Trying to install an NV3550 in my 77 with a J shift tcase. Bought the conversion kit from WH and a JB fab twin stick. Also purchased a new nv3550. Problem lies with the clocking and the sticks. There's no way I can get it in the lowest or stock position as the yoke will hit the trans mount. If I move it up one hole it clears however I cannot bolt up my sticks in either case. AA suggested the trans needed to be redrilled but I'm already in the most clockwise position. My best guess at this point is that there's an issue with the tcase adapter or the sticks but can't confirm which. Any ideas?
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NV3550 Install Problems
- Thread starter Dinosaur
- Start date
Here are the notes I made when I did my conversion a few years ago on my 77 and my experiences with the WH T-case twin shifters... Read down for the part on mounting the shifters and clocking the t-case.
• The fill/drain plugs on mine needed a 19mm allen to remove them. I made one out of a metric bolt with a standard threaded nut welded to it. Put a socket on that…
• Set the pilot bushing in as deep into crank as it will go to give you 1/8” – 1/4” inch more clearance. If you do not, there may be binding where the input shaft tapers back up in size.
• The pilot bushing needs to be soaked in oil overnight.
• I did not have to cut ¼” off the tip off my transmission shaft. I measures tolerances multiple times.
• I bench fitted everything together before putting the assembly in my rig. I put the transmission in first and then added the T-case.
• Buy an alignment tool for a 10 spline disk with a .75 inch diameter pilot bushing center
• I used a 164 tooth, 50 oz, 11 inch flywheel as I have a late model motor in my 77. I was told I could use a flywheel from an 87-91 F-series Truck with a 5.0. After I looked at a new one at NAPA (China), I elected to buy the one from WH which in made in the USA.
• I was told by my pressure plate supplier that the 76-78 trucks had a unique mounting bolt pattern for the pressure plate, most suppliers use a Chevy style bolt pattern which is more common. The WH flywheel was drilled for the unique pattern.
• I used silicon sealer on the flywheel bolts to the crankshaft; this is to prevent oil leakage and was recommended by my engine builder.
• I would recommend running a tap through all the threaded holes to clean up the threads. Do this in the bellhousing, transmission, mounting holes on the frame, etc. I used anti-seize or loc-tite on almost all of my bolts
• I bit the bullet and used the Chrysler trans fluid, you need 2.5 quarts to fill the transmission.
• I cut a 5 inch square hole in the center of the Trans hump on the body. It is a little larger on the driver’s side because of the existing transfer case shifter hole. I made a cover plate to screw down on the body over this hole as suggested in the NV3550 write up in the Tech section. In the front, I cut right up to the body support, but not into it.
• I cut an inspection hole on the driver’s side of the transmission hump with a holesaw; I then cut down the 5x5” piece I removed from the top to make a cover plate. This gave me access to the twin stick shifter mounting bolt.
• I used the twin stick boot from WH and I found a Hurst boot at AutoZone for the transmission shifter. The Hurst boot is mainly a dust/dirt boot, one day I will make a nice one like MarsChariot in the Tech write up. (Hurst # 114 7336, B1 boot and plate. Turn the plate over to not see the Hurst logo)
• With the 1 inch body lift in place, I placed the factory clutch rod next to the adjustable WH rod and made it 1 inch longer. This was my starting point for my clutch adjustments.
• I had to heat and bend (at the existing bend) my transmission shifter from A/A as it hit the dash pad. The first shifter from A/A did not fit my Trans, as mine had the square mount. A/A were very good to work with; they sent me the correct one and a return prepaid UPS label for the wrong one. They make 3 shifters, so you need to make sure to tell them what you have.
• The A/A NV3550 rear adapter now has 3 positions (threaded holes) for clocking the D20; you must use the center (factory position) hole in order for the WH twin sticks to work.
• I have a J-shift D20, the A/A kit is designed to work with the T-shift D20. With the J-shift you must use a twin stick set up. For my rig on the A/A T-case shifter mounting bracket: I had to drill a new hole ¾ “directly above the threaded hole A/A had put in their bracket. I then tapped that hole for a ½ x 13 bolt and used the pivot/mounting bolt that was supplied by A/A instead of the bolt that came with the WH shifters. (Same bolt, it just had the threaded end cut down.)
• With the A/A shifter bracket, I had to round off the top (shifter side) of the bracket for shifter clearance. Basically, 45 the corner instead of 90 degrees. I also had to notch the transmission case webbing just a little, near the top of the bracket support, for the proper fit.
• I had to heat and bend the twin stick shifters for clearance from the transmission shifter. This was done at the existing bends and it did not require a lot of movement.
• I felt most of the bolts supplied in the A/A kit could have been longer, there was room, I purchased longer grade 8 bolts and hardware. This was a personal choice and is probably over kill on my part.
• The supplied A/A crossmember was well built, but the paint was scratched up. I tried to do some touch up with some black Krylon and the factory paint lifted. A can of brake clean removed all of the factory paint and I repainted the crossmember.
• My catalytic converter had to be moved back about 3 inches, a short extension welded to the factory Y pipe and shortening the pipe between the Cat and Muffler.
• I ended up rebuilding my D20 so I upgraded with WH - HD output shaft. This caused me to have to shorten the rear driveshaft. When I got it to the Driveshaft shop I found out it was toast, so now I have a brand new one…
• Wiring: I had a C4 before my conversion and the neutral safety/reverse wiring harness went with the transmission to my neighbor. My 77 had a rubber 4 prong plug from the main harness to the C4 harness. Fortunately for me, I had another 4-prong plug in my box of junk. I wired the neutral safety wires together with this plug and extended wires down the transmission. I already had a GM Weather pack plug, which I wired up the transmission reverse light plug.
• I found, at least with my rig, that I cannot down shift the Trans into 2nd unless I am 20 mph or less. It grinds…
• The transmission feels good with 3:50 gears and 31x10.50x15 tires. RPM is around 1900 @65mph. I have a Carburetor now and I am looking forward to my EFI conversion this summer.
• The fill/drain plugs on mine needed a 19mm allen to remove them. I made one out of a metric bolt with a standard threaded nut welded to it. Put a socket on that…
• Set the pilot bushing in as deep into crank as it will go to give you 1/8” – 1/4” inch more clearance. If you do not, there may be binding where the input shaft tapers back up in size.
• The pilot bushing needs to be soaked in oil overnight.
• I did not have to cut ¼” off the tip off my transmission shaft. I measures tolerances multiple times.
• I bench fitted everything together before putting the assembly in my rig. I put the transmission in first and then added the T-case.
• Buy an alignment tool for a 10 spline disk with a .75 inch diameter pilot bushing center
• I used a 164 tooth, 50 oz, 11 inch flywheel as I have a late model motor in my 77. I was told I could use a flywheel from an 87-91 F-series Truck with a 5.0. After I looked at a new one at NAPA (China), I elected to buy the one from WH which in made in the USA.
• I was told by my pressure plate supplier that the 76-78 trucks had a unique mounting bolt pattern for the pressure plate, most suppliers use a Chevy style bolt pattern which is more common. The WH flywheel was drilled for the unique pattern.
• I used silicon sealer on the flywheel bolts to the crankshaft; this is to prevent oil leakage and was recommended by my engine builder.
• I would recommend running a tap through all the threaded holes to clean up the threads. Do this in the bellhousing, transmission, mounting holes on the frame, etc. I used anti-seize or loc-tite on almost all of my bolts
• I bit the bullet and used the Chrysler trans fluid, you need 2.5 quarts to fill the transmission.
• I cut a 5 inch square hole in the center of the Trans hump on the body. It is a little larger on the driver’s side because of the existing transfer case shifter hole. I made a cover plate to screw down on the body over this hole as suggested in the NV3550 write up in the Tech section. In the front, I cut right up to the body support, but not into it.
• I cut an inspection hole on the driver’s side of the transmission hump with a holesaw; I then cut down the 5x5” piece I removed from the top to make a cover plate. This gave me access to the twin stick shifter mounting bolt.
• I used the twin stick boot from WH and I found a Hurst boot at AutoZone for the transmission shifter. The Hurst boot is mainly a dust/dirt boot, one day I will make a nice one like MarsChariot in the Tech write up. (Hurst # 114 7336, B1 boot and plate. Turn the plate over to not see the Hurst logo)
• With the 1 inch body lift in place, I placed the factory clutch rod next to the adjustable WH rod and made it 1 inch longer. This was my starting point for my clutch adjustments.
• I had to heat and bend (at the existing bend) my transmission shifter from A/A as it hit the dash pad. The first shifter from A/A did not fit my Trans, as mine had the square mount. A/A were very good to work with; they sent me the correct one and a return prepaid UPS label for the wrong one. They make 3 shifters, so you need to make sure to tell them what you have.
• The A/A NV3550 rear adapter now has 3 positions (threaded holes) for clocking the D20; you must use the center (factory position) hole in order for the WH twin sticks to work.
• I have a J-shift D20, the A/A kit is designed to work with the T-shift D20. With the J-shift you must use a twin stick set up. For my rig on the A/A T-case shifter mounting bracket: I had to drill a new hole ¾ “directly above the threaded hole A/A had put in their bracket. I then tapped that hole for a ½ x 13 bolt and used the pivot/mounting bolt that was supplied by A/A instead of the bolt that came with the WH shifters. (Same bolt, it just had the threaded end cut down.)
• With the A/A shifter bracket, I had to round off the top (shifter side) of the bracket for shifter clearance. Basically, 45 the corner instead of 90 degrees. I also had to notch the transmission case webbing just a little, near the top of the bracket support, for the proper fit.
• I had to heat and bend the twin stick shifters for clearance from the transmission shifter. This was done at the existing bends and it did not require a lot of movement.
• I felt most of the bolts supplied in the A/A kit could have been longer, there was room, I purchased longer grade 8 bolts and hardware. This was a personal choice and is probably over kill on my part.
• The supplied A/A crossmember was well built, but the paint was scratched up. I tried to do some touch up with some black Krylon and the factory paint lifted. A can of brake clean removed all of the factory paint and I repainted the crossmember.
• My catalytic converter had to be moved back about 3 inches, a short extension welded to the factory Y pipe and shortening the pipe between the Cat and Muffler.
• I ended up rebuilding my D20 so I upgraded with WH - HD output shaft. This caused me to have to shorten the rear driveshaft. When I got it to the Driveshaft shop I found out it was toast, so now I have a brand new one…
• Wiring: I had a C4 before my conversion and the neutral safety/reverse wiring harness went with the transmission to my neighbor. My 77 had a rubber 4 prong plug from the main harness to the C4 harness. Fortunately for me, I had another 4-prong plug in my box of junk. I wired the neutral safety wires together with this plug and extended wires down the transmission. I already had a GM Weather pack plug, which I wired up the transmission reverse light plug.
• I found, at least with my rig, that I cannot down shift the Trans into 2nd unless I am 20 mph or less. It grinds…
• The transmission feels good with 3:50 gears and 31x10.50x15 tires. RPM is around 1900 @65mph. I have a Carburetor now and I am looking forward to my EFI conversion this summer.
Attachments
Me too!
I'm going through the exact same issue right now. Currently working with AA to get the issue resolved. I went through and did some measuring with the transfer case clocked in different positions and the most counterclockwise hole set (transfer case in the lowest position) places the transfer case in the stock position.
Also measuring where the crossmember positions the transmission and transfer case, the AA setup gets the transfer case outputs within an 1/8" of the stock positioning, pretty dang close all things considered.
The issue looks to be purely a clearance issue with the newer plate style cross member. If you run a search on NV 3550 cross member you'll see others have run into this same problem. Some have clocked the TC in the middle holes, some have cut clearance into the crossmember and I think someone shimmed the trans mount. So far AA's customer service has been very responsive to getting the issue resolved so hopefully we'll have something soon. If it gets draw out for too long I will either modify the crossmember or make my own, but seems crazy to spend that kind of money and have to do that. As soon as I have word back from AA on a resolution I will be sure to get it posted.
I'm going through the exact same issue right now. Currently working with AA to get the issue resolved. I went through and did some measuring with the transfer case clocked in different positions and the most counterclockwise hole set (transfer case in the lowest position) places the transfer case in the stock position.
Also measuring where the crossmember positions the transmission and transfer case, the AA setup gets the transfer case outputs within an 1/8" of the stock positioning, pretty dang close all things considered.
The issue looks to be purely a clearance issue with the newer plate style cross member. If you run a search on NV 3550 cross member you'll see others have run into this same problem. Some have clocked the TC in the middle holes, some have cut clearance into the crossmember and I think someone shimmed the trans mount. So far AA's customer service has been very responsive to getting the issue resolved so hopefully we'll have something soon. If it gets draw out for too long I will either modify the crossmember or make my own, but seems crazy to spend that kind of money and have to do that. As soon as I have word back from AA on a resolution I will be sure to get it posted.
blubuckaroo
Grease Monkey
What is the "yoke" you refer to?
The fit is tight between the TC and cross member. There's no getting around that.
Check to see if your cross member has been notched for clearance as referred to in the instructions.
Are you sure you have the tranny mount assembled properly?
The fit is tight between the TC and cross member. There's no getting around that.
Check to see if your cross member has been notched for clearance as referred to in the instructions.
Are you sure you have the tranny mount assembled properly?
Attachments
I attached some of the pictures I sent to Advance Adapters to explain the issue. One picture is with the transfer case clocked in the counterclockwise (lowest) holes showing the lack of clearance between the front output yoke and the crossmember. The other 3 pictures are with the transfer case clocked in the middle holes.
Attachments
whileImhere
Newbie
- Joined
- May 18, 2011
- Messages
- 42
I also had trouble with clearance with the wh cross member. Tried clocking the tc up a notch but it put the driveshaft at too severe an angle. Ended up scrapping the stamped wildhorses cross member and got the 3 pc. cross member from Tom's. Clocked to stock and it fits fine with plenty of clearance (and no hacking).
ChrisC74
Sr. Member
- Joined
- Dec 9, 2010
- Messages
- 904
AA's customer service does a really good job making unhappy customers think they care. They are perfectly happy to let all of us take photos make notes, take measurements and send them to them for review, but at the end of the day they do not come through with a solution after you spent good money and extra effort on the kit in the first place.
Yeah, I am a little bitter on this subject and it is too bad that it sounds like the new cross members are not any better than the last model... I have tried to hold tongue on this subject so long I think I have bit the end off. It is not my nature to complain but this repeated issue drives me nuts.
Strongly recommend you mod what you have and move on because if not you may be sitting still for a long while. Do what you have to do to get the trans installed. You will enjoy it.
On the other hand, if you need tech support on the JB Fab twin sticks you should contact Jon w. JB Fab. I don't think I have met another vendor who has stood behind his product as well as he does yet in this industry.
The yoke where the front driveshaft attaches. Yes I've triple checked the the trans mount bracket. I have a different crossmember than the one in the instructions. I've spent several days taking the tcase in and out trying to find the cultprit or correct arrangement.
That looks like my issue
What tcase shifter are you using? Does Toms sell the crossmember only?
whileImhere
Newbie
- Joined
- May 18, 2011
- Messages
- 42
So I'm clear, the (no hacking) refers to the cross member and not the tunnel/cover. Mine is a twin stick from wh's.
Yes to tom's selling just the cross member. http://www.tomsbroncoparts.com/product/nv3550-cross-member-only-new-66-77-ford-bronco
Because it is narrower than the wh crossmember, there is room for the flange/shaft to clear. hth
UPDATE....according to AA the latest batch of their new cross members were drilled incorrectly where the trans mount attaches. They say the holes are 1 inch to 1.5 inches from where they should be (should be further over to the passenger side). They won't have any new ones until the end of the month. Going to attempt to drill this one in the meantime. That should solve my yoke interference issue but not sure about the shifters. Guess we'll see this weekend. Thanks for all of the input.
Other Update
After working with AA on making a design revision to allow more front driveshaft clearance and not getting the kind of results I was hoping for I modified my crossmember, ChrisC74 was right on with his suggestion on how things would play out.
When I did my first clearance measurements I did it with the crossmember partially bolted in and failed realize that to get it completely bolted in, all eight frame bolts installed, the crossmember gets rotated forward (font lip down) flexing/rotating the rubber trans mount. With it completely installed I ended up with about an eight of an inch of clearance between the CV on the driveshaft and the front lip of the crossmember. This is with stock suspension at ride height. I wanted more clearance than that so I went ahead and notched the crossmember giving about 10 times as much clearance as I really needed but I figured too much was better than not enough.
My side to side positioning put the tail shaft about 1/2 an inch towards the pass side when compared to stock, but that wasn't giving me any issues so I didn't do any re-drilling.
If I was to do it all over again I'd try the Tom's crossmember, it sounds like it works great out of the box.
After working with AA on making a design revision to allow more front driveshaft clearance and not getting the kind of results I was hoping for I modified my crossmember, ChrisC74 was right on with his suggestion on how things would play out.
When I did my first clearance measurements I did it with the crossmember partially bolted in and failed realize that to get it completely bolted in, all eight frame bolts installed, the crossmember gets rotated forward (font lip down) flexing/rotating the rubber trans mount. With it completely installed I ended up with about an eight of an inch of clearance between the CV on the driveshaft and the front lip of the crossmember. This is with stock suspension at ride height. I wanted more clearance than that so I went ahead and notched the crossmember giving about 10 times as much clearance as I really needed but I figured too much was better than not enough.
My side to side positioning put the tail shaft about 1/2 an inch towards the pass side when compared to stock, but that wasn't giving me any issues so I didn't do any re-drilling.
If I was to do it all over again I'd try the Tom's crossmember, it sounds like it works great out of the box.
Attachments
- Joined
- Mar 28, 2012
- Messages
- 3,559
I followed this with interest. I have the same problem PLUS the dreaded 1973 hole alignment problem for the trans mount. I heard that it was somehow related to 1973 Broncos (why? Who knows?), but now I'm thinking I got one that was drilled wrong per Dinosaur. Maybe the Bronco houses should get together and put a little pressure on AA to fix this issue.
ChrisC74
Sr. Member
- Joined
- Dec 9, 2010
- Messages
- 904
AZ73, I do believe Paul with Wild Horses tried to put the squeeze on AA. AA just flat does not care. Anyone looking at this swap should seek out a non-AA crossmember or be prepared to get your hands dirty. And the dreaded hole alligment issue carried over to some 74's also but this latest revision was supposed to correct or allow for that. I am glad I did not wait for them or pay for the new x-member like I was considering.
lgdpt
Sr. Member
- Joined
- Sep 1, 2012
- Messages
- 413
So is it still not fixed? I picked up my kit last month... I was told they fixed the problem?
Not sure what they are going to do moving forward. I drilled my crossmember about 1 inch over from where it was and had them ship me a new one when available. It appears to be identical except with two sets of holes. I also ran into a vertical issue and had to install spacers between the tranny and bracket so the front shaft would clear. Got everything working smooth and after about 500 mi my rear joint is toast. Never ends...
Crossmember!
Wish I had stumbled upon this thread back in April or May when I ordered mine. Had to wait 1 1/2 to 2 months for transmission to get in because they were "redesigning" the crossmember. Finally get it in in July, passes the eye test. Take it to a local mechanic for install. I know I cheated. He gets swamped and I don't get it back till yesterday. Read this thread and remember that bronco didn't have front driveshaft when I took it to him. I looked this morning and I have about 1/2" clearance. I hope it's enough to clear cv joint.
Wish I had stumbled upon this thread back in April or May when I ordered mine. Had to wait 1 1/2 to 2 months for transmission to get in because they were "redesigning" the crossmember. Finally get it in in July, passes the eye test. Take it to a local mechanic for install. I know I cheated. He gets swamped and I don't get it back till yesterday. Read this thread and remember that bronco didn't have front driveshaft when I took it to him. I looked this morning and I have about 1/2" clearance. I hope it's enough to clear cv joint.
elliottferrell
New Member
well this is an eye opener...
