14 bolt rear end build thread, shaved 15 bolt, ring gear turn...

[79INA69]

That's good to hear! I was looking at 2 yolks side by side thinking, the strap style looks stronger due to the surface area. Glad I didn't replace it now. I will tell you though, the crushing the crush sleeve for setting pinion bearing pre-load was just a tad harder than a 9". I had to use a 3/4 torque wrench and pull to about 650ftlbs to get final crush! Look up setting it in a press to get initial crush from Busted Knuckle garage. Or use the eliminator kit

 

[nvrstuk]

Good to hear about the strap style yoke...I'm going to my local boneyard that I got the flanges from and he has axles from that rig that I'm getting for spares... so I'll save some money not having to "upgrade" the yoke!!!

I have no way to put that kind of measured "crush" here in my shop...just a nice length of pipe over my 3/4" scocket drive bar!!

I've never set up a 14 bolt but all I hear is how much torque it takes to "crush"...
I'll text ya for a couple pics

 

[nvrstuk]

Any pros and cons on crush sleeve or solid spacer from anyone that has setup 14 bolt rears?

Is more torque applied in a rear end something that might make one setup better than the other?

 

[Yeller]

I’ve never had a crush sleeve failure in a 14, cant say that for anything else. Made a solid spacer for one once but was helping my machinist build one in his shop so it was simple, machined a chunk of steel..... I cheat them, get tight with an impact, put in the press, tighten again and keep going until I’m happy. My 20t press will not crush it but adds enough to be able to tighten a little more. On a 9” I crush them in the press until I like the preload and then snug the nut up.

Pic of my 13-1/2 bolt

 

[nvrstuk]

Great 13.5 bolt cover!!!

 

[nvrstuk]

Great 13.5 bolt cover!!!

 

[ntsqd]

Looked to see if diy4x4 made a 205 clocking ring and they don't. I had one of their rings in the FJ60 between the 700 and the 241.

Possible cover option would be diy4x4's 14bff cover? Can order it shaved, FWTW.
https://diy4x.com/product.php?productid=17679&cat=247&page=1
Have this same cover for a D60 for the CTD's front. Am being excessively anal about the gasket surface being absolutely flat. So it has so far done a wonderful job of keeping my garage floor from floating away. I've got it glyptal'd and painted now, just a 'round tuit.
Never an issue with The Right Stuff staying sealed, but I'm also not in the habit of banging the covers against immovable objects.

Interesting to read that 14bff crush sleeves haven't been an issue. I failed an 8" crush sleeve once ~25 years ago and now I don't consider them to be anything more than set-up tools. Crush 'em, remove & measure, make a spacer to that dim, surface grind the spacer length to final bearing pre-load.

 

[nvrstuk]

TS...thanks for chiming in on the crush sleeve failing...I've only heard of a few, but for some reason I seem to belong to that group. Easy enough to do a solid spacer...

 

[ntsqd]

I made some similar spacers for the front wheel bearings of a 2WD desert race truck. Took some effort up front, but the sleeve meant that could R&R bearings in the field and just tighten the spindle nut, no need to re-set the pre-load. It also stopped occasionally breaking spindles because with a tight spindle nut it effectively made the spindle a lot larger OD.

If the 14bff sleeves aren't an issue I wonder if it's worth the trouble?

 

[Yeller]

I wouldn’t worry about the 14b crush sleeve on a rear, might on a front in a rock bouncer but even the would be tough call. I cab crush a 9” sleeve with ease in my press, a 14b laughs at it, tighten nut, press, and repeat until right. Every time I stall the press I can get less than an 1/8th of a turn on the nut.

 

[ntsqd]

Clearly you need to re-wire that hyd. pump motor........

 

[Yeller]

Clearly you need to re-wire that hyd. pump motor........

Lol 3400psi is 40,000# had it up to 4000psi and the press frame was bending so I dialed the prv back to 3400 problem solved until I decide to build a better frame

 

[nvrstuk]

So what you're saying is using the small 12ton hyd jack press I have available is just an exercise in frustration??!! lol

 

[nvrstuk]

OK all...laugh all ya want but I don't want to have any chance of possibly ordering something like an Atlas or a Titan doubler and THEN finding out that my measurements/drawings/cave-man art wasn't accurate with all my angles so....

... it's really OK to laugh at this but it verified my cave-man art to within a degree!

I'm holding a rafter square against the yoke face to verify that the driveline would be pointing appr 1 1/2 deg below the pinion (yeah, I didnt have enough hands for the pic-hence the gap amd things arent aligned quite right...but you get the idea!!)

 

[ntsqd]

My friend Dave has a Masters in Mechanical Engineering with specialization in Kinematics and works on satellite stuff. He uses "CAD" all the time on his own Scout 80 project (don't worry, very little IH left). CAD = Cardboard Aided Design!

The best tool for the job is the one that works well for the operator.

 

[nvrstuk]

Thanks TS!! 20 yrs ago I taught AutoCAD...w/o cardboard...couldnt remember how to turn it on now so I'm using your CAD!! lol

...so I measured the height of the 14 bolt pinion relative to the ground at varying pinion angles trying to determine what the center of the pinion shaft height would be.... determined that I needed to actually setup up a t-case yoke simulation with all the exact measurements my Bronco has at ride height...so...

I brought another work bench in, got all the measurements at ride ht and at full droop, got a bunch of wood blocks, buckets etc together to simulate all the angles and measurements I already had on my 4'x8' sheet on the floor.

Here ya go...bit primitive BUT the angles were exactly the same meaning if I need to order some gear boxes that are different lengths or to eliminate the doubler and go with an Atlas or my existing 205 I would know if it would work...

 

[nvrstuk]

This pic isnt accurate because I couldnt hold things in place for the pic but it verified at full droop that my numbers were spot on.


I can use an Atlas if I want to limit travel up in front by 3" and I could use my Klune if I wanted to run what I feel is a bit too steep DD run angle and almost 34 deg in the rear (easily run a limit strap) or when I mount my ORI's to the new housing to limit the lesser amount of suspension travel...

I put so many DD miles on I'm leaning towards going with the newer 34 spline 1 1/2" dia, one pc 8620 alloy main shaft in the Titan-shouldn't be a weak link. Debating still. It's 2" shorter than my KluneV/205 that I'm running now. Sell the Klune to recoup some cost as I have a 4340 alloy main shaft in it so someone should want it. Think it over for a while.

IF I didn't need a doubler for the length/angle of my DS, I could save some bucks but DS angle up frt would be terrible...this pic simulates the driveshaft the soon to be 14 bolt (pinion at 13.5deg) to 205 (flange on t-case at 3 deg) with the DS at 31deg at full droop.

 

[.94 OR]

With your overstock quantity of power at hand and the larger than stock tires, how much difference in angle will your pinion see at full throttle and full decompression? Or will you be installing a axle rotation limiting device?

 

[nvrstuk]

I'm 4 linked, so effectively none.


My concern would be how much would it change with full suspension travel movement.

the 4 link calculator was used extensively to look at those numbers throughout the travel. Been 2 yrs and I can't remember the degrees of change from full stuff to full droop but when designed for my HiPinion rear I was well within ujoint angle limits when cycling.

I have to run numbers again of course when I link up the 14 bolt.

 

[nvrstuk]

Suprising weight comparison between the RuffStuff housing and the 14 bolt housing...

Update on 9/22/19. I went back and checked the weight of my RuffStuff housing.

With the 9" TrueHi9 out and the rear housing with all brackets, with 14 bolt hubs, no RCV axles and no 3rd member weighs in at 208#

RS housing 208 + 75# third member = 283#'s

14 bolt essentially weighed with all the stock brackets, hubs, on the housing WITH axles weighed in at 300#'s

So who says a 14 bolt is a PIG!!

17#'s difference and that's WITH the 14 bolt axles in it... this isn't a stock Ford thin tube housing but I'm not gaining any weight on this build other than a small truss over the diff to help keep the tubes from twisting and a small pinion guard.