Should I Or Shouldn't I?? 351c

[Skuzzlebutt]

The 2V Cs are the better choice for most real world driving. i.e. higher torque in low thru mid range RPM. The narrower intake runners increase the velocity of the mixture.
The 4V has higher peak numbers, but not in the range where most driving is done.

 

[RajinCajun]

I will put my two cents in.. I say sell the Cleveland to someone with a Mustang that is trying to keep the nostalgia. Build you a good strong 351W.. The problem with the Cleveland is getting parts, they only made them for a few years. I had one in a Heep, and I hated it when I tried to get any parts..... Now it was fun to put into 4L and hammer the gas and shift the ratchet shifter at about 4000RPM.. WOW!! It would almost pull the front wheels I think...but low end torque wasn't really there. I know, I know, that could have been fixed with a cam, intake, carb etc... but I traded that Heep for another one with a brand new 350....then I found out I was having triplets.... so the Heep had to go... But it worked out, I got my Dad's Bronco shortly after...

 

[Madgyver]

Go for it and drop that C in your ride..
Don't let anyone discourage you, Just Do It!
I can make the 351C4V sing with globs of torque. Who said it can't be done?

This may get some attention in a stock uncut EB......with hubcaps ;D

 

[bax]

Go Bigger. Once your into making custom headers you might as well go for "More cubes" A good 390, 429, 460. If you put the same money your going to put in that 351 into any of the above, you will have a torque monster.

Or not.

 

[broncnaz]

2 bolt cleveland blocks were just as stout as the 4 bolt blocks no real benifit other than you can say you have a 4 bolt.
I would defintely do some research on this swap as I said all the swaps I've seen were crappy in my opinion with butchered core supports to make room. Didnt really look at much else after seeing that. So I'm not sure if inner fenders were still there or not. Almost bought a decent bronco for $2500 until I saw the C in it and the damage done to shoehorn it in. probably should have bought it and ditched the C but at that time there were few sheet metal parts availible for EB's.

 

[Broncogirlie]

I say pull it apart and check it over...right down to the cylinder walls. Plastigauge it and measure everything. All its going to cost you is a gasket kit if nothing is wrong. Its always good to know why your engine makes the noises it does.

 

[supercoupe5]

you allready have the engine so it is yours. if you cant get enough money for it go to coast high performance get there 393 stroker kit put it in your rig and go tear up the sand mud dirt or pavment

http://www.coasthigh.com/Assemblies/Ford/ford_393c.htm

 

[bmc69]

2 bolt cleveland blocks were just as stout as the 4 bolt blocks no real benifit other than you can say you have a 4 bolt.
I would defintely do some research on this swap as I said all the swaps I've seen were crappy in my opinion with butchered core supports to make room. Didnt really look at much else after seeing that. So I'm not sure if inner fenders were still there or not. Almost bought a decent bronco for $2500 until I saw the C in it and the damage done to shoehorn it in. probably should have bought it and ditched the C but at that time there were few sheet metal parts availible for EB's.

All good points and I agree on the 2 v 4-bolt strength not being a factor unless you are planning for 7000 RPM. I have seen very clean 351C swaps and cannot understand for the life of me why any butchery would be required..I'm using 400s in my EB builds and the only thing I have to modify is a small section of the drivers side firewall to clear the head on the taller block..wouldn't even have to do that with the 351C.

 

[bmc69]

Go Bigger. Once your into making custom headers you might as well go for "More cubes" A good 390, 429, 460. If you put the same money your going to put in that 351 into any of the above, you will have a torque monster.

Or not.

Sanner makes some shortie headers that fit the 351C in an EB. As for 'go big' versus 'install hassle", I can speak to the issues involved in stuffing the taller, BB bolt-pattern 400 in an EB..and from that can gurantee you that the FE or 385-series swaps would be far more difficult. Besides, the 351C that crab has snagged has gobs of potential performance that needs only a few very basic mods to unlock..cam, intake/carb, and re-curved dizzy are pretty much all it needs to be plenty evil in an EB.

 

[meathead333]

heres the link for the headers for the 351c...its on my list of things to buy wheni become rich ;D

http://www.sandersonheaders.com./pagesbypartnum/fc3.htm

 

[bmc69]

heres the link for the headers for the 351c...its on my list of things to buy wheni become rich ;D

http://www.sandersonheaders.com./pagesbypartnum/fc3.htm

LOL..Sanderson...that's them. Sanner is a local guy to me that races with us and I always mix 'em up. ;D

Another option is to just use the exhaust manifolds off a late 70s/early 80s 351m/400 truck..that is what I use for my Cleveland EBs. They are nice-flowing pieces of iron in fact..they are more like cast headers than the restrictive things that Ford put on 302/351W engines, or the FE motors too for that matter. The performance benefit of using headers over stock manifolds is therefore not as great for the Cleveland (2V heads only, I'm talking about..before Madgyver jumps in.. ;D ) and you gain the reliability of using cast iron manifolds. Just for info..

 

[Madgyver]

I got a set of ceramic coated Sandersons FC3s for my Aussie heads on a stroked 393W. I won the bid on ebay

 

[bmc69]

I got a set of ceramic coated Sandersons FC3s for my Aussie heads on a stroked 393W. I won the bid on ebay

Nice. Sure am glad that I am not the only guy here that uses Cleveland iron everywhere he can..but I'm running the Oz heads on a 400 (408)...and on the 434-stroker that is going together now. We have not built any Clevors in at least 10 years....but I'm sure we will again. ;D

 

[crab]

I say pull it apart and check it over...right down to the cylinder walls. Plastigauge it and measure everything. All its going to cost you is a gasket kit if nothing is wrong. Its always good to know why your engine makes the noises it does.

The beauty of the deal is, it came with a complete gasket set and new valley pan ;D

 

[feitctaj]

Nice. Sure am glad that I am not the only guy here that uses Cleveland iron everywhere he can..but I'm running the Oz heads on a 400 (408)...and on the 434-stroker that is going together now. We have not built any Clevors in at least 10 years....but I'm sure we will again. ;D

SHhhhhhhh!?!?!
you are educating people, and my negociating is getting tough, pretty soon they are going to find this site and double the price ;D

 

[bmc69]

SHhhhhhhh!?!?!
you are educating people, and my negociating is getting tough, pretty soon they are going to find this site and double the price ;D

Oops..sorry. Hope I didn't mess ya up;D . Not to worry..400's are still widely assumed to be junk, so we 'believers' are OK for a long time to come.

 

[broncnaz]

All good points and I agree on the 2 v 4-bolt strength not being a factor unless you are planning for 7000 RPM. I have seen very clean 351C swaps and cannot understand for the life of me why any butchery would be required..I'm using 400s in my EB builds and the only thing I have to modify is a small section of the drivers side firewall to clear the head on the taller block..wouldn't even have to do that with the 351C.

Thats good to hear I wasnt sure about some of these guys putting C's in because all the ones I've seen were butchered and that really turns me off of it. but If the 400 fits with minor fitting then a 351 should fit with out any butchering. Thats the kind of swap I like to see.

 

[68beast]

I can vouch for the no butchery required as mine sits with stock inner fenders, firewall, and hood. However the ports on the radiator have to be switched and there is some hood clearance issues with out a bodylift, all of which can be overcome and still retain all stock sheet metal. The Sanderson headers fit real nice and sound great too. And while parts may be hard to find it is possible. You may want to look into a rear sump oil pan too, I can clear my front sump with a 5.5" lift but I think it would be better to have a rear sump. Also cleavelands are known to have oiling issues (mabe not a problem with normal street driving) One way to fix this is oil restrictors made by moroso, but all I did was put in a high volume oil pump. All in all I like my cleveland, having somehting different grows on you .

 

[bmc69]

68beast is right on the money. I'm running the front sump pan with 5.5" lift too. I did my own radiator configuring starting with an aluminum one from Universal. As for the oiling problems, an HV pump takes care of them for anything but a pretty wild engine..and then there are other tricks that are super easy to do to keep the #3,4 and 5 main bearings happy if you are going for the wild side.....which I tend to do for some reason.

Speaking of which, a set of Aussie closed-chamber heads would really be easy to bolt on while you have it apart..or I have a line on a set of Boss 351C closed chambers with studs and guide plates....hee hee..this could get ugly early.

Me..I love my Oz-408s...I never get tired of the "what the heck have you GOT in that thing?" question. ;D

 

[Desert Thrasher]

I love my cleveland in my bronco. It fits like it was made for it. No butchery at all. I do have a body lift and I know that helps a lot with any clearance issues. I think the stock throttle linkage would be a tight clearance without a bodylift, but I use a Lokar pedal and cable linkage. The Sanderson FC3 headers are great, use a 351m\400 rear sump 4x4 oil pan or an aftermarket pan.
As for the common misconception about clevelands having no low end torque, thats a load of BS. The torque ratings for the C and the W are equal for the 4 years the cleveland was made. True the 4v heads do love to breathe at the upper end, but the 2v heads work far better than any stock windsor head.
Edelbrock just came out with some nice aluminum 351c heads and an air-gap intake. Plus many other aftermarket parts are available. They are great engines and I will only run clevelands in my bronco from now on.