Steering not returning to center

[smoot75eb]

Hi all,
I'm having a fit with this bronco steering. Any ideas/ suggestions would be much appreciated. The bronco will not return to center. It feelsl a little tight but no bind from lock to lock. It has been completely gone thru and is new except for the 76 steering box which doesn't leak. barely any slop in the box. It tracks straight. No real bump steer. Geometry is good with DL and TB.
it feels unstable at 50mph + or under hard braking the rear end wants to dive to the right side. Frame was all checked before restoration started. It is straight with Ford specs.
Specs are:
Alignment has been done twice
Caster +5 degrees
Camber +.25 LF +.35 RF
Toe is set at 1/8"
3.5" Duff Lift Kit with HD 11 packs in rear.
7 degree caster bushings (new) Installed correctly!!!
Radius Arm Drop 3.75" with stock radius arms
New trailing radius arm bushings
Saginaw Pump (New)
Lines are all new
Drag Link and Tie Rod setup are heim joint (New)
Trac bar has been lengthened.
TB Riser welded on Axle
Stock Pitman Arm
Stock 76' front sway bar.
New ball joints all around and have been checked 3 times for proper torque.

 

[66broncoCT]

With +5 degrees caster I would expect it to return to center pretty well. With the steering linkages disconnected how hard is it to turn each wheel? They should move freely but I've seen some get tight with new ball joints. Not sure if that's what you mean when you say you've checked the proper torque on them or not. That's the only thing I can think of you'll have to wait for someone else to chime in.

 

[smoot75eb]

I know man this is why its got me scratching my head. It all moves freely without any weight on it and disconnected all links. Yeah that is what I was meaning with the torque.
I should also mention it has brand new 33x12.50R15 Bf KM2's on it with the 76 Front D44 with all new u-joints Calipers and pads and lines. When I first drove it after 4 years of the build took it immediately to alignment. With the 7 degree bushings and no radius arm drop
it had -1.5 caster. Duff told me that is rare for the axle to be still negative with 7 degree bushings. "They must be installed incorrectly" I took it all apart and they were correct. So I did the radius arm drop brackets. It apperently isn't standard to have to do that with only a 3.5" lift. But it got my caster numbers correct.

 

[SteveL]

I/8" might be light on the toe in. I used the instructions on the bc site and I think I went 1/4" with 33s. Before you set up your did you center your box? With the drag link off the pitman count turns each way and you should feel a bump or flat spot in the steering gear. Then adjust the drag link to fit. Also make sure the tires are straight before you adjust it. Also pulling on hard braking can be a leaky caliper or wheel cylinder making one tire sticky.

 

[SavageBurro]

Is the d44 a high pinion that someone narrowed and swapped in? If so they could have welded the wedges on at a funky angle and that could explain the caster. Just spit balling.

With the wandering... have you checked the rear u bolts for tightness and rear spring bushings for wear? Proper size bolts in the track bar? Have you had someone move the steering back and forth while you watch the linkage - looking for undesirable movement or slop?

 

[SavageBurro]

Also... is the pitman arm properly indexed on the box. Meaning when your tires are pointed straight is the box at its center position?

 

[smoot75eb]

Pitman arm definately is centered with 2 turns either direction lock to lock. Its a factory 76 setup. My family had the 76 before it met its demise in the salt belt. I know it was never chopped up. I snatched it for all the goodies under it. So not a HP. All bushings are brand spankin new.everyone of them. I just went and checked all for tightness. U bolts and all. I will definately check the rear wheel cylinders too. Again they are all new and bled. I will bleed it again. Going to check the toe here in a little bit. Thanks to all you guys!

 

[77BRONKOTN]

So I did the radius arm drop brackets. It apperently isn't standard to have to do that with only a 3.5" lift. But it got my caster numbers correct.

Mine only felt right with drop brackets, on the lowest hole. I have a 77 with about the same everything you have.

I dont have alignment numbers because I did the align in the basement

 

[B RON CO]

Hi, I'll just ask a simple little question after I mention my Dana 40 upper ball joints were very stiff after torquing up to specs with the 4 prong socket. I loosend them up a little and the steering knuckles freed up ( more on one side, forget which side was tighter).
Do you have very deep dish rims, or more of a stock offset?
If you move the tire out with deep dish rims the front end loads much differently than stock
Good luck

 

[DirtDonk]

Definitely that!
Was going to ask what size wheels you have too. And since it's a '76 with "those" knuckles, you by necessity have to either get wheels with less backspacing, or use spacers. Both of which make things a little funky up front.

And it definitely sounds weird with the first caster result. Maybe you have an early '76? Most of the time, by late '75 or early '76 the axles were coming from the factory with much more caster already built into them. I doubt if they made a change based on whether or not the vehicle it was going in had power steering or not, but since power steering was so common by then, they had more caster apparently. To have negative caster still with 7 degree bushings is indeed odd. But to gain 6 degrees just from radius arm brackets is odd too! I wonder if the Duff brackets go that far? I thought it was only 4 degrees, but obviously I could be wrong.

But the bottom line is that not many have ever had a Bronco that returned to center like you'd expect a car too. You definitely need to make sure the knuckles are not dragging (pun intended) and all the other things are optimized, but even with the '76's attempt at better Ackerman angle, EB front axles were always imperfect.
There are some here that have reported decent return-to-center, but they're few and far between. So yours may not be out of line. Are you basing it on previous experience with Broncos? Or is this the first Bronco you've spent any time with?
If the former, how did the other Broncos act on return-to-center?

You could try some toe-out to see how it reacts.
And you should definitely check your front pinion/driveshaft angle to make sure you're not binding when in 4wd. Or if you never use 4wd, just take the shaft off so someone doesn't put it in by accident and damage a u-joint or worse.
But if your pinion angle is still ok with 13 degrees of caster correction, then you do indeed have an odd duck.
We'd love to see pics of your setup. Just because we like pics and mysteries too!

Sounds like yours is pretty well dialed-in from what you've already done. Maybe it's just that the lack of return-to-center is the normal amount. For a Bronco...

Paul

 

[smoot75eb]

I also used the caster/ camber bushings to gain +1.5 caster. They are in fact MT 15x10 with 3.625 BS. Deep dish I never considered that. I set toe at 1/4 and removed the stabilizer. Drove it home last night much better. I can deal with it anyway. I would still like to use 4wd. I will post some pics. All appreciated.
Driving my old 74' with stock setup I don't remember driving bad at all. Maybe I'm just getting old. With a wife and a 4 year son riding with me. I just want to be damn sure I have something as safe as it can be.

 

[DirtDonk]

How is your heim steering set up?
I forget if you said tie-rod over or under?
Where is the draglink attached? All the way at the knuckle, or on the tie-rod itself?
Is this a '76 frame? Or the '75 in your username?

Since you have a riser and no dropped pitman arm, I was curious how it's set up, and how parallel the two bars really are between their pivot points.

Paul

 

[smoot75eb]

Donk,
It's tie rod under with drag link all the way over above knuckle with misalignment spacer for better rotation of the rod end. 75 frame. 75 trac bar all else is custom or 76. Both trac and drag are in fact parrallel just not the same length. I will add some pics tomorrow evening.
They measured at 14 degrees both DL TB.

 

[72Sport]

Friend had the same problem with his stock 72. He brought it over and I laid under it while he turned the wheel side to side with the wheels on the pavement. One tie rod end was not tight. The cotter pin had been installed. We tightened the rod end and the problem went away.