Door alignment issues and shimming

[Green_Bastard]

Hey guys,
I'm hoping someone can help out with determining the best solution for my door alignment issues. Both doors have the same issue, but the passenger side is slightly worse. At the front of the door, everything looks pretty good (maybe 1mm off at most top to bottom) but the back of the door sits to low. I can close the door, but I have to shut them a little hard to get them closed. I've attached a few pics showing the problem. The first is the top front of the door and the second is the back top with the door but not closed all the way. I think I need to add shims to the body mount under the front floorboard but I'm looking for some confirmation from someone more familiar with this issue.

Thanks

 

[DirtDonk]

Great paint color by the way!
As far as the gaps go, is the door closed in the picture of the rear gap? If so that’s pretty large also.

The up-and-down alignment of the door in the rear is controlled by the striker post adjustment. But first, are the door openings in the body square?

If the opening is out of square then that is where shims in the body mount areas come in.

 

[Green_Bastard]

Hey Paul, thanks for the reply and the paint comment. The door is NOT closed in that pic, just pushed up. I can't get a good pic of all the edges so I'll try to describe this a little better.

In that position (not closed):
For the bottom edge of the door, the back sits lower than the front
For the rear edge, the top is closer to the rear quarter than the bottom

When closed:
The door openings are pretty square with the door. When I measure, it's off about 1 millimeter all around

Hope that makes sense

 

[DirtDonk]

The closed positioning seems ideal. From the looks of it I'd say the hinges are worn out. Are they new, or old? When the door is fully, or half-way open, how much can you move the hinges when you lift up on the door?
Original hinges were never very tight, but modern aftermarket ones seem to have zero play. Old worn ones can be crazy loose.

Paul

 

[Green_Bastard]

I should have mentioned it before. The hinges are new. I went with the Duff lift off hinges with the 1/2" pin. They have no play at all. When I do shut the door, it appears that it's flexing the front pillar to allow the rear of the door to lift and shut. Thats why I was leaning toward shimming the body mounts

 

[DirtDonk]

Well if the openings are not square before the door is closed, then they need to be squared up with body shims. They should fit the doors without being forced to.
Get a tape measure on there to see what the discrepancies (if any) are between the vertical walls of the openings.
Not sure if there is a measurement that eliminates the front fender from the mix. Seems like the hinge surface is more important as that's fixed (relatively) where the front fender might be manipulated a little bit.

Paul

 

[Green_Bastard]

Ok now I'm starting to understand where you're going. I just measured the door opening with the door swung all the way open. The top measure about 1/8" narrower than the bottom. I'm guessing that's where my problem is.

 

[DirtDonk]

That would certainly point the rear of the door down some when it's closing.

Paul

 

[Green_Bastard]

I agree. Going back to your first reply you mentioned this was fixed by body shims. Which body mounts should I shim to correct the pillar

 

[lbuch40]

I had the opposite problem. Narrower at the to than the bottom. Added shims behind and in front of the seat and made some improvements. For your situation I would guess shimming the back body mount might help. On one of the many threads on door alignment here someone had posted a diagram from Dennis Carpenter that gave recommendations for shimming based on the particular out of square situation. See if you can find it. If not, I can post a picture of what I printed out.

 

[Green_Bastard]

I had the opposite problem. Narrower at the to than the bottom. Added shims behind and in front of the seat and made some improvements. For your situation I would guess shimming the back body mount might help. On one of the many threads on door alignment here someone had posted a diagram from Dennis Carpenter that gave recommendations for shimming based on the particular out of square situation. See if you can find it. If not, I can post a picture of what I printed out.

Thanks for the reply. I did see that but I don't think it applies to this situation. I could be wrong but that seems more dedicated to the door gaps but not when the door is hanging to low a one end. I've attached it here and the closest example is 3. The door does crowd the upper rear door jamb but its hanging below it also. In that example it says to add shims to pints A B and C. I think if I add shims to C, the door will still be to low in the back. I think I need to add shims to point B only or maybe A and B. Hoping someone can clarify.

 

[ngsd]

I never realized the difference in hinges until just recently when I tried to fit an aftermarket set of 66-67 doors. The lift off hinges just would not work. The new hinges would bind but the original worn out hinges worked just fine. I ended up rebuilding the original hinges and that did the trick. The thickness, the bend and shape were different on three sets in my original parts pile. The set that worked best were from an original 66.

 

[lbuch40]

Interesting discovery on the different hinges.
BTW, I like your paint color. I am looking for something similar but a little more burnt orange. Mind sharing your paint info?

 

[lbuch40]

Thanks for the reply. I did see that but I don't think it applies to this situation. I could be wrong but that seems more dedicated to the door gaps but not when the door is hanging to low a one end. I've attached it here and the closest example is 3. The door does crowd the upper rear door jamb but its hanging below it also. In that example it says to add shims to pints A B and C. I think if I add shims to C, the door will still be to low in the back. I think I need to add shims to point B only or maybe A and B. Hoping someone can clarify.

You can sure try only B. As Paul mentioned, first thing is to check the door opening for being square. If it is, the you could try shimming behind the bottom hinge at the A post. That would lift the back of the door.

 

[lbuch40]

Ok now I'm starting to understand where you're going. I just measured the door opening with the door swung all the way open. The top measure about 1/8" narrower than the bottom. I'm guessing that's where my problem is.

I misread this reply. I had the same problem as you except by a full 1/4”. I got improvement by shimming both B and C locations . Also helped to loosen the A position while working on B & C. But then tightened back with no shim added to A.

 

[Green_Bastard]

Interesting discovery on the different hinges.
BTW, I like your paint color. I am looking for something similar but a little more burnt orange. Mind sharing your paint info?

Sure, the paint is brandy wine candy over metallic silver. I got a chip in the paint on the grill so I'm having the center section redone to have a black base under the brandy wine candy. This will help it stand out a little.

 

[Green_Bastard]

I misread this reply. I had the same problem as you except by a full 1/4”. I got improvement by shimming both B and C locations . Also helped to loosen the A position while working on B & C. But then tightened back with no shim added to A.

Ok that makes sense. I'll give that a shot this afternoon and see how it turns out. Thanks for the info!