narrowing full size d44 to fit eb

[Bronco73]

WAH is nice but i may never really need something that extreme plus the cost is a bit steap for my needs. i may just have to hold onto one of these axles and haul it with me to FL. ;D

 

[Bronco73]

heres a good link on narrowing the D44 axle. http://www.therangerstation.com/tech_library/narrowing_a_ford_dana44.htm

time to start making some dowels for the ball joints so i can check the camber/caster settings. ;D

 

[Bronco73]

I had one other question. Will a 110 lincoln welder be good enough to plug weld the axle tube? the welder I have is the plus model with variable wire and heat selections and if I recall can weld 1/4 steel with flux core wire instead of gas.

another question has come up. upon reading some info on the net i was reminded of the inner seal which if i read correctly is machined on the inner ID of the axle tube so if I pull the tube from the center housing and cut it I will loose this seal area so of course it would have to be machined in order to work/seal correctly. This complicates things a bit. i now have two options: one is to remove the C and the wedges(<>) and shorten the axle tube and reweld the C and <> onto the shortened axle tube. second option is to pull the axle tube from the center housing and shorten and then machine it for the new seal which be a problem in itself. How does one chuck up and axle tune with a C on one end and the <> still attached to the axle? of course there is the third option of butting the axle tube and welding a sleeve over the butt joint. I may look into sleeving the inside of the axle housing and plug welding it with a butt joint. I am only thinking of an inside tube because of material costs and machine time.

 

[bmc69]

second option is to pull the axle tube from the center housing and shorten and then machine it for the new seal which be a problem in itself. How does one chuck up and axle tune with a C on one end and the <> still attached to the axle? .

Takes a lot more than a 110V machine to do the welding required for an axle...but I suppose you might get enough in just plug welds to make it hold. For replacing the larger stuff like 'C's or a proper butt weld if you go that way...not near big enough.

Note that the OD of the tube is also machined where it is is inserted int the tube. You can't hardly see that ...until you pull it. It's subtle and not a lot off the OD..but it has to be done or it will not go back in after cutting it down. We have a big lathe and the tooling to deal with chunks like that as far as turning ID and OD of the tube....large headstock with large ID..steady rests..etc.

 

[Bronco73]

well i guess will look into sleeving it on the inside or outside. this will be the easiest way.

I have a 175 plus model welder. I have a buddy that has a 220 licoln. I could tack weld it and take it and have it stick welded. What about tig welding?

 

[scsm76]

Use a WAH. Well worth the money once you have one!

A WAH is nice for added flex, I have one myself, but it is basically an axle tube cut in two with a sleeve rosette welded to one side and a hub attached to the outside to keep the two tubes from puling apart while allowing twist. If you just need to narrow an axle and don't need the added flex a sleeve inside the tube rosette welded on both sides and butt welded is much cheaper and just as strong if not stronger than the WAH. Plus I would argue that this joint is stronger than where the tube attaches to the cast center section.

 

[mr.n]

LOL..'booty fab' eh? Heck..I guess a lot of what we do in our 5500 sf machine shop would qualify as booty fab then. Good thing our welders are 'booty fab' certified too.;D Having narrowed so many all the different ways ya can..our booty fab approach has turned out to work the best for us in terms of time requierd for results achieved. We use the same technique for narrowing D60 rears too..gasp!

I'm not knocking the removal of the castings and cutting down the tube end as a good way to go, however..because it is.

I'd bet your machine shop is not certified on much.

Any one who has been through a welding 101 class knows that a butt weld is one of the worst welds there is.

I had one other question. Will a 110 lincoln welder be good enough to plug weld the axle tube?

I rest my case on this shop having no clue.

(Note to jury, he didn't list his shops name or location.)

heres a good link on narrowing the D44 axle. http://www.therangerstation.com/tech_library/narrowing_a_ford_dana44.htm

time to start making some dowels for the ball joints so i can check the camber/caster settings. ;D

Yes, that is the article I was talking about.

However I'd bet therangerstation.com doesn't have permission to publish that article.
Funny part, is I was contacted by the author and given permission to publish that article when he first lost his web page.

bmc69, be careful who you call out. I know a little on the Dana axles.

 

[mr.n]

A WAH is nice for added flex, I have one myself, but it is basically an axle tube cut in two with a sleeve rosette welded to one side and a hub attached to the outside to keep the two tubes from puling apart while allowing twist. If you just need to narrow an axle and don't need the added flex a sleeve inside the tube rosette welded on both sides and butt welded is much cheaper and just as strong if not stronger than the WAH. Plus I would argue that this joint is stronger than where the tube attaches to the cast center section.

Please post a good source backing your information.

 

[mr.n]

I'd suggest a 73-77 1/2 ton axle housing, good core should cost under $100.

Great idea! (I like this guy!)

Those tubes are 1/2" thick and can be easily shortened! Much stronger than a 78/79 thin tubed housing.

 

[scsm76]

Please post a good source backing your information.

If you are as knowledgeable as you claim to be then you would know that the center sections of Dana and other axles built using cast center sections are very prone to cracking where the tubes press in. I can also think of countless people that have twisted the tubes inside the center section breaking out the rosette welds.
The mid tube joint I suggested, as an alternative for someone without the tools to re-tube the axle housing, uses the same principals as the tube to the center section joint. You have a sleeve that slides inside the axle tube further than the tube slides into the cast center section. It is rosette welded, the same as the center section, plus the ends of the tubes are chamfered and welded together. The advantage is that no welding is done to a cast piece that is more prone to cracking and is significantly more difficult to achieve a strong weld on without weakening the surrounding cast iron.
So please show me how a tube inside a cast piece approximately 3" with a couple rosette welds is stronger than a DOM tube several inches into another piece of DOM tube with multiple rosette welds and a chamfered butt weld.

 

[Bronco73]

I may as well jump in. The info scsm76 posted is kind of common sense. i would think one would not need proof to back this statement up as it's pretty much common sense. One couldn't agrue that it isn't stronger, could they? Anything that relieves binding is a good thing and any time you have a tube inside a tube it's going to be stronger, hands down.

I have two axles to play with but a short amount of time. i may try to remove the C cast wedge and see if that is an easier approach. As long as the axle tube doesn't have to be machined down then i'll be okay.

Again for my use of the axle I am not worried about off road strength. if I have to take the axle to a welder that knows how to weld then so be it. besides if the 78/79 axle holds up under the full size bronco then rewelding the end C cast iron back to the axle tube and sticking it under an EB should be fine.

 

[bmc69]

I'd bet your machine shop is not certified on much.


bmc69, be careful who you call out. I know a little on the Dana axles.

Call out??...where I do dat?..you need to chill, pal. You seem to be prone to quick assumption and you know nothing about me or my business. BTW..your excellent Dana site has been bookmarked on my 'puter for years..excellent reference that I use often.

Our shop is a 'skunkworks' operation for Office of Naval Research (ONR) applied R&D and we do a lot of AMV design and speciality production for some foreign navies..weenie things like design and support build of stuff like the little skiff shown below, running at 70 mph in sea trials a couple weeks ago. (OK..sorry..big hijack..but I'm right pround of that vessel...spent 10 yars of my life making it a reality...;D ) We make a few trinkets and prototypes...aluminum and titanium mostly, none of our hydrofoils over 5 or 6 tons in size, but we can 'manage' with steel... We don't need/want to advertise for truck work..that is simply a hobby that the shop provides ample resources for. Our 4 certified welders are kept quite busy as it is. And, if a multi-pass full-pen V-groove butt weld didn't work..you best hope yr not living near a nuke plant..or a gas pipeline..or an oil terminal..or...or....

 

[Bronco73]

okay, I'm out. well not that i was really in. Impressive work Bmc69! by the way I could careless if the thread is hijacked. It won't and doesn't hurt my feelings. It's all good.