasket surface on the pan flat again. Using the hammer, straighten any other distorted edges so as to make the gasket surface straight and level. When tightening the pan, the same torque spec will not work with all gaskets because of different gasket manufacturers. For this reason I tighten them by feel and by sight. When the gasket starts to bulge just slightly around the bolt that you are tightening, that is usually enough. The important part is to get them all evenly torqued. Draw the bolts down evenly, and do not over tighten. You will need to go around them 3 times or more to get them all evenly torqued. A speed handle is my favorite tool to do this. Use no sealer with a cork gasket, if you managed to get the pan surface straight, and it is clean, dry, and free of oil, it will seal properly without a problem. I have the best success installing cork gaskets dry. If you must use sealer, use Gasgasinch. Apply the sealer to both sides of the gasket as well as the sealing surfaces and let it air dry a few minutes to a haze before positioning the gasket and installing your pan. The only time I ever needed Gasgasinch on a C-4 pan gasket, was when the machined aluminum surface had some deep scratches. Chemical sealers have the ability to fill-in small voids and imperfections that sometimes gaskets can’t reach. Whatever gasket type you decide to use is up to you. Careful preparation must be taken before and during installation for the best success and quality in your finished product.

That being said, make sure your manual lever seal and kick-down O-ring are not the cause of the leak. These lever seals can drip down to the gasket and follow the pan rail, blow back in the wind etc. making it look like the gasket is faulty but not actually be the origin of the leak. A bad modulator o-ring can also cause the appearance of a pan gasket leak.
 

gkling01

Jr. Member
Joined
Jun 25, 2001
Messages
66
Bwoncohowie - great info thanks! I've been battling leaks on my C4 for years and your write up gives me hope that I can seal it up. I kind of accepted defeat. Next step is to remove the rubber gasket, clean it, true up the pan flange and go with cork.
 

77BRONKOTN

Full Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2001
Messages
360
Every once in a while someone finds/makes a pan stiffener. BUT I CANT EVER FIND ONE.

SOMEBODY MAKE SOME PAN STIFFENERS FOR THE C4, NOW.

Mine has leaked since 1977.
 

Yeller

Contributor
Bronco Guru
Joined
Mar 27, 2012
Messages
6,895
Loc.
Rogers County Oklahoma
make sure the shift levers aren't the culprit, I've found when folks can't get the pan leak to stop its one of 3 things:

1)bent pan from being over tightened

2)bent pan AND squeezed out gasket from being over tightened

3)shift lever or kick down lever leaking

When you do everything right and it still leaks its the kick down lever and or shift lever every time. Leaks are sneaky they don't always come from what looks to be obvious.
 

Broncmeister

Sr. Member
Joined
Sep 26, 2002
Messages
801
I found that using the auto body hammer and dolly to tap the mounting holes back to flush with the pan surface really helped stop the pan leaks. Over time as the bolts get torqued tighter to stop leaks they pull the area around the mounting holes in and cause a taper.
 

blubuckaroo

Grease Monkey
Joined
Jun 11, 2007
Messages
11,795
Loc.
Ridgefield WA
Excellent recommendation BwoncoHowie.
Most of the time these cork gaskets arrive folded in a box. I like to wet it with tranny fluid and lay it out flat in the sun to relax, while I work out the bows in the pan.

75Ranger,
make sure you're actually battling a pan leak. I've seen the shifter shaft seal or o-ring make the same mess.
 

panalukes

Jr. Member
Joined
Oct 9, 2014
Messages
202
Loc.
Virginia Beach, VA
On the C-4--Can anyone give me some guidance on how the following seals are replaced: manual lever seal, kick-down O-ring, & modulator o-ring..

I pulled those terms down from BwoncoHowie's previous post. Thanks.
 

Viperwolf1

Contributor
electron whisperer
Joined
Aug 23, 2007
Messages
24,348
On the C-4--Can anyone give me some guidance on how the following seals are replaced: manual lever seal, kick-down O-ring, & modulator o-ring..

I pulled those terms down from BwoncoHowie's previous post. Thanks.


There is a seal (Napa ATP 1404) around the shift shaft but you need to open it up and remove the valve body to change it. There is also a special quad-ring (TransTec #32568) between the shift shaft and the kickdown shaft that can be changed from the outside.

Change the quad ring first. That is a common leak. Remove the nut and kickdown lever and pull out the old ring. Lately I've been using a small o-ring (Brasscraft #0562 from Lowes) behind the quad-ring because the hole in the shaft is really too deep for just the quad-ring. Clean the area, lube the new ring(s) and re-install. If it still leaks after changing the ring you'll need to pull the valve body and shift lever to change the shift seal.

Modulator o-ring can be changed by removing the retainer that holds the modulator in and pulling the modulator out. There is a pin that will probably come out with the modulator. Don't lose it.
 

cs_88

Bronco Guru
Joined
Jul 28, 2005
Messages
1,321
My magic recipe as of now consists of...
Relatively straight C4 pan.
Jeff's pan stiffener.
Moroso silicone gasket.
5/16" x 1" bolts w/ 1/4" flat washers torqued to 10 ft lbs.
So far so good.
 

Slowleak

Bronco Guru
Joined
Sep 12, 2013
Messages
3,837
Loc.
Georgia
Mine is similar to the above. Jeff's pan stiffener, straightened factory pan pan, Felpro composite gasket, torqued the bolts to 12 ft lbs.. Hasn't leaked a drop.
 
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