Another Painless wiring question

[ngsd]

I have read several threads on here and think I have this wiring correct but thought I would see if the experts would verify my plan. There is so much information but with each build there is a little difference so I wanted to ask for some help.

Big picture, the "66" is in name only as everything has been changed. Most of the electrical has been changed so this has a lot of twists.


Painless 10113 harness
306 Blueprint with Holley Sniper FI and
Electric FI pump in tank
Explorer serpentine set up with 4G alt.
Mean Green starter
Dakota digital dash
Optima yellow top with side posts
Kenwood aftermarket stereo
Newport wiper conversation and switch
Ididit late model column (wired for 75)
AX15 reverse sender
Stock ign switch and stock light switch
Using stock fender mt starter relay
Mega fuse 175amp
Midi 70amp fuse


These are my assumptions and questions:

Alternator

Green red on alternator to 914 green red on Painless harness
Yellow on alt to battery positive post
Red 6ga lead from alt to Mega Fuse
Red 6ga lead from other side of Mega fuse to Positive terminal on battery

Mean Green Starter wiring

Positive 2ga battery lead to left side (A) of starter relay
2 ga lead from A side starter relay to starter
10 ga lead from right side (B) of starter relay to spade plug on starter


Coil wires now part of the Holley harness and powered through that. (920 red blue if running coil+)

Wires from Painless harness for Starter relay

Black 916 wire to starter relay A side via Midi fuse
(2) Brown 970 wires eliminated
Red Blue 919 wire to relay lug "S".
915 to an aux power block[/COLOR
Red/Green 920 eliminated unless running stock coil


Other wires from painless

Splice both 972 wires together to create loop for amp gauge with digital dash

Eliminate the following wires: (I just bundled and tucked behind dash)
Ign mod loom
901
Yellow (was spliced on 916)
Orange no number
957 Ign Mod safety
Brown 970 wires (2)
Red green 920
What else am I missing?

Did I mention I hate wiring!

 

[gr8scott]

Red 6ga lead from alt to Mega Fuse
Red 6ga lead from other side of Mega fuse to Positive terminal on battery

I'd up these to at least 4ga. That 4G can put out some juice. You can also run from
other side of Mega fuse to side A of starter relay, If you've got enough room on that stud.

 

[ngsd]

Thanks, the 6 ga is what was recommended but I will keep an eye on that. I am going to change this up and go with the hyperspark sniper ignition so this will change once again.

 

[DirtDonk]

If the 6ga is a normal length, then it's fine. But I usually start with 4ga anyway for the reason Scott suggested.
However, if you've already got the 6ga all done up fancy like, you can keep it. The fuse is there to protect the wire if it's not enough, and 6ga should be more than enough for 175a unless it's extra long.
If it's custom (rather than one of the kits) how long overall is the charge wire?

If the Hyperspark is not 100% computer controlled (including the coil) then yes, Red w/green to coil + side. Depending on which coil you're using, you may or may not need the resistor included in the Painless kit.
The idea is to, hopefully, eliminate the resistor by using the correct ignition components to run the full system voltage all the time.
Consult the ignition system component instructions for that.

Yellow alt wire is system voltage sensing. Can go to the BAT post on the alternator, but the best-practice method is to run it up closer to the battery itself. Whether that's directly to the battery, to the starter relay, or to one of the wires connected to the battery positive, does not make a huge difference.
But for convenience's sake, putting it on the BAT post does not seem to make a huge difference either.
I run them to the starter relay, but there are probably thousands of them out there with just a short Yellow hop from the "A" terminal to the BAT post and working fine.

Red w/blue to "S" post of relay. Yes.
Otherwise no clicky, no starty.

Paul

 

[ngsd]

If the 6ga is a normal length, then it's fine. But I usually start with 4ga anyway for the reason Scott suggested.
However, if you've already got the 6ga all done up fancy like, you can keep it. The fuse is there to protect the wire if it's not enough, and 6ga should be more than enough for 175a unless it's extra long.
If it's custom (rather than one of the kits) how long overall is the charge wire?

If the Hyperspark is not 100% computer controlled (including the coil) then yes, Red w/green to coil + side. Depending on which coil you're using, you may or may not need the resistor included in the Painless kit.
The idea is to, hopefully, eliminate the resistor by using the correct ignition components to run the full system voltage all the time.
Consult the ignition system component instructions for that.

Yellow alt wire is system voltage sensing. Can go to the BAT post on the alternator, but the best-practice method is to run it up closer to the battery itself. Whether that's directly to the battery, to the starter relay, or to one of the wires connected to the battery positive, does not make a huge difference.
But for convenience's sake, putting it on the BAT post does not seem to make a huge difference either.
I run them to the starter relay, but there are probably thousands of them out there with just a short Yellow hop from the "A" terminal to the BAT post and working fine.

Red w/blue to "S" post of relay. Yes.
Otherwise no clicky, no starty.

Paul

Thanks Paul. the 6 ga charge wire to the fuse is about 8 inches long. The fuse to battery is about 4 inches.

The Sniper Hyperspark is the complete EFI distributor, CD ignition box, Hyperspark EFI coil.

So does the 915 916 sound right? Still confused with the the 970 wires.

 

[ngsd]

I am trying to keep the fender well from getting loaded up. Anyone have any concerns with the battery tray for mounting the relay and fuse?

 

[DirtDonk]

the 6 ga charge wire to the fuse is about 8 inches long. The fuse to battery is about 4 inches.

More than enough gauge size for that length of conductor. Way more.
At lengths like that, even Ford uses 6ga.

This is not to discount Scott's assertion that 4 is better. Because it is better.
But even 6ga is a bit overkill for just 12" of wire and a fuse (some additional resistance is presumed in the fuse, but I don't know if that's a point to ponder or not). Even Ford does not use 4ga until the charge cable gets into the 4 foot range I don't think. I got some off a van that was 4ga, but it was several feet long around the engine compartment.

This is why many of us use welding cable instead of battery cable though. Even a 2ga cable is very flexible and easy to route around obstacles. A 4ga is a piece of cake.

The Sniper Hyperspark is the complete EFI distributor, CD ignition box, Hyperspark EFI coil.

Check the instructions then to be sure, but it's probably a full 12v system.
Might have to check out the book myself. Been thinking I might end up with that system on one of my rigs eventually. Still undecided...

So does the 915 916 sound right? Still confused with the the 970 wires.

The #970 Brown is no longer needed. But it can still be used, as I will mention below.
Not sure why there are two, but I'm re-reading the new Painless instructions and will come back and correct anything I've misrepresented up to now.
The Brown wire is used to increase current and voltage to the coil during the START process when the battery is at it's lowest level, and when the lowered voltage from the resistor wire can be enhanced to aid in starting.
So for a full 12v ignition it's a duplication and so can be eliminated.

However... Because it provides 12v to the coil when in START, leaving the Brown wire connected can overcome a problem of old age later down the road. That's when (or "if") your ignition switch fails to provide 12v to the ignition during START. When that happens, the Brown wire literally acts as a Band-Aid to the Red w/green wire from the key. It may never be needed, but if it is you can count on it being at a very inopportune moment!
This means that using it or not, is completely up to you.

Get back to you on 915/916.

Paul

 

[DirtDonk]

I figured I knew what you were talking about, but I have spent so many years using colors alone, and trying to ignore the numbers, that I have not really memorized the numbers yet and wanted to be sure I was steering you straight.

Wires from Painless harness for Starter relay

Black 916 wire to starter relay A side? Does this stay hot all the time? Does it need a fuse in line?

Yes, hot all the time and needs a fuse as laid out in the instructions. The fuse is included in the kit as the Maxi-Fuse component, with included fuse, holder and cover.

Remember, literally ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING that is attached to the battery side of the starter relay is hot 100% of the time because it's in physical contact with the battery cable.
The only time the wires and the A side of the relay are not hot is when at least one side of the battery is disconnected.

The #916 wire is the main power feed from the battery to the fuse panel in the glovebox. In other words, it and it's Maxi-Fuse are the power for almost the whole vehicle harness. Or, "The ultimate power in the universe" according to Gov. Tarkin.

915 capped or to an aux power block?

Correct.
With a lower power alternator this is your main charging power feed from the alternator to the fuse panel to the battery. With your 130a+ model though, it's no longer utilized for that, but as a nice length of 10ga wire it is a great power source for auxiliary fuse panels and/or power studs.

Paul

 

[ngsd]

Thanks Paul, almost there! So now the 920 wire does not need to be connected either as the hyperspark has its own power correct? I will keep updating the beginning post as I sort this out in case someone is using this thread for search reference on this kind of build.

 

[DirtDonk]

I am trying to keep the fender well from getting loaded up. Anyone have any concerns with the battery tray for mounting the relay and fuse?

I thought I commented on that but don't see it. I see no problem at all with doing it that way, and in fact it's obviously super sanitary and cool too!
I like it. Shows a lot of attention to detail and thinking through how you want to route the wiring.
Very clean indeed.

Paul

 

[DirtDonk]

So now the 920 wire does not need to be connected either as the hyperspark has its own power correct?

Where does it get it's own power from? Got a link to the full instructions?

Paul

 

[ngsd]

Does this help?

 

[DirtDonk]

Yes, thanks.
Looks to me like you no longer need #920 to go to the coil directly, but might still need it for duties with the Sniper computer and distributor. Where are you currently sourcing your feeds for those items?

It does not have to be the Red w/green #920, but you need switched 12v for the ECM and the distributor still.
Already got those connected? If so then no, you do not need the Red w/green.

Paul

 

[ngsd]

Those are happening at the harness under the dash with the b+ wires supplied on the painless.

 

[DirtDonk]

You have both types with the Sniper.
You have full 12v all the time (which is I think what you meant by "B+" maybe?) and then you have switched 12v to the distributor and to the ECM.

Paul

 

[ngsd]

Yes, correct.

 

[ngsd]

Well the Hyperspark has not made it yet so I used the small cap HEI and coil that comes on the blueprint to get it started. I will change it back after it arrives but for now everything worked great and fired up on the first turn of the switch. Thanks for the help.