Fuel Injecting a 351W

[ricks77eb]

I know I will probably get blasted for asking this question because it is such a frequent topic but, I have done numerous searches here and on Broncofix and I have been trying to read on FordFuelInjection.com

I think that I am clear on what I need but if someone sees a mistake please point me in the right direction. This is just a list so if there is something I left off let me know. This is for a 351W to a Mass Air set-up.

- Mass Air Computer (89-93 Mustang)
- Lower GT-40 intake (Lightning Trucks)
- Upper GT-40 intake (Explorer)
- Fuel rails and injectors (89-93 Mustang, can lengthen crossovers 351 for ???)
- Throttle body (89-93 Mustang)
- Distributor with TFI module directly mounted (5.8 litre trucks)
- Wiring Harness (not sure where to get Mass Air 5.8 harness????)
- High pressure and Low pressure fuel pumps (new)
- Fuel accumulator (new)
- O2 sensors and bungs (new)
- Fuel line, fittings, and pump block off plate (new)
- Ignition coil (new)
- Barometric pressure sensor (new)
- Vehicle speed sensor (new)
- Speedometer cable (Early 80's Bronco)

I know some of you SEFI Guru's could probably do this with your eyes closed but I need some help.

I have found a few good writeups for doing the 5.0 but if someone knows a good place for info on doing a 5.8 throw a link in here.

Rick

 

[trailpsycho]

YOu dont need a 5.8 wiring harness, the Fordfuel injection harness should work fine or you can rework a stock Mustang harness, since you will be using that computer, but from everything out there, Ryan's harness is the way to go. I would also try to use the larger throttle body and MAF from the Explorer, they are larger and will flow slightly better for your 5.8 than the stock Mustang units. Others will correct me if I am off on this, but it should be accurate.

 

[SaddleUp]

The post above is correct. The harness you use needs to match the ECM not the cubic inches of the motor. If you run a Mustang ECM then you need the Mustang harness. For the fuel rails they usually are attached to the lower intake. If you get a Lightning lower then there is a good chance it will already be there. If you go with an Edelbrock or other aftermarket intake set then you can do it the way you mentioned. You also don't need a low pressure pump and accumulator. In my opinion they just add 2 more items to the system that could fail where one is all that is necessary. I've run mine for more than a year with just one high pressure pump and I've had it at angles so steep I had to use a winch and could get out and lift the frontend up with one hand. As far as the speedometer cable you can just drill out the hole in the VSS to fit the EB cable housing in it without getting another cable. I've heard that there is one that works from an 80's Bronco but every one that they pulled out at Napa when I was looking had the wrong ends.

 

[blakerj10]

Ok, I am at about the same point, however my 351 is crate moter that I bought in 2000. It is supposed to have 385 HP. It is using a 302 cam I guess because it is the 302 firing order, so I was planning on changing that to a 5.0/351 cam just so the harness is right. But... with this HP rating I think I need 24lb. injectors??? If I go with 24s, what mass air flow sensor and /or what computer would I use? I plan to use the same manifolds listed above and a harness from Ryan. Any suggestions are appreciated.. thanks

PS, do aftermarket head usually have the same holes for accesory brackets as the stock heads. My heads are from world products and I remember having to modifiy the 302 to 351 V belt adapters. I am asking because I am gathering parts for a explorer serp. swap and I am hoping those brackets will work with my heads.

Thanks
Blake

 

[SaddleUp]

Ok, I am at about the same point, however my 351 is crate moter that I bought in 2000. It is supposed to have 385 HP. It is using a 302 cam I guess because it is the 302 firing order, so I was planning on changing that to a 5.0/351 cam just so the harness is right. But... with this HP rating I think I need 24lb. injectors??? If I go with 24s, what mass air flow sensor and /or what computer would I use? I plan to use the same manifolds listed above and a harness from Ryan. Any suggestions are appreciated.. thanks

PS, do aftermarket head usually have the same holes for accesory brackets as the stock heads. My heads are from world products and I remember having to modifiy the 302 to 351 V belt adapters. I am asking because I am gathering parts for a explorer serp. swap and I am hoping those brackets will work with my heads.

Thanks
Blake

The larger injectors aren't going to make a difference unless your running it wide open. If you change them then you at least need a MAF sensor that is calibrated for 24 # injectors. As to whether the 24 lb. ECM is necessary or not I've seen it stated that it is needed and that it is not so I don't really know if it is or not. If I was doing it I would try to find a Cobra ECM.

Regarding the bolts in the head the 5.0 and 5.8 heads are not the same. (Or rather they are not in the same position in relation to the block) I doubt an Explorer setup would work on a 5.8.

 

[hssss]

Please keep in mind all free advice, including mine, is worth at least what you paid for it. That said for the last 10+ years my DD has been a 93 Cobra and a friend in Houstom was the wrench for John Quicks Slot Car Mustangs. What I was told about the Cobra's Maf and computer by Jim Dinkle at http://www.performancepartsinc.com/ is that the Cobra's maf is the same as the Super coup (3.8 blower Tbird) and is calibrated for either 32 or 36 lb( can't remember which) injectors and is modified by the Cobra ECM to 24 lb. The Cobra had a certian amount of waranty protection built into the ECM, in the car with the Cobra stuff it was rated about 40 hp lower than the same spec GT40 crate eng. Firing order the early 302 and 351s had different firing orders, was told to lessen breaking cranks in 351s, when the 302 HO came out they were changed to the 351 firing order. Everything is about the combination and how well it works together, most stock Windsor heads are terrible particularly the ex ports. My understanding is that the GT40P (Explorer) heads are about the best steel/stock heads for the $$. The MAF should be slightly larger than the TB and calibrated for the size injectors and ECM. Basicly set it up as a 89/93 mustang/cobra but don't bother with the Cobra specific ECM or MAF. The best ECM to use if a stick is the A9L or if auto A9P also use A9P if you want to use the Tweecer to allow adjustability. Here goes getting out on the limb, with the use of either GT40 or GT40p heads use a GT40/Lightning/Cobra upper and 351 GT40/lightning lower or aftermarket (Ebay there is a good copy of a popular manifold, search 351 EFI). Fuel rails can be either 5.0(replace plastic crossover with longer piece) 351 EFI lightning or after market($$) depending where you want your fuel feed to come from. Depending on your block, later some 94/all 95/ all 96 are setup for roller lifters use the Ford F cam otherwise use aftermkt of similar specs. With that setup use 77mm MAF, 75mm TB, and 24lb injectors and a good quality external pump. Since you are going to have to run fuel lines anyhow use -8 feed and -6 return lines that way you are covered for bout anything except for a real monster. Anyhow kinda wordy, follow first line and research all statements since if you ask 10 people you will get 12 opinions some of which are not totaly correct. A final warning from another Bronco board be sure vendors can/will supply thier products before commiting and protect yourself when it comes to $$.

 

[Broncobowsher]

OK more info from someone who has a garage full of fuel injection parts. Upper intake, I will narrow it down some more. The mid '97 and newer Explorer intake has an externial EGR valve. This is important because the upper intake no longer has the plumbing for EGR. If you get the lightening lower, it will have a nasty exhaust leak between the upper and lower intake becasue of the slight incompatibility of the intakes.

But if you use GTP heads or aftermarket heads that don't have the EGR crossover ports, then it won't matter. That or you can plug the hole in the lower intake. Either way will leave you without a functioning EGR. There are ways to trick the computer about the EGR.

Now about tricking the Computer. Don't do it. Either go to a custom chip tuner or get a TwEECer and do it right. That way you can go in and tell it your engine size and it can correctly calculate load and give accurate timing tables. Using 302 programming on a 351 the computer will read the higher airflow and calculate higher cylinder pressures then you are really acheaving. This gives retarded timing at cruise, which is safe but not great for power or economy. Idle and WOT will be correct or real close. So bumping the base timing will help cruise, but hurt idle and WOT.

Now for aftermarket recalibrated MAFs, another lie to the computer. It should be recalibrated to tell the computer the engine is only consuming 19/24ths of the air it is actually flowing. This is based on programmed vs actual injector sizes. This again tricks the computer. Now if the computer only did one thing, you could call this a programming adjustment. But since the computer uses several inputs to control several outputs, everything is interconnected. Move one wall and the roof starts to fall down.

Simply going into the computers mind and telling it the truth and it can do amazing things. Fudge a little and it can often just recover on it's own, but fudge a lot and you are left with a stinky brown mess.

 

[SaddleUp]

I've heard Ryan say that you need to run a custom chip or Tweecer too. Perhaps I'm loosing some power with mine by not doing so. If so I don't miss it. I'm quite happy with how it has performed just the way it is in the year I've had it installed and it didn't cost me an arm and a leg for any extra parts.