Do I need new hubs??

[Slumlord]

Hey gang,

Now that snow is falling (hard) I need to start thinking a little more about 4x4. Really, the only "problem" my EB had when I took it off the PO's hands is that the "The 4x4 slips out on the driver's side". I figured that I'd need a new hub for the driver's side and since I was doing one, I might as well do them both.

Any comments on this? Do I need new hubs or could I somehow get away with just replacing the internal parts because as I said, it slips out of 4x4.

If I do get new hubs, eBay didn't have much for me. I just figured my best and perhaps only bet was to use the Warn Premium Locking Hubs for $90 (Yikes!).

As always, comments greatly appreciated.

 

[cool_edge]

From your brief description, it sounds like your front differential is 'open' and the drivers' side tire is simply spinning due to the road surface you are on. Your hubs may be fine. You should do some trouble shooting before buying the new hubs.

Good luck,

Andy

 

[Slumlord]

cool_edge,

Thanks for the tips and I agree, more troubleshooting is necessary, that's why I'm asking the board rather than just dropping $90 and hoping that fixes it

So, it sounds as though my diff. is "open", does it? How can I test this? If this is the case, how can I close it?

Thanks!

 

[45acp]

you can test it easy with a pan. set the pan under the front diffy, and pull the cover off. if its got spider gears in it, then its open.

 

[huged29]

To test:

1. Jack up your front end
2. Put it in 2wd
3. Lock the hubs
4. Spin one of the wheels
5. If the other wheel spins the opposite direction then you have an open front diff.
6. If when you spin one tire the other tire does nothing then you might have a hub problem

 

[76Broncofromhell]

Put it in 4wd on the above step. That way the pinion can't spin. I'm 95% sure it's open. Sometimes the engagement mechanism on the hub wears out. New hubs are as cheap as $60 so it's not a big deal. It also could need grease. Check on all of that

 

[Slumlord]

Gang,

Thanks for all help gang. I'll try putting the front end up and testing her out, however, what if the diff. is open, what does that mean to me? How do I close it so that 4x4 works properly for me??

Also, about the engagement mechanism in the hub, if it is bad it sounds like the solution is just to replace the whole hub, correct?

 

[huged29]

You can't close an open diff, you either have to get a new locking differential or weld your open one, which I wouldn't recommend for your front axle. An open differential works fine in 4x4 except when one of your wheels loses traction. If this happens all of the power will go to that one wheel and the other one won't spin. If you are offroading and get one tire in the air then it will just spin and you won't move anywhere. That is why a lot of people get lockers for their diffs, if you get a locker it will make both wheels spin which will help you get over more difficult terrain.

 

[Slumlord]

Ooooh, ok, now I get it. So, the stock EB's came with open diff's and everyone (who's serious about 4x4 and/or good traction in slippery conditions - IE: The snow) gets lockers. That clears it up for me.

So if I do have open diff's, I'll have the problem of my rig popping out of 4x4 every now when it looses traction in the snow, and the only way to fix that is just by re-engaging 4x4, correct?

Sorry for moronic questions but I'm knew to all this stuff :-[

 

[huged29]

You truck won't pop out of 4x4. If you are in the snow only one of your front tires will spin, but you will still be in 4x4. If both of your tires catch some traction then both will start spinning again.

 

[Jeepster]

I think whats needs to be explained here is you really dont have a true 4x4 persay.....By saying that I mean all 4 wheels dont get power. Thats the way their made. If you had a true 4x4 (power to all 4) It would be very difficult to drive and turn and not very "streetable". Ford did as an option add a "track lock" Their version of limited slip to the rear but not to the front. If you DD in the snow much it would be questionable weather you really want some sort of "locker" in the front. Doing so would kinda make driving in the snow on the street insteresting to say the least. Having all four wheels locked on the road in the snow/ice is /can be an inventation to sitting in the road ditch. meaning that the rotation of all four in a slippery situation would sent your rig in a lateral motion to the right side of the road esp if the road is crowned in the middle as they sometimes are esp in the country.

 

[supermottl]

Slumlord,
Check out this site. might help you understand how things work. I think it's a great site. Spend some time here, I've learned a lot.

http://auto.howstuffworks.com/differential.htm

 

[67EB_in_619]

Slum... you are right in that there is nothing wrong with an "OPEN" diff... and you dont really "CLOSE" them.. you "LOCK" them.. your truck wont slip outta 4wd, but the power will go to the wheel with the least resistance.. so if your passenger side wheel is off the ground, it will spin while the driver side sits still firmly on the ground... (but at least one wheel on each axle will be spinning... so hopefully you wont get stuck... if all 4 wheels are getting equal power, you will have some funny driving characteristics... for instance, if you are turning in a full circle to the left, the right side of your truck's wheels will cover more distance than the left side.. this is where an open diff is good, because it allows the left side to not turn as much as the right in order to let you turn. So imagine if your diffs were trying to make the wheels turn evenly thru a circle, one side would need to "slip" (kinda feels jerky like you PS pump doesnt have enough fluid) .. hence the option of "limited-slip" as an option between an OPEN diff and a LOCKER.

This doesnt mean that you DONT have a busted hub. Test it all out as previously posted.. might just be that the PO didnt understand what an open diff was either.

(all please correct me if I am wrong)

 

[Slumlord]

You see, this is why this site rules!!
Obviously, I didn't understand my front diff's and nobody laughed or criticized me, in fact, ya'll explained it to me. Really, thanks for the help, you guys rock!

I'll try the suggestions posted above this coming weekend and if my wheel doesn't spin when 4x4 is engaged, then I'll come back and freak out. Until then, keep posting what you guys know. Information is power!

Also, does anyone have a pattern of what the 4x4 gearing looks like? What I mean by this is a 4 speed pattern looks like an "H", so what does the pattern for my 4x4 shifter look like? The PO said that it was straight down with 4Low being up top, then Neutral, then 2wd, then 4Hi, does this sound correct?

Again gang, thanks a ton for the help!

 

[Skuzzlebutt]

That Tcase shifting pattern is correct for a T handled Tcase. I'm not sure what year they switched to the J shift pattern. A J shifter will have a ball for a handle, not the chromed T

 

[Slumlord]

To test:

1. Jack up your front end
2. Put it in 4wd
3. Lock the hubs
4. Spin one of the wheels
5. If the other wheel spins the opposite direction then you have an open front diff.
6. If when you spin one tire the other tire does nothing then you might have a hub problem

Well, today I gave her "the test" and found that when locked in 4wd, one wheel spins in the opposite direction when the other is spun. This confirms that I do, in fact, have what everyone told me I had which is an open dif.

I suppose that the PO simply didn't understand what an open diff. was either, that's why he thought that 4x4 slipped out gear in the hub area.

So, I guess the hubs are fine and they don't technically slip out of 4x4, it's just the open diff, correct?

 

[ken75ranger]

Sounds like it an open diff.

 

[Bucmaster]

I would still check out those hubs. I have had hubs that worked fine till you put a little load on them. Then the driver's side hub would pop out and I would hear it clicking. This basically turned my 4X4 Ford into a 2X4 stuck Ford. New hubs, no more problems. One more thing, I just bought Warn Premium hubs on e-bay for $ 61 shipped.

 

[czechtech]

Some Bronco's did come from the factory with limited slip front axles. I own one FWIW....