Looking for Shock Advice

[DirtDonk]

...plz let me know if there are other angles or pix of parts I should upload in order to determine best course of action...thx!

Thanks for the pics. Definitely get some of the rear too, while you're in the mood.
And maybe one or two of the overall vehicle's stance while you're at it.

And speaking of the radius arms... I can't tell for sure, but are the "kinks" (the bends in the middle where the diamond reinforcing plates are welded) bent inward, or outward?

Your front pinion angle is not happy. It's not horrible, and doesn't look like it's totally whacked. But it's getting pretty steep. That's where the driveshaft and u-joint meet the differential yoke.
With that much lift and the longer radius arms (have some extra caster tilt built into them) and bigger C-bushings (might even have gone with 7° versions) they're tilting the pinion yoke down.
Luckily in this case you have the full-width front end, which also means it's a "high-pinion" or "reverse rotation" (misnomer, but in widespread use and makes half-sense anyway) Dana 44 so that gives you a better pinion angle to start with. But 5.5 inches can wreak havoc on lots of things.

You can see if it's causing any trouble at ride height by spinning the shaft by hand. With the hubs unlocked and the t-case in 2wd or neutral, you should feel it spinning pretty smoothly. If you feel it trying to bind slightly when it gets to certain points, then at some point you'll have to deal with that before doing much four-wheeling.

I forgot until just now that this high of a suspension lift is a good reason to keep the high-pinion front end. It was standard on full-size Fords and is stronger by at least 15% (ring and pinion gears riding on the correct gear tooth faces) and it keeps the pinion and caster angles better.

See? And you thought just a few questions and you'd be ready to to drive it into the sunset!;D

Paul

 

[Apogee]

Are you thinking maybe something like a single bilstein 7100 or a fox shock 2.5 with reservoir at each corner?

Either would be a good choice for a rig that sees high-speed, continuous use...aka pre-running, sand dunes, etc. Most quality monotube shocks (Bilstein, Fox, etc) without reservoirs are more than up to the task for the majority of street applications from a performance perspective, so the next question is how much overkill do you need/want and can afford?

Lee at Raceshock.com is a good resource for Bilstein's, but several of the EB parts houses now carry them as well.

I don't think I'm the expert bronconut73 would make me out to be, but I do agree that th 7100 or Fox 2.5's would be a good choice with the proper damping coefficients. While coilovers are definitely cool, they certainly take you into another realm with respect to budget and conventional springs and dampers can be made to work very well.

Tobin

 

[txtruk15]

Thanks for the pics. Definitely get some of the rear too, while you're in the mood.
And maybe one or two of the overall vehicle's stance while you're at it.

And speaking of the radius arms... I can't tell for sure, but are the "kinks" (the bends in the middle where the diamond reinforcing plates are welded) bent inward, or outward?

Your front pinion angle is not happy. It's not horrible, and doesn't look like it's totally whacked. But it's getting pretty steep. That's where the driveshaft and u-joint meet the differential yoke.
With that much lift and the longer radius arms (have some extra caster tilt built into them) and bigger C-bushings (might even have gone with 7° versions) they're tilting the pinion yoke down.
Luckily in this case you have the full-width front end, which also means it's a "high-pinion" or "reverse rotation" (misnomer, but in widespread use and makes half-sense anyway) Dana 44 so that gives you a better pinion angle to start with. But 5.5 inches can wreak havoc on lots of things.

You can see if it's causing any trouble at ride height by spinning the shaft by hand. With the hubs unlocked and the t-case in 2wd or neutral, you should feel it spinning pretty smoothly. If you feel it trying to bind slightly when it gets to certain points, then at some point you'll have to deal with that before doing much four-wheeling.

I forgot until just now that this high of a suspension lift is a good reason to keep the high-pinion front end. It was standard on full-size Fords and is stronger by at least 15% (ring and pinion gears riding on the correct gear tooth faces) and it keeps the pinion and caster angles better.

See? And you thought just a few questions and you'd be ready to to drive it into the sunset!;D

Paul

couple pix of the rear and stance - the radius arms bend outwards...here's what a prior PO wrote up:

"NP435 4 speed w/granny- T-case Dana 20 w/twin stick conversion-Front axle full width high pinion Dana 44, disc brakes, 4.56 gears, Eaton electric locker-Rear axle full width heavy duty 31 spline 9inch 4.56 gears detroit locker-suspension"

 

[DirtDonk]

Cool looking rig! Lots of work went into it. All you need to do is make sure it was done right and that everything is playing nice together.

Could be the angle of the pic, but looks like your tie-rod is slightly bent. Not a big deal as long as the toe-in was reset after the change, but means it's one more thing to check when you get the chance. Proper toe-in will give it better street manners and tire wear.
Also points to the fact that when it's time to replace it, it's a good idea to go with some beef. Those are big tires, on wide wheels, with lots of negative offset (deeper looking, and sticking farther outward given the same width wheel as one with less negative offset) and that puts more stress on the steering linkages.

Was wondering about those radius arms. If the "kink" is outward (rather than the leg being outward) they're installed backwards. This normally would not be a good thing, but it might also be a trick for making things work with full-width front axles. Seems to work...
The kink is usually inward for additional tire clearance when steering. This is probably not a big deal given the wider axle gives the tires more clearance anyway. And again, maybe it's a way of getting things to fit without getting too much more custom.

The rear is definitely a full-width axle as well. It's not only wider, but is the "heavy duty" housing design that was on the bigger trucks and that only the '77 Early Bronco had from the factory.
Nice looking setup. Be fun when you get it dialed in to your liking.

Paul

 

[txtruk15]

Cool looking rig! Lots of work went into it. All you need to do is make sure it was done right and that everything is playing nice together.

Could be the angle of the pic, but looks like your tie-rod is slightly bent. Not a big deal as long as the toe-in was reset after the change, but means it's one more thing to check when you get the chance. Proper toe-in will give it better street manners and tire wear.
Also points to the fact that when it's time to replace it, it's a good idea to go with some beef. Those are big tires, on wide wheels, with lots of negative offset (deeper looking, and sticking farther outward given the same width wheel as one with less negative offset) and that puts more stress on the steering linkages.

Was wondering about those radius arms. If the "kink" is outward (rather than the leg being outward) they're installed backwards. This normally would not be a good thing, but it might also be a trick for making things work with full-width front axles. Seems to work...
The kink is usually inward for additional tire clearance when steering. This is probably not a big deal given the wider axle gives the tires more clearance anyway. And again, maybe it's a way of getting things to fit without getting too much more custom.

The rear is definitely a full-width axle as well. It's not only wider, but is the "heavy duty" housing design that was on the bigger trucks and that only the '77 Early Bronco had from the factory.
Nice looking setup. Be fun when you get it dialed in to your liking.

Paul

I went and looked real close at the tie rod, and darned if it doesn't have a couple of dents in it - just as good as bent imho. Looks like that's a good excuse to beef it up.

This is obviously not an "off-the-shelf" setup I inherited so I can't just buy a part and slap it on and call it a day. I think I need to collect my thoughts and figure out what makes sense for the whole setup and in the future. The whole rig looks very solid and was built to four wheel by the PO in Colorado, but needs some fixing and upgrading so everything stands the test of time and everyday driving.

Seems like I need: 1)new tie rod 2)better angles and TRO conversion 3)new shocks 4) new leaf springs 5)possible steering linkage & column upgrade. Now to tie it all together and keep the cost under a couple of mortgage payments!!!!

 

[73azbronco]

So what damping or rebound is everyone using on single and dual shock setups?

Anyone running King shocks?

 

[txtruk15]

So what damping or rebound is everyone using on single and dual shock setups?

Anyone running King shocks?

those would be my first choice absent any price considerations -

 

[jgrow]

bilstein 7100

No expert here but went from duals all around to single Bilstein 7100 14" valved 360/80 up front and 12" 7100 275/78 in the rear. I run WH 4.5" coils with f250 mounts in front and WH rear shock mount rear. It is night and day from my old dual setup. I live on a dirt road that rarely gets graded...so much nicer now...no more need for a mouthguard when driving down it . Handling was not sacrificed. I drive her 70mph on the highway to work and 50-60 on curvy back roads with no concern of oversteer. Lee at Raceshock helped me as well. One of my favorite 'upgrades' to my beast.

 

[txtruk15]

No expert here but went from duals all around to single Bilstein 7100 14" valved 360/80 up front and 12" 7100 275/78 in the rear. I run WH 4.5" coils with f250 mounts in front and WH rear shock mount rear. It is night and day from my old dual setup. I live on a dirt road that rarely gets graded...so much nicer now...no more need for a mouthguard when driving down it . Handling was not sacrificed. I drive her 70mph on the highway to work and 50-60 on curvy back roads with no concern of oversteer. Lee at Raceshock helped me as well. One of my favorite 'upgrades' to my beast.

thanks for sharing this, it sounds like a great setup. You're not the first to recommend Lee at Raceshock so it sounds like I need to talk to him about my setup...

Bob

 

[bronconut73]

No expert here but went from duals all around to single Bilstein 7100 14" valved 360/80 up front and 12" 7100 275/78 in the rear. I run WH 4.5" coils with f250 mounts in front and WH rear shock mount rear. It is night and day from my old dual setup. I live on a dirt road that rarely gets graded...so much nicer now...no more need for a mouthguard when driving down it . Handling was not sacrificed. I drive her 70mph on the highway to work and 50-60 on curvy back roads with no concern of oversteer. Lee at Raceshock helped me as well. One of my favorite 'upgrades' to my beast.

This/\/\/\/\

 

[ntsqd]

Some folks have found that 360/80 up front isn't enough. Unfortunately the rough limit for a 7100 is 400/100 before you're very likely to bend the shock's shaft. Seen it happen. So if your driving style is more Robby Gordon than Barney Fife talk to Lee about the Fox 2.0 option. Those have a larger OD shaft and can take stiffer valving than the 7100's can. 360/80 is what Bilstein sells for all generic coil sprung applications, you aren't likely to bend the shaft with that valving unless you hit something hard enough that you'll have other problems too. You just can't go stiffer if you find that you want to.

 

[.94 OR]

I only have a 3.5" lift on mine but finally went with the Bilstein 5100's. Love the ride now. I am now looking at installing at least one sway bar for street use.

With your elevation, I would consider something like a front sway bar with a removable link for trail use so that you don't have to over-shock the rig to keep it stable on the street. http://www.wildhorses4x4.com/product/Front-Sway-Bar-Kit/antiswaybar

 

[txtruk15]

I only have a 3.5" lift on mine but finally went with the Bilstein 5100's. Love the ride now. I am now looking at installing at least one sway bar for street use.

With your elevation, I would consider something like a front sway bar with a removable link for trail use so that you don't have to over-shock the rig to keep it stable on the street. http://www.wildhorses4x4.com/product/Front-Sway-Bar-Kit/antiswaybar

that looks pretty good, especially if I do mostly street time - I wonder if any issues if I do a tie-rod over conversion....

 

[DirtDonk]

That's a good question. I think there have been some minor issues with the front bracket at the base of the coil spring. Not much, but enough that some have had to slightly modify things.

However, that bar is made very specifically for an Early Bronco width axle. So some more factoring, figuring and finagling might be needed before making that decision.

Paul