14 Piece and Body Mount Bushings questions

[DJT]

After a lot of researching of past posts I'm ready to change out my bushings, but I still have several questions.
My rig has a 3 1/2 lift.
(I'm assuming because my axle to frame measures 10" front AND back, is this correct?)

So my first thought is that the body mounts should be changed first, because from what I understand there should be a difference of roughly an inch from front to back and also I'd want to start this project as level as possible, is this correct?

My next question is regarding the track bar and drag link.
Does my alignment warrant a drop pitman arm? I have 33's and it's definitely squirrely on the road over 30 mph.

And lastly, has anyone seen this drag link before? I feel like I haven't seen one with this kind of end that connects to pitman.

BTW I have zero history from previous owner

Thanks in advance...

 

[Brent13]

I am a novice, but I notice two things wrong. It appears your track bar drop bracket is not welded. As far as I have been told, it needs to be bolted and welded. And yes, you need a drop pitman arm. Your track bar should run parallel to your drag link. Yours is way off. I believe a drop pitman arm will get you where you need to be. That's all I got.

Brent

 

[doghows72]

Drag link looks strange to me? As Brent said your trac bar and drag link need to be at the same angle. You have two solutions. One remove the bolted on trac bar drop braket and put the bar back in the original hole. However the could move you axle off center as in to the drivers side.
Two get a drop pitman arm but be ready to get a new drag link to as it probably won't fit the new pitman arm.

 

[Broncobowsher]

That front end has not been setup correctly.

The drag link is correct. That is the original style used in a few years.

Since the drop bracket isn't welded on, at this point I would take it off. It is actually working against you. It is conflicting the arc of travel with the steering. If those springs have any give to them, you will have bumpsteer issues. Squirrly over 30, that is probably the bumpsteer. 3½" of lift I think there should be corrections made to the steering and draglink. But it is a both or neither, not just one or it will be worse (like what you have now)

There are 2 ways to correct the drag link. Drop bracket like you have now. Tends to crack the frame and prevents a tie rod over steering conversion. Or a axle riser bracket that has become a lot more popular in the past decade. The downside is the passenger side front suspension bumpstop is different than the driver's side. But generally you should adjust the bumpstops with the lift anyway to keep the tires out of the body at full suspension compression. You only want one of the fixes, not both.

Steering can be corrected in many ways. Again, only one fix, not multiple. Drop pitman arm is old school. puts more leverage on the steering box and the frame (also known for cracking). you can convert to tie rod over which also gets the tie rod further from harms way but will not clear a drop track bar frame bracket. Also Heim steering that puts the drag link pivot on the passenger knuckle in instead of onto the tie rod. There is a lot of adjustability on this one as well. I have seen a drop pitman arm used, but the heim mounted on top of the pitman arm all in the name of getting the angles right.

Need to figure what the final product will be so you don't end up undoing something needlessly.

 

[DirtDonk]

...My rig has a 3 1/2 lift.
(I'm assuming because my axle to frame measures 10" front AND back, is this correct?)

Close. You're within a half an inch either way at either end, which is within reason. Especially for an older suspension.
Your numbers indicate approx. 3 in the front and 4 in the back.

So my first thought is that the body mounts should be changed first, because from what I understand there should be a difference of roughly an inch from front to back and also I'd want to start this project as level as possible, is this correct?

There is no "supposed to be" all the time. Sometimes it's just about how you want it. The body lift will not effect how the truck sits with regard to front and rear stance. Each body cushion is 3/4" tall when new, and all 8 are the same height.
Your suspension measurements are 7" front and 6" rear at stock height. This may be where you got the 1" difference from?
This difference goes along with a fairly level body perhaps, but here again, how you want it to sit is up to you. So I would measure the body lines to see how level they are from the ground, then change the suspension accordingly.
But only after you get some other things dialed in.

Does my alignment warrant a drop pitman arm?

As the others have indicated, yes you do. But how you fix that might also depend on how you intend to use it. For instance, if you're just going to cruise the streets and not do any four wheeling, you would maybe keep the drop bracket (or get a different one) and add the pitman arm to bring things into better alignment.
Or if you want the higher strength components, ditch the drop, install a riser, change the linkage to tie-rod over, and then fiddle with things until they're finely tuned and work together.
One is simpler, one is tougher.

Depending on what you want to use the rig for, you still have a Dana 30 front axle assembly under there too, which is the lesser of the two available ones. The bigger one being the Dana 44.
Your tires are not huge, but they're big enough to take into account when deciding the future of the truck.

BTW I have zero history from previous owner

Oh goody...%)
This means you get to learn everything the hard way. Or the good way, depending on how you look at it. But you sure will be finding out why we dearly love our "PO's" (previous owners) with a vengeance.

Paul

 

[DJT]

Thanks guys for all the responses...
My rig will only see local street driving no wheeling .

Your suspension measurements are 7" front and 6" rear at stock height. This may be where you got the 1" difference from?

DirtDonk that is where I got the 1" difference.
I thought it might be necessary to replace the worn body mounts and get everything even before I started on the suspension bushings.

The drag link is correct. That is the original style used in a few years.

Broncobowsher, do you recommend keeping this drag link? It doesn't seem to even have a bushing in it at the pitman arm end...

If I'm just gonna be be doing light driving on the streets, should I just ditch the drop bracket all together and get a drop pitman?

 

[DirtDonk]

...I thought it might be necessary to replace the worn body mounts and get everything even before I started on the suspension bushings.

Always a good plan. Even if just to take some stress off the body and door alignment. But definitely for the level "look" too.

Broncobowsher, do you recommend keeping this drag link? It doesn't seem to even have a bushing in it at the pitman arm end...

I'll take a stab at answering that question too. I'd replace it and keep it only as a keepsake, or to sell to someone doing a religious restoration.
I'd be very surprised if it was even still good. All steering components need to be very tight and free-moving (greased) to keep a Bronco happy on the street.
For normal sized tires and easy driving, it's size is not an issue. It's just whether or not it's actually got years of wear and tear on it.

If I'm just gonna be be doing light driving on the streets, should I just ditch the drop bracket all together and get a drop pitman?

NO!!!!
Ok, got your attention? ;D Just so you know, it's exactly that light driving that needs the most correct steering geometry you can achieve. Slow trail riding couldn't care less, but higher speed stuff (in other words, street driving) and the desire to be able to track straight down the road dictate that you fix your steering angles after a suspension lift is installed.
Any lift, and that includes even the lowly 2.5" versions, change the working angles of the steering linkage. And while those smaller lifts don't change it as much as a 3 or taller does, even they can benefit from steering correction components. And since you're at least three inches above stock, you need them.
You could remove the bracket of course, but the overall angle is just as important as the bars being parallel. Going without drops would make the angles steeper, and negate any benefit you might get from their use.

I believe it was mentioned already, but with a setup like yours you do BOTH a pitman arm and a trackbar drop bracket. Not one or the other, but both.
The exception to that rule is if you make other changes to warrant a different approach.
But for now, you want both.

You might also find that your particular drop bracket is not a perfect match to newer pitman arms. In which case you'd just need a different arm. However yours is a nice one and should be used if possible. It looks like it'll work, but you won't know until you get the arm installed.
Once it's verified that everything is working together, you should have the bracket welded in place. Just bolting it leaves room for more flex and that ends up letting the truck wander slightly on the road.

Paul

 

[Pa PITT]

.. I was going to say That a stock original track bar. I think it has an adjustment screw plug to tighten it up in the end of it.. I have one of the tools to adjust it.
... It's basically just a 1/2 drive socket. With a great big straight blade screw driver blade on it. .. I used it on a 1937 chevy 2 door coupe I had as a teenager.
...................
...2 nd question I have is how can you look at those springs & see that they are going to be Squirrely. That would be a great tip to know.

 

[DJT]

Thanks Paul and everyone else for clearing everything up for me, I'll catch on eventually!
I'm sure I'll be back with more questions once I get into it...

.. I was going to say That a stock original track bar. on it. .. I used it on a 1937 chevy 2 door coupe I had as a teenager.
...................
...2 nd question I have is how can you look at those springs & see that they are going to be Squirrely. That would be a great tip to know.

Thanks PaPitt, I have no info on the track bar, springs or much else on this rig, I just know it's got a mind of it's own when driving

 

[Pa PITT]

..I had a chevy truck that the frame broke behind the steering box.. & Yes it did wonder..
The way I found that one was ... I had someone turn back & fourth on the steering wheel while I SAT BESIDE THE FRONT TIRE LOOKING AT THE GEAR BOX ... Tires on the ground .. You could see one part of the frame moving in & out while other section was close to still.

 

[DirtDonk]

Yep. Very effective test for a Bronco as well.
Much stronger frame than the old Chevy's (from a steering leverage standpoint) but not immune.

We used to sell 5 to 10 GM frame repair kits a week for the '73 to '91 Blazers and GM 1/2 and 3/4 ton pickups. Not so much for the '72 and older trucks, but that might have been fewer being jacked up, big tires installed and jumped around off road, or just a stronger frame in that area.
I'm inclined to think it was the former.
A TON of people were out there bashing around in their later trucks!

Paul

 

[DJT]

..I had a chevy truck that the frame broke behind the steering box.. & Yes it did wonder..

Yikes! Well I hope that's not my issue but I'll try and check out all that steering geometry.

 

[DirtDonk]

The test that PaPitt describes is something we've been using on Broncos and other trucks we have for many years too. It's about the only sure way to easily see things that are just starting to go bad, rather than waiting for them to be totally shot.

It's been written out here many times, but basically, with the full weight of the vehicle on the ground, you have a helper rack the steering wheel back and forth (just enough to move the tires) continuously.
While they're doing this, you're lying under the front end and watching very closely each and every joint, mount, fastener and component. If you see play in anything, it's bad, or well on it's way out.

For instance, if the steering box is moving the draglink, but it has a little play and does not immediately cause the tie-rod to move sideways, it's worn enough to warrant replacement.
Yes, you can drive it like this, and many do, for much longer. But it's not at it's peak performance, and if there are other items with play too, it all adds up to imperfect steering feel on the road.

Even a tiny amount of play in the trackbar is enough to cause a Bronco to follow rain grooves or uneven wear in the pavement. Sometimes you literally need to stick your finger next to the bar and the upper mount to feel for movement. There could be more there than you originally noticed visually.

You can even feel loose wheel bearings with this test. Simply put your hand on the brake drum or rotor and see if it's moving independently of the knuckle. If so, it's too loose.

So if you have a patient family member or friend, give them something to do and hang out under your Bronco for a couple of minutes.

A cracked frame will show up as movement in the steering box. It should not move or flex the frame. If it does, you may need to dig deeper.

Paul

 

[DJT]

Thanks Paul, I'm on it!