Flaring tool

[levib1]

I am looking to purchase a flaring tool set. I understand brake lines are 45 double flare. Please correct me if I have that wrong.

What kind of flare/fittings would be used for transmission cooling lines? I will have a 4R70 and am wondering if there are any special fittings for those lines?

Any other types of flare fittings used on a bronco?

I'm asking because some of the kits include 45 double flare, 37 degree flare, bubble flare, etc.

What are the most useful dies for a flare tool?

Thanks

 

[rjrobin2002]

I don't know your answer, but I have had good luck using the lines off the original Explorer 4r70w all the way from the trans to the radiator. I have cut the line in half and used trans rubber hose with quality clambs if I needed some additional length.

And I also failed at making good flares in brake lines with a eastwood flare tool and now just buy pre flared lines my auto parts store has a huge selection in the back from 20" to 72" for cheap.

I did all my brake lines last night in 20 minutes buying these. I needed 10' of brake line to get from the master cylinder to the rear axle and just bought two 5' section and combined them with a double female brass connector they had.

Then used a 6' section to the passenger caliper and 20" section to the drivers caliper.

 

[Apogee]

SAE inverted flares are what's most common on old, domestic applications, and they use 45 degree sealing surfaces. The most common brake sizes are 3/16" and 1/4" hard lines with 3/8-24, 7/16-24, 1/2-20 and 9/16-18 inverted flare tube nuts for the respective tube size, noting that 3/8-24 will not work with the 1/4" line size. Other applications such as fuel, power steering, or transmission lines can and will use larger 5/16" and 3/8" hard lines and possibly larger tube nuts.

If I could only have one tool, it would be a SAE inverted flaring tool...I happen to have a few of them, mostly specialized for brake line sizes. I have a rotary die style flaring tool that does SAE, bubble and AN with the proper dies, but it only works on the bench in a vice (Rotary Die Flaring Tool). I also have a hydraulic flaring tool that can be used on-car if needed made by MasterCool...an older version of this one. And then I have an older manual SAE inverted flaring tool as well, with the more traditional die and anvil arrangement and much more attractive cost (less than $80 for a good one).

Bubble flares are similar to inverted flares, but you leave them as a "bellows" type shape and don't use the cone die to "invert" the flares. All of the bubble flares I've dealt with have been either M10x1 or M12x1 metric, but that's not to say others don't exist. These are mostly relegated to cars from the 80's and 90's from what I've encountered, as most of the more modern applications have gone towards metric inverted flares. All of these still use 45 degree sealing surfaces.

Last but not least are the 37 degree AN/JIC type fittings. These are the industry standard for hydraulics and are used heavily in aircraft and other military influenced equipment, as well as most forms of automotive racing. I don't tend to make a lot of AN flares, but it's nice to have if/when you need it.

Tobin

 

[ngsd]

I have that Eastwood one and am pretty happy with it for brake and fuel. Getting into AN AC and other flares the Mastercool makes good products but you can spend a fortune on tools and only use them once or twice. I just got a Mastercool AC/Hydraulic line crimper and it set me back $600.

 

[levib1]

Hi Tobin,

You link to the Mastercool flare tools. Those are the sets i have been looking at, but don't know which set would be most useful. Below are the 6 options of the Mastercool sets. In your opinion, which set most useful?

https://www.mastercool.com/product-...oducts/tube-hose-forming-tools/flaring-tools/

Thanks for your long explanation, very helpful!

Levi

 

[B RON CO]

Hi, the Mastercool 70092 will flare all the lines on your Bronco. It is a 45* single and double flare set. Plumbers use single flares and mechanics use double flares. Mastercool is a nice set. IMHO a backyard mechanic can do without the hydraulic flare kit, but they really make life easier.
OTC 4503 is a basic automotive flare kit. It is a lot cheaper and will do the same work.
There are some things to keep in mind when learning to make brake lines. It is important to have the cut square to the tube, with no burrs. Also you must follow the instructions and have the proper amount of the tube sticking out of the holder. Usually you use the double flare die as a gauge. These bar type flare tools are meant to be used in a vice but can be used on the car if you can hold it steady. They work pretty good with a softer tube, but will not work with stainless.
There are flare tools meant to be used on the car, so check them out before you buy your tool. You will not need bubble, metric or any other style to work on a classic car.
Good luck

 

[nvrstuk]

I borrow the Eastwood model and to date for me, it makes the best most consistent flares. You do have to use it in a vise or figure a way to clamp it solid when using. Gets creative as I've use a 5' pipe bar clamp to flare a line on the rear axle once. lol Redneck but worked fine.

 

[Apogee]

Hi Tobin,

You link to the Mastercool flare tools. Those are the sets i have been looking at, but don't know which set would be most useful. Below are the 6 options of the Mastercool sets. In your opinion, which set most useful?

https://www.mastercool.com/product-...oducts/tube-hose-forming-tools/flaring-tools/

Thanks for your long explanation, very helpful!

Levi

Levi, as long as you get one with the SAE inverted flare dies, you should have everything you would need on an EB or other classic car. With that said, I have the larger kit that also does bubbles, fuel-lock, GM trans-line, etc, as I believe it was purchased mid GM-engine swap on my brother's Toyota...can't say I've used any of the specialty flares myself since except to help friends and neighbors, but they're there if I need them.

Considering the minimal price difference between the various hydraulic units, I would get the most capable one I could afford, probably the 72475 or 72485 unit by today's part numbers. On the low end they look to be running about $275 and on the high end they're $350, so get what you need to do the job at hand, and if it can do more in the future, even better.

You could easily get a less expensive manual flaring tool instead from Mastercool, OTC, Imperial, Snap-on/Blue Point, Craftsman, etc, and they're nice to have as a backup or primary if it's all you have. They won't be as fast and may not be as consistent, but good tube prep in my experience typically leads to good flares with all but the cheapest flaring tools. You can also possibly "borrow" a flaring tool through a local auto parts store with a tool loan program, but you'll want to inspect the condition of the tools offered before you commit to that route...sometimes the dies are trashed from previous abuse.

 

[73azbronco]

The nice Eastwood, aircraft quality flares.

 

[Rustytruck]

The only place I see bubble flair is in Vw s the 45 degree flair will serve you best but preparation is key to making good flairs. before you start making lines practice allot until you can make 10 good flairs in a row. and the most important part is don't forget to put the fitting on the tube before flaring the tube.
YouTube videos are your friend.

if your fittings are leaking loosen the fitting and tighten again a few times to form the parts together until they seat this much more important if you do any stainless steel work. stainless steel work is a pain. avoid it if you can.

 

[levib1]

What tubing termination is typically used for tranny cooler lines? Specifically, 4R70? Would 45 or 37 work just the same, or are there standards?


Thanks all for the replies - very informative as always.

 

[levib1]

Bringing this back to the surface.

I have the Mastercool flare set now, including the 37 degree flare kit.

I have 3/16 brake lines with the 3/8-24 inverted flare tube nuts.

For the fuel lines, 3/8 supply and 5/16 return. What type of flare (37 or 45) and fitting would I use to transition from the hard lines to the flexible line going to fuel tank?

Also for the fuel, how is it typically run into the engine compartment? Specifically, once the fuel line leaves the frame, is it a flexible line up the firewall to the Sniper in my case? Or does the hard line travel up the firewall and then transition to flex line?

Lastly, for the transmission cooler lines, is 3/8 adequate, or is it required to be a larger diameter? What type of fittings and flares for the transmission cooler lines? Tranny is a 4R70.

Let me know if I can clarify anything and thanks for the help!

Levi

 

[ba123]

I'm pretty sure all the fittings you'll make are double flare 45. 3/8 is plenty big for trans cooler lines and what I'm putting in myself.

You can run lines any way you want but I'm pretty sure most fuel lines are flexible between the main lines and the engine. I'm planning on hard lines to my fuel pressure regulator (which will be on the firewall most likely) and then flex lines from there to the engine.

 

[904Bronco]

Lastly, for the transmission cooler lines, is 3/8 adequate, or is it required to be a larger diameter? What type of fittings and flares for the transmission cooler lines? Tranny is a 4R70.


Levi

4R70W had 3/8" lines in the Explorer, so that is what I have stayed with. In fact, I have reused the factory lines for most of my Explorer/Bronco builds.
You need the trans case adapters from pipe thread (not certain of that?) to inverted flare.

 

[ba123]

On the adapters, I’m not positive but would bet it’s the same as the AOD:
Dorman 800-753 Transmission Line... https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000E32308/?tag=classicbroncos-20

Confirm fit here:
https://www.dormanproducts.com/p-5932-800-753.aspx

 

[ba123]

@levib1 dont use the adapters I posted. Jegs screwed me saying the kit was 3/8 line with 1/2-20 fittings and when I received it, it’s 5/16”line and you might need adapters that are 5/8-18 for 3/8 line.

 

[Jaybr]

I’m going through this right now. I’m using 3/8 and 5/16 Niccop with 6AN fittings and https://www.amazon.com/dp/B083VTM7PW/?tag=classicbroncos-20 between hardlines/filter and tank and Sniper. I’m putting a 10 micron filter on the frame rail with 6AN both sides. Since body is currently off the truck I’ll probably run the hardline up the frame rail and stop it there and switch to flex.

For vent, I’m running barb on tank and 6AN-barb adapter to hardline that I’ll run into a charcoal canister with 6AN fittings on the firewall.

I’ve got all the materials and fittings here now and will be running it all this week hopefully. Today I made a bracket so I can mount the fuel filter on the crossmember in front of the tank.

Haven’t figured out the adapters for the 4r70w yet but plan on using 3/8 Niccop.


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[ba123]

Post pics when done! I’m not sure yet what I’m using for fuel but same size lines (3/8 & 5/16).

Unfortunately for me though, I’ve gotta figure out how to do this right with my newly finished body on! Wish I’d planned things differently but that’s how the timing worked out.

 

[Jedeka]

I bought my rotary dial tool from Summit. It is made by K-Tool and works great.

 

[Jaybr]

Post pics when done! I’m not sure yet what I’m using for fuel but same size lines (3/8 & 5/16).

Unfortunately for me though, I’ve gotta figure out how to do this right with my newly finished body on! Wish I’d planned things differently but that’s how the timing worked out.

All done except the tank fittings, had to order 5/16 barbs for this AN hose. I won’t put in the vent line until I get the body back on and figure out where I’m placing charcoal canister.

It’s not perfect but came out pretty good for my first time.

Fourth pic is templates I made for the bender, lines mark 0.

Putting fittings on the braided line is a PITA!


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