Is EFI worth it?

[Retoohstyoh]

Looking to possibly go EFI. Motor is stock with 2 barrel. I don't need lots of power but would like the benefit of an easier start. I've heard a lot of good about the 2 barrel Sniper kit but not sure it's worth the $$$. What is your experience with this upgrade and are there any other kits you guys recommend? Or should I just save up for the Sniper?

 

[Steve83]

I'd never use an aftermarket system - what if they go out of business and don't make those parts any more? I've converted a few vehicles from carb to EFI, and I only use stock EFI engines with their factory harnesses & other accessories. They all run perfectly. The '75 Bronco I built for a friend a few decades ago, and then sold for him when he needed something that could tow a 4WD tractor, kept selling for more money each time until it got too far away for me to find the listings. He sold it for $22K; the last time I saw it for sale, it was around $45K.

(click this text)

 

[bronco italiano]

I have a complete Ford SEFI system for sale at about the same price as the Holley complete setup. You are nuts to not go Ford!
My '71 has had the Ford SEFI for 10 years now, just had the ECU maintenance done by EFI guy. Has always worked flawlessly and the sensors are widely available.

 

[904Bronco]

Everyone's experience is going to be different. People will say that their chosen aftermarket EFI, whatever it is, is fabulous, it sucked, or anywhere in between.
I have run/installed Mustang based EFI and Explorer EFI in Broncos. The Mustang works fine, but time has caused the ECU's to be harder to find and costly. Explorer EFI works great, a little more complicated, and still readily available. Replacement parts for both can be found almost everywhere. Aftermarket, off shore parts, have become a concern with their quality at times... And the many knowledgeable people about these two systems helps a great deal.
I have done one 4V Sniper install on a Pontiac 400 motor. This was during Covid times... I was able to buy the unit, replacement tank and in-tank pump. Installation of those items was pretty straight forward. But I could not get the idle below 1100 rpm. It was difficult to talk to a Tech (the same one) on the phone. Extended wait times on the phone, 1.5 hrs was the longest. Hung up a few times in frustration. I collected the system data they asked for and sent it to them... No reply in 5 days. Finally, I talked to a Tech, on a Saturday, hour of hold time, who put in the effort... We agreed that the IAC was defective. I asked for a replacement part, he said I will send you a complete unit. Outstanding I thought... will ship out Monday. Monday I got the return shipping label for the defective unit... 2 weeks later the replacement showed up. Installed it and... low and behold we had a 750 rpm idle. The project took over 2 months to leave my shop. Never again I said.
Now there are others in the NorCal Broncos group I am in who have used Sniper, and after finding a Tuner that can fine tune things love it. Zero issues.
My Biggest fear would be that they discontinue the unit and the parts dry up. The Tech knowledge goes away and the only way to fix your unit is to buy the new and improved one. My first choice is factory Ford EFI.
My .02

 

[nvrstuk]

Another vote for stock EFI even tho I don't run anything but the stock sensors with my 460sbf. I use a stock ECU but it is driven or "managed" by a Moates Qtrhorse chip to tell the stock ECU that I need 2-3x the fuel but it works fantastic and parts are all available and will be till we can't buy gas anymore. lol

Anyway, I have preached on this forum and a dozen others for decades, literally since about 1996 that when you go aftermarket and they dont' support your "bolt-on efi" anymore with needed parts then you are screwed. Holley with their ProJection system who told me 3 yrs after I purchased mine back in the early 90's that when they "ran out" of parts they weren't supporting it anymore, Edelbrock did the same when they discontinued burning chips for their setup in the early 2000's and it WILL happen again when these companies come up with the next new and improved system so we the consumer will buy it to replace what we have. If they didn't do it this way, these companies would go out of business.

Go Ford '89-93 unless you want the totally stock carb look.

 

[nvrstuk]

I didn't really address your original question- lol

Looking to possibly go EFI?

I'm a carb guy, always have been but have to run EFI now because of where and how I drive my Bronco and it's powerplant.

If I had a street Bronco that was my DD I'd go carb (unless supercharged) because yes they can be tuned to start easily, yes they can be tuned to run great down the highway, yes they can be tuned to run in extremely knarly, off camber terrain, yes they can be tuned to pass emissions (harder tho), and yes they are thousands of dollars cheaper than EFI.

I hear repeated examples of guys runnig aftermarket EFI that spend more time and money trying to tune them then they would if they had a carb and I am not exaggerating here!!!! I have SEFI now but it is a lot different and nowhere near stock.

To start a carb'd Bronco you shouldn't have to do more than hop in your rig on a cold morning, press the accelerator to the floor ONCE, turn the ignition key to start and crank it for a few seconds till it starts. It should start up and idle at 1100 rpm or so and when it warms up it will idle down to wherever you set the idle. Just about as simple as that. MILLIONS of cars/trucks ran great with carbs. I worked at a GM dealership when every car they sold had a carb exc the new Caddy Seville- decades ago.

Anyway, carbs set up correctly will run great. If you run Mass Air EFI from '89-93 you should be able to bolt it on and it will run about as perfect as you need for a stock-"ish" engine.

EFI was designed for emissions, not for more power.

 

[Retoohstyoh]

After reading these replies I may work on tuning what I have. My wife wants to drive it in the worst way but sees me struggle at times starting it. Mainly once it’s hot and sits a half hour or so. Maybe I need to experiment with different methods of starting. I’ve read that after hot some people have luck pressing pedal one time and holding down when attempting to start. What other methods work for you guys? Or is there something I should check when tuning to help with my starting issue?

 

[nvrstuk]

Hot start symptoms are generally heat soak issues. Sometimes gas evaporation issues or often called "boiling off".

You might need to isolate the heat from the engine from getting transferred to the carb. This is usually done with a phenolic resin spacer/gasket. Keeps heat transfer down to a minimum.

Holding the pedal down allows more air with less gas

Carter 9600 series carbs are notorious for "losing" the gas in the fuel bowls after sitting. Either a heat issue again or a leak in the bowl allowing the bowl to become dry then you have long crank times when waiting for the fuel pump to fill the bowl then it starts.

I know guys that "fixed" the evaporation issues wirh an electric fuel pump as there's no cranking time to fill the fuel bowl.

 

[Broncobowsher]

EFI will not pay for itself in fuel saved. Get that out of the way.
I swapped EFI (Sniper) onto an otherwise stock engine in an F250. It cruised and drove just like a carburator. At least a good carburator.
Where it was really good. Cold start, no more choke issues. I could start it and throw it in gear and go like a new car.
And hot restarts. The carb would boil the fuel down the engine. Not good for the engine, washed the oil off the cylinder walls. Also hard to start, the half throttle while cranking flooded engine start. That was gone.
And the third thing was the parked for a long time restart. Where the check valves in the fuel pump would not be perfect and after several days it would be dry, as would the carb. And it was either a manual feed the carb with fuel or a lot of engine cranking. I kept a small squeeze bottle of 2-stroke premix for the prime job.

EFI fixed all that. Power got better once I started giving my own timing curves with the sniper.

 

[bronco italiano]

EFI will not pay for itself in fuel saved. Get that out of the way
That is so true, I get about 2mpg better with my EFI than carb. LOL But I love the ease of Ford EFI for starting/idle quality/etc.

 

[1969]

Laughing at these guys above that say “what if the company goes out of business” but then encourage you to find 20-30 year old factory parts that haven’t been made since then. Ford is still around but those parts “have gone out business” decades ago. I’d much rather get a kit from Holley or Edelbrock that currently has support and is still made.

 

[nvrstuk]

OK- not sure what your background is but ... laughing? Really? ...

1- Go find ANY part for a Holley Projection system (other than the OE GM sensor)

2- Go find any part or chip from Edelbrock for their first few versions of their ProFlo.




Ok, now go to a local parts store and find me any part you can't get within a day or two for an '89-93 Mass Air setup for a sbf. They make reman ECU's.

I'll wait as we just went thru this on a friend's rig. Oriellys along with a dozen other places carry ECU's, all sensors, ...everything.

Pics just show one example from Edelbrock.

I can give you dozens more if you'd like???

Oh, and if you read my posts carefully I didnt mention going out of business, I clearly stated that they don't support the system anymore. Clearly stated it.

 

[bronco italiano]

And how many Ford SEFI vehicles are still on the road running strong?
OBD1 corrects itself for optimal tuning on stock/mild engines.
It's like saying the pushrod SBF, hasn't been used in 20 years, but is still the most reliable Ford engine.

 

[Rustytruck]

If your having a carborator fuel supply issue on start up go to an electric fuel pump your issues will vanish much cheaper than any other option. the epa has screwed everything up and that isnt going to change so work your way around it.

 

[Timmy390]

Haters are going to hate as they say. I love my Ford OBDI EFI. No more dealing with jelly in my carb and starts every time no matter how long it sits. Get in and GO. It's been 100% start with a touch of the key since I switched 4 years ago (or has it been longer?)

Was it worth the cost? To me yes because my time is money and I have too many toys to have them all broken all the time due to bad fuel. I plan to put the Sniper on my 69 Stang when I get time to dedicate to the install.

If you drive your rig all the time and it doesn't set but for a day or two you will be fine with the carb. Add an electric pump and that will really help the hot starts.

Tim

 

[MS73HD302]

You aren’t running points by any chance? The cheapest pertronix under the cap upgrade completely changed the game on starting & running for me.

 

[BGBronco]

I went with Fitech a few years ago. Small learning curve in the programming but I have had zero issues with it. Yes, I know everyone hates it, and the customer support, if you have to call, is horrible.

 

[Retoohstyoh]

I have switched to Petronix. I should look into an electric fuel pump. They may just solve my problem. What do you recommend?

 

[nvrstuk]

What you absolutely must do is regulate the fuel pressure to your carb. 5psi is more than enough. Holley made the last accurate low psi regulator when I was doing this stuff 15 yrs ago. Maybe there is something more accurate out there now?


A high quality low pressures electric fuel pump for a carb is getting harder to find.

Might find a consensus here. Make sure they recommend one that has been in use by many people on daily driven cars. Not some garage queen or mall crawler but a fuel pump with miles on it

 

[Timmy390]

What you absolutely must do is regulate the fuel pressure to your carb. 5psi is more than enough. Holley made the last accurate low psi regulator when I was doing this stuff 15 yrs ago. Maybe there is something more accurate out there now?


A high quality low pressures electric fuel pump for a carb is getting harder to find.

Might find a consensus here. Make sure they recommend one that has been in use by many people on daily driven cars. Not some garage queen or mall crawler but a fuel pump with miles on it

Not on my Bronco but on my Samurai, I run a Weber and they're sensitive to fuel pressure. Both my Son N Law and I run the cheap Mr. Gasket regulator and they've served well for several years now. Just a suggestion....I've read bad things but out experience has been good

https://www.holley.com/products/fue...s/regulators/carbureted_regulators/parts/9710

Tim