1972 - How to remove lower flange on upper steering shaft?

[admin]

I'm replacing my PS box and while I'm at it I'm finally installing the WH collapsible lower steering shaft that's been in my garage for a decade or more.

I got the PS box and the factory lower shaft out, including the rag joint. But I'm having problems getting the lower flange off the upper shaft (the flange right above the rag joint and the upper shaft that's in the steering column)

The WH instructions (dated 2004!!!) say this upper flange will come off the splined shaft with a puller, but I've cranked down on the puller quite a bit and the flange isn't moving. I saw someone mention that the end of the shaft was sometimes peened or otherwise mushroomed out, so they had to take an angle grinder and cut into the side of the flange to split it apart.

The collar above the flange is separate, right and not attached to the flange? (collar in my 2nd photo with the bolt already removed) My recollection is the collar is there to hold in the lower bearing of the steering column.

I might just pull the steering wheel and drop the upper shaft out through the engine bay entirely. Then I can mess with it on the work bench. Not much room in there with the power brake booster directly above it.

 

[DirtDonk]

Can’t say I’ve ever seen one like that before John. Although maybe you have more removed than I’m used to seeing, but usually the whole item has a different shape to it.
Other than that, as far as you know, is this an original for Steering comb? You say it’s a 72, but is it a very late 72, such as September or later?
Perhaps it’s one of the earliest of 73’s and was expecting factory power stirring.
Might be a different design from other

That aside, though, that aside, however, I think many of the Early ones were welded. Pressed on, pinned over, and a tack weld in there.
Theoretically, you should be able to see a weld, but there have been many reports over the years of people not being able to pull them off the bottom with a polar. Especially, if I remember, 73 models. Which is what years would be, in theory, if it’s a late 72.
Otherwise, we might not know what we’re dealing with yet.

So I agree it would be a good idea to just pull it out and work with it on the bench.
Ultimately, you might just have to cut it off.
You won’t be reusing the splines anyway I wouldn’t think. Or is your new upper yoke a three-quarter by 36 spline model?
If it’s a three-quarter double-D, then just cut the end of the shaft off and grind your two flats to fit.

 

[DirtDonk]

Your picture sure makes it look like that lower bearing retainer collar is one piece with the rag joint flange.
With the bolt removed, can you spread it and move it around separate from the remaining bit of the rag joint?

 

[admin]

Thanks Paul! I'll work on pulling out the upper shaft later this week.

I think the angle and lighting is just weird on my first photo of the rag joint flange. It looks pretty normal to me.

Here's a better photo before I took the rag joint off completely.

 

[Jetfixr320]

On my 66 F100 steering shaft, I carefully took a high speed cut off wheel and cut into it almost all the way through and then took a chisel or flat blade screw driver and spread it apart to slide it off. The end of the shaft was flared out slightly. And it needed sanded off a little for a new u-joint to slide on.

 

[1973bronco1973]

My 73 was very hard to remove. It looked just like yours. Used a harmonic balancer puller and it bent the rag joint coupler but it came off. Very tight

 

[NJBronk]

I used a cutoff wheel as well, and wish I knew the condition of the upper shaft underneath before putting in all that effort... I was rebuilding my whole column and ended up getting a shiny new upper shaft from Tom's with splines that would actually hold up. Used that with the WH collapsable lower shaft. All is good.

 

[admin]

Thanks for the replies everyone!

I got the upper shaft out tonight. I thought I'd have to remove the turn signal switch to get to the snap ring, but my shaft doesn't have one. So I just took off the steering wheel, then tapped the upper shaft down into the column. Then I pulled the shaft out from below (engine bay side). It barely fit, with the last couple of inches of the shaft having to slide into the gap between bottom of grille and top of bumper.

Now that I can see the rag joint flange and collar more clearly, I'm definitely glad I didn't try to grind the flange off while still in the Bronco. The flange and collar appear to be welded together, and then there's a metal spacer/sleeve above the collar that's also welded to the shaft. It doesn't look factory, so must have been a previous owner. Amazing that after owning this Bronco for 32 years, I can still blame the previous owner for stuff!

I ran out of time tonight, so I'll tackle the grinding part in a day or two. Hopefully I find some splines under that flange.

 

[Broncobowsher]

That's what I remember from mine as well. Welded in place. But since mine was a mixed bag of parts (not stock on a '69) I wasn't going to say it isn't coming off since it is welded. It all looked like stock parts, didn't appear modified.

Maybe some are welded and some are splined/removable?

 

[DirtDonk]

With first years of anything on Broncos (in this case, a 72/73), anything is possible. Almost…

I forgot if I asked, but in what month was your 72 built?
Is it a P or a Q in the VIN by any chance?

 

[admin]

No, it's an "N"

 

[DirtDonk]

In that case, sounds like it’s either a PO Installation, or a very early implementation of the new-to-73 factory steering shaft design.

We started to see things like the little bump-out in the core support for the soon to arrive larger power steering box, and a few other things that would be hallmarks of the 73 model year.
Perhaps including the new updated steering shaft.

 

[admin]

I got the rag joint flange off, but unfortunately there are no splines at the end of the shaft.

So I need either a different year upper shaft with splines or a different U-joint with a DD style on one end and I can grind down my shaft to that shape.

 

[ntsqd]

If you can find the splined shaft that would be my own preference. Vastly prefer splines to any of the other common ways the OEMs use to key a joint to a shaft.

Cue @jamesroney 's concerns about those set-screws. I replaced them with G8 hex heads that are drilled for safety wire. No fancy aircraft safety wire applied, just some heavy SS wire looped thru the hole and wrapped around the joint body and then twisted together. They also get jam nuts and some 271 in the threads. Thought that I had a pic of the safety wiring, but am not finding it.

 

[NJBronk]

Some discussion on the set screws/safety wiring when I did mine: https://classicbroncos.com/forums/threads/toms-steering-shaft-set-screw.323735/

 

[jamesroney]

If you can find the splined shaft that would be my own preference. Vastly prefer splines to any of the other common ways the OEMs use to key a joint to a shaft.

Cue @jamesroney 's concerns about those set-screws. I replaced them with G8 hex heads that are drilled for safety wire. No fancy aircraft safety wire applied, just some heavy SS wire looped thru the hole and wrapped around the joint body and then twisted together. They also get jam nuts and some 271 in the threads. Thought that I had a pic of the safety wiring, but am not finding it.

I'm lurking, but have nothing to add that isn't mentioned in previous posts about those evil set screws.

I am known to index and spline those shafts back to 3/4-36 and relieve them for a pinch bolt. But as you know...I despise Borgeson Universal joints, and Flaming River, etc. And I've never seen a need for one at the column side, since there is minimal angle there. The ONLY reason to run a universal there is to eliminate the NVH (rag joint) because of the pre-73 aprons. So lately I just shorten the column, and move the rag joint towards the firewall. Then I cut and respline for a rag joint, and add the collapseable shaft.

@admin is going to want to find an original power steering upper shaft, and pull the rag joint flange off it like @NJBronk posted. Or he can go double-d. The shaft he has is a typical 66-72 manual steering that was shortened. Pretty much how everyone did it before the kits became available. He will have to source the lower bearing retainer sleeve and pinch bolt from a pre-73 column. Hopefully there's enough shaft left, but it might already be cut too short.

 

[ntsqd]

The Wagon has a similar clamp on the shaft for the lower bearing. When I get around to rebuilding the column if the clamp is damaged beyond use I plan to use on of these for that clamp: https://www.mcmaster.com/9961K22/ although I will be replacing that SS SHCS with an alloy steel SHCS.

 

[jamesroney]

The Wagon has a similar clamp on the shaft for the lower bearing. When I get around to rebuilding the column if the clamp is damaged beyond use I plan to use on of these for that clamp: https://www.mcmaster.com/9961K22/ although I will be replacing that SS SHCS with an alloy steel SHCS.

Yeah, that won't work. You will need to build a custom spacer collar about 3/4 inch long, with a 3/4 ID and not bigger than ~7/8 OD to move the split collar out enough to access the clamp screws. Otherwise, the split clamp sits too deep in the end of the column and you can't get a wrench on the SHCS. So you basically end up cloning the factory clamp thingy.

And for a non-structural bolting application, I would not be too quick to discount the 18-8 SHCS fastener. Those alloys are generally not heat treated, so they do not suffer from embrittlement like a grade 8 (or grade anything really)

Obviously, if you upgrade the lower bearing to a sealed roller unit, and do the same thing on top, then you basically are making a 73+ style with the snap ring. Ford eventually thought it was worth doing...

My goal in life is to systematically eliminate anything that takes a hex key from anything I own. That and Torx. Also any reduced hex cap screw. The head of a fastener should always be large enough to yield the shank before it strips. The engineer that specified the reverse torx cap screw to attach the AX-15 bell housing to the Jeep 4.0L block needs to be beaten with a stick. Any moron that puts an undersized head on a pan plug should be beaten as well. Oh, and any TTY fastener.

edit: Wild Horses did your homework for you...PN WH2792 $20.

 

[ntsqd]

"Wagon" = Wagoneer, so different. Good to know for Broncos. Had a look at: https://metalspacersonline.com/ to see if such a spacer could be ordered and only as a custom, if then and would likely require a volume order. So, instead order a foot of this: https://www.mcmaster.com/89955K168-89955K162/ and carefully cut off the length needed.

I do not use 18-8 fasteners for anything that I absolutely do not have to. I've had too much experience with their drive hex's getting striped after very, very low cycles in production tools designed by my predecessors. BT, DT, no thank-you!

Torx are the only female drive cavity fastener that I like and will use without concern but I also would prefer not to have them in the field as it's yet another special tool to carry. Same for the E series (inverted Torx) fasteners, but again, special tool.

 

[jamesroney]

Torx are the only female drive cavity fastener that I like and will use without concern but I also would prefer not to have them in the field as it's yet another special tool to carry. Same for the E series (inverted Torx) fasteners, but again, special tool.

Yes. Your special tool kit needs to include a drill motor, a set of HSS drill bits, a tap and die kit, a Bridgeport vertical mill, and a die grinder. Since you are an engineer, you are supposed to anticipate use-cases. And the use case for the E series fastener is as follows:

Install bell housing bolts clamping aluminum to cast iron in ideal manufacturing environment using impact tools. Tighten sufficiently with body off frame to yield and gall the underlying material. Environmentally cycle for 40 years. Bury fastener location under primary firewall to tub pinch weld flange. Ensure that the torx feature is almost a fit for a 7/16 hex socket, and at least 18 inches from reach. Use the incorrect socket to partially round the head of the M10 fastener. Source the correct E-series socket to round the remainder of the head in the quest to achieve the necessary 200 lb-ft of torque requirement.

Laugh hysterically as you calculate your Six Sigma cost savings... (and take credit for your ergonomic improvements.)