Door Alignment HELP

[DeepC73]

Hello everyone,
I have a 1973 Bronco. I recently purchased a set of 1977 doors. I have tried to install the passenger door with no luck. It appears to be sagging and is too low on the striker side. The front fender seam is straight and I can even get them flush, but nothing raises up the back end enough to allow the door to clear/close. The gap between the windshield and the door is symmetrical with the striker end. If it were at the correct angle(no sag) it would fit. I have ordered new body mount bushings as well. I tried jacking up the body mount, but it didn’t help. I also loosened the roll bar. What am I missing folks? Any help is appreciated. I have included pics to help explain.

https://share.icloud.com/photos/07SkDHTcrCfcSpsQgt_mQ_yhA

 

[Rumcustom]

Something doesn’t look right with the hinges with regards to the gaps between them and the door skin. The gap there at the top is wide and the bottom appears to be touching the skin. Was this door re-skinned at one time? If so it may have been installed a little crooked. Was the old door, if you have it, fitting well? Call me crazy, but I would pull the bottom hinge out and see if there is a shim inside the door between the hinge and the door structure where it bolts on. Someone might’ve added shim there to attempt to bandaid another problem.

 

[DeepC73]

You are correct, there is a shim in the bottom. I placed a washer under the hinge earlier today to see what difference it would make. I do not know if the door was skinned before. I also don’t have the old doors. I bought it without doors.

 

[RonJones]

I”m not a genius at this, but I think you’re gonna have to bring the top forward first. Try a couple washers under the top hinge inboard bolt on the A-pillar, then try one or two 3-bolt spacer shims (or washers on all 3 bolts) on the bottom hinge. The first should help with not gouging your qtr panel and the second should lose some of the sag. It will also close the upper front gap, but mess with that last. That can be helped with a shim under the A-pillar body mount. I had some formal door shims and cut them in two so I could add inboard or outboard or both, but a lot of people just use washers. Superglue and magnets can help hold shims together and from drooping, too.

 

[Rumcustom]

Deepc73: if you have shim INSIDE THE DOOR between the bottom hinge and the door structure then that is hurting your problem. That will essentially drop the door back at the striker post. Remove that shim and recheck alignment. If you still need to go higher at the striker post after that, THEN add washers or (preferably) shim stock between the bottom hinge and the hinge post, not inside the door.

 

[DeepC73]

Deepc73: if you have shim INSIDE THE DOOR between the bottom hinge and the door structure then that is hurting your problem. That will essentially drop the door back at the striker post. Remove that shim and recheck alignment. If you still need to go higher at the striker post after that, THEN add washers or (preferably) shim stock between the bottom hinge and the hinge post, not inside the door.

What do you mean by “ between the bottom hinge and the hinge post, not inside the door.”?

 

[67sport]

What do you mean by “ between the bottom hinge and the hinge post, not inside the door.”?

If shims are needed, they should be between the the hinge and the truck (hinge post), NOT between the hinge and the door itself.

Can you, without bolts, place the door in the door frame, and make the gaps look acceptable? You can use tapered wood shims (like construction door shims) to move the door around.

If you can, then it can be bolted up, shimmed, holes reamed, whatever, to make it permanent. If you cannot, then you're into bodywork.

Sent from my SM-T560NU using Tapatalk

 

[Rumcustom]

What do you mean by “ between the bottom hinge and the hinge post, not inside the door.”?

Between the bottom hinge and the A pillar. Where the hinge bolts to the body tub. The way I read your comment earlier, it seemed like you had shim inside the door sandwiched between the hinge and inner door structure. If that Is the case (the latter of the two) that would contribute to your problem. One more note about fine tuning alignment: when you have everything close but just need a final tweak, and I mean just a tiny tweak, you can just grab the (open) door with two hands and give it a couple hard shoves up or down to get it to where you need it. Grab it near the striker post (back) of the door and yank it up or push it down for the last tiny tweak. We do this all the time on final alignment of doors, hoods, and trunk lids.

 

[Pops68]

Have you tried the driver's side door??

If so, same issue or not??

 

[hummerdan]

What shape are the body mounts in? Have you shimmed the mount behind the passenger seat? You can remove the bolt on that mount and use a Jack to lift the body at that point to see if it helps. I just finished aligning two doors that I never thought I would be able to get flush. Takes time and patience but it can be achieved.

 

[DeepC73]

Have you tried the driver's side door??

If so, same issue or not??

I have not been able to tackle the drivers door yet due to the way it is sandwiched in my garage. However, I feel it might be inevitable.

 

[DeepC73]

What shape are the body mounts in? Have you shimmed the mount behind the passenger seat? You can remove the bolt on that mount and use a Jack to lift the body at that point to see if it helps. I just finished aligning two doors that I never thought I would be able to get flush. Takes time and patience but it can be achieved.

I have ordered new mounts a few days ago, just waiting at this point. I have tried jacking it up at the mount behind the passenger seat. It helped a little, but did not solve the issue. I also loosened the factory roll bar, which also helped. I am hoping that when I get all new mounts under the frame it will help.

 

[DeepC73]

Let me start by saying thank you to all of you who have given me advice and tips. All of them have been helpful. I just placed the door in the jamb and did a “dry-fit”. It does fit as you can see in the picks. I’m going to have to figure the hinge, shim placement out and likely move the front fender, at least.

https://share.icloud.com/photos/02wsqM33lUy4M0QZch7nFVDQQ

 

[triracer67]

Body shim chart for door gaps

I found this years ago, and it’s helped me straighten door gaps on many Broncos. I would start by replacing all the body bushings. Also, make sure your door pins are solid.

 

[DeepC73]

I found this years ago, and it’s helped me straighten door gaps on many Broncos. I would start by replacing all the body bushings. Also, make sure your door pins are solid.

You my friend are absolutely AWESOME! I knew something like this was out there. Thank you! I will keep you posted.

 

[Rustytruck]

we need much closer pictures of the 4 corners of the door make sure the 2 front corners include the hinge too. looks like you need to shim the body mount on the passengers side body mount at the floor board so it pushes up the door jamb while the front mount at the core support pulls down the front of the fender opening up the top of the door jamb opening. measure the top of the door jamb opening and the bottom of the door jamb opening and see if the opening is parallel and square to the bottom of the door opening.
hard to see whats going on with such far away pictures. I like to use and old Framing square on the sides and the top ledge of rocker panel. take the framing square and cut off the lower corner so it doesnt hit in the very corner of the door jamb as that corner always has issues not allowing the square to sit properly.

 

[DeepC73]

we need much closer pictures of the 4 corners of the door make sure the 2 front corners include the hinge too. looks like you need to shim the body mount on the passengers side body mount at the floor board so it pushes up the door jamb while the front mount at the core support pulls down the front of the fender opening up the top of the door jamb opening. measure the top of the door jamb opening and the bottom of the door jamb opening and see if the opening is parallel and square to the bottom of the door opening.
hard to see whats going on with such far away pictures. I like to use and old Framing square on the sides and the top ledge of rocker panel. take the framing square and cut off the lower corner so it doesnt hit in the very corner of the door jamb as that corner always has issues not allowing the square to sit properly.

I will get some closer pics later today. I put the new body mounts on. It didn’t make much difference. I have placed two shims under the passenger floor board. It helped a little, but not much. I also tried adding one shim under the floor behind the passenger seat. The biggest problem is the rear of the passenger door is about an inch too low in the rear top where it meets the hard-top. I’ll post pics soon. Thanks for your help.

 

[DeepC73]

we need much closer pictures of the 4 corners of the door make sure the 2 front corners include the hinge too. looks like you need to shim the body mount on the passengers side body mount at the floor board so it pushes up the door jamb while the front mount at the core support pulls down the front of the fender opening up the top of the door jamb opening. measure the top of the door jamb opening and the bottom of the door jamb opening and see if the opening is parallel and square to the bottom of the door opening.
hard to see whats going on with such far away pictures. I like to use and old Framing square on the sides and the top ledge of rocker panel. take the framing square and cut off the lower corner so it doesnt hit in the very corner of the door jamb as that corner always has issues not allowing the square to sit properly.

Here are the pics. Very frustrating. I’m trying to find an old framing square. Any more tips?
https://share.icloud.com/photos/0JurwQgIMNvspXY0y8xgMpzhw

 

[RonJones]

You might try my earlier recommendations. It appears your door needs to move forward and the rear up. Shimming the upper inner bolt tilts that hinge forward, moving the upper door forward. Shims on all three bottom bolts will tilt the rear of the door up. Try it! You’ll like it! (Or not). Also, it’s also helpful to state how much shimming you are doing. For example, my A-pillar body mount required a 3/16” shim to open up the upper front gap, but that should be done last. Myself and others have found it’s hard to gain much with B-pillar body mount shims if you’ve got a hardtop on. All bolts securing the hardtop have to be loosened including at the windshield frame, and stuck gaskets have to be unstuck and free, too.

 

[DeepC73]

You might try my earlier recommendations. It appears your door needs to move forward and the rear up. Shimming the upper inner bolt tilts that hinge forward, moving the upper door forward. Shims on all three bottom bolts will tilt the rear of the door up. Try it! You’ll like it! (Or not). Also, it’s also helpful to state how much shimming you are doing. For example, my A-pillar body mount required a 3/16” shim to open up the upper front gap, but that should be done last. Myself and others have found it’s hard to gain much with B-pillar body mount shims if you’ve got a hardtop on. All bolts securing the hardtop have to be loosened including at the windshield frame, and stuck gaskets have to be unstuck and free, too.

What type of shims do you recommend? I see they offer door shim kits; are they worth it or are washers sufficient?