A question about priming

[Jc.av8r]

My intent right now is to remove individual doors and panels one at a time, strip them to bare metal myself, and then have them painted in phases one piece at a time, assembling the vehicle later on when everything is done. (Easier for me to do the prep work myself, and pay for paint jobs in smaller chunks)

My question is pretty simple. Say I remove the front fender (or any body panel) and strip it down to bare metal, removing any rust and old paint.

How important is it for me to primer that material on a short time frame? Could I strip it, and then wrap it in some bubble wrap or something to set it aside and let a body shop do the primer and painting a couple weeks to a month or so later without risking corrosion? Or does that bare metal need to be primed right away? I would obviously be keeping these things inside away from moisture and everything. I feel dumb asking this question but I read something somewhere about flash rust or something like that??

 

[73azbronco]

I think your bigger issue is going to be the different looking panels as they get sprayed at different times. Might want to reconsider and save up and do it all at once later. That's what I'm doing.

 

[Jc.av8r]

I think your bigger issue is going to be the different looking panels as they get sprayed at different times. Might want to reconsider and save up and do it all at once later. That's what I'm doing.

I would hope that a good shop could match the colors without much issue, no?

In any event, you might be right, and it's probably smarter to save up and do them all at the same time - but I would still need to do one panel at a time and set them aside. Safe without primer while they wait in the closet?

 

[wepuckett]

you might want to consider trying to get a spray gun and set up a make shift home paint booth and primer the panels yourself if could save you the cost of someone primering the panels and maybe you even feel comfortable enough later on to attempt painting yourself

 

[Jc.av8r]

you might want to consider trying to get a spray gun and set up a make shift home paint booth and primer the panels yourself if could save you the cost of someone primering the panels and maybe you even feel comfortable enough later on to attempt painting yourself

I've thought about it. I could always rent a gun....but I think my buddy has one now that I think of it.

I wouldn't mind trying. I've been using the tailgate as my "test bench" for different grinders and strippers. It's totally rotting out from the inside out so it's a throw away item anyways. I could do some test painting on that thing to see how I do.

My bigger issue is a lack of space - I'm pretty confident I could do it myself with enough time. I might have a way of doing it at my house, but spraying the tub would be the big challenge.

With that said, I could always just make a little booth in the garage out of plastic visqueen or something. Definitely possible %)

 

[wepuckett]

If you look under the build threads section there is a guy in Oregon that built his own home paint booth the title of the thread is Pretty in Pink. He didn't list how to build the paint booth in the thread but a few people did ask him about it in there and aperantly he discussed it with them in PM.

 

[allenfahey]

I paint cars for a living and I did a side job here at home. I had him strip his VW down to bare metal. I then put it in the garage and put some Dupont 5717S on it. 5717S is the same stuff as POR's Metal Ready, zinc phosphate. Since I really don't like looking at another car after working all day the bug sat in my garage here in humid Maryland for over a year. No rust to speak of, in fact it's a great product to use prior to etching or epoxy.

On the subject of painting in pieces or all together. It really depends on the color you are painting it. If it's a solid color you won't have any problems as long as it gets enough coverage. Now if you are talking about taking a fender in and paint it say a silver or other high metallic color. Then a month later when you get more money doing the door, then another month.... First off it will COULD have a color shift because it's metallic and there will probably be sprayed at different air pressures, temperatures, and humidity when sprayed. Second it will cost you more in the long run. It's not cheap to run a heated booth.
At work I prefere to paint a car in pieces. It's faster, no tape lines, no wait time for cut-ins, ect. I have a silver car waiting for me Monday in the booth that is the whole uniside, new doors, and fender. In that case I'm painting it all at the same time and the drop coat will be the same pressure and the same temperature. I never have a color match issue unless it's a 3 stage. Those are always done the conventional way.

Easiest, fastest, cheapest way to strip a vehicle is to gouge up the paint with 80 grit on a grinder. You should see some bare metal in the scratches. Then apply stripper on it. By grinding the paint some the stripper will get under there easier resulting in less time and applications. Do one panel at a time because if the stripper dries it's harder to remove. After it's done bubbling I use a putty knife and scrape it off onto 36" paper on the floor. I then use lacquer thinner and a red scuff pad and scrub it real quick. Then dry it with a rag. That removes any stripper residue and drys it up. I then use 180 and remove any remaining paint. Wash with lacquer thinner again for any stripper residue, then apply the 5717S if you are going to keep it in bare metal for a while. With that you just wipe it on and let it dry. It will dry a white chalky look to it. Here's a picture of the bug I did, this picture was taken well over a year after I started on it.

 

[bronconut73]

I paint cars for a living and I did a side job here at home. I had him strip his VW down to bare metal. I then put it in the garage and put some Dupont 5717S on it. 5717S is the same stuff as POR's Metal Ready, zinc phosphate. Since I really don't like looking at another car after working all day the bug sat in my garage here in humid Maryland for over a year. No rust to speak of, in fact it's a great product to use prior to etching or epoxy.

On the subject of painting in pieces or all together. It really depends on the color you are painting it. If it's a solid color you won't have any problems as long as it gets enough coverage. Now if you are talking about taking a fender in and paint it say a silver or other high metallic color. Then a month later when you get more money doing the door, then another month.... First off it will COULD have a color shift because it's metallic and there will probably be sprayed at different air pressures, temperatures, and humidity when sprayed. Second it will cost you more in the long run. It's not cheap to run a heated booth.
At work I prefere to paint a car in pieces. It's faster, no tape lines, no wait time for cut-ins, ect. I have a silver car waiting for me Monday in the booth that is the whole uniside, new doors, and fender. In that case I'm painting it all at the same time and the drop coat will be the same pressure and the same temperature. I never have a color match issue unless it's a 3 stage. Those are always done the conventional way.

Easiest, fastest, cheapest way to strip a vehicle is to gouge up the paint with 80 grit on a grinder. You should see some bare metal in the scratches. Then apply stripper on it. By grinding the paint some the stripper will get under there easier resulting in less time and applications. Do one panel at a time because if the stripper dries it's harder to remove. After it's done bubbling I use a putty knife and scrape it off onto 36" paper on the floor. I then use lacquer thinner and a red scuff pad and scrub it real quick. Then dry it with a rag. That removes any stripper residue and drys it up. I then use 180 and remove any remaining paint. Wash with lacquer thinner again for any stripper residue, then apply the 5717S if you are going to keep it in bare metal for a while. With that you just wipe it on and let it dry. It will dry a white chalky look to it. Here's a picture of the bug I did, this picture was taken well over a year after I started on it.

I always look forward to reading your responses to painting questions.
Taking notes....

 

[rastiss]

If you don't have clean DRY air, have a shop do the priming. I have seen so many DIY guys do their own priming that have moisture trapped in and under the primer. Ding with me....."Those tinyyyyy bubbleeeees".....

 

[allenfahey]

True about dry air but tiny bubbles is not water. That sounds like solvent pop. Solvent pop is mostly caused by using too fast a hardener and reducer. The top layer dries before the reducer gets a chance to evaporate. They will come out one way or another thus solvent pop. Primer though doesn't do that.

Compressed air gets hot and that us shar creates the water. Tips for dry air. Use a good filter. Try to prime when its cooler outside like at night or early am. Put a big "u" drop in the shop line with a spigot on the end. Then leave it slightly cracked open. Run your airline into a coil in a bucket of ice water prior to the drop.
Just a few tricks/ tips.

 

[rastiss]

If your air is spitting water, you can indeed have bubbles. Water does not mix with solvent based paint. Most people tend to cake primer on trying to use it as filler. When doing this it traps water deposits between layers. Then when exposed to sun it can steam raising larger blisters and therefore delaminate in the spots. Solvent pop tends to be very tiny pores similar to pinholes. Both are common in the hot humid south.

 

[needabronco]

You can spray primer in your driveway, your going to sand the top layer off anyway before you paint. Just be sure you use an etching primer or a direct to metal primer. Be sure you use a good quality primer from an actual paint shop, the cheap crap at Autozone won't cut it when a professional shop paints your car. Better yet if you know who is going to do the final paint work ask them what primer you use, that way you know it will be compatible with their paint.

 

[allenfahey]

A very small amount of moisture in the air line isn't going to cause any issues. If you are blowing off your Bronco prior to priming it you see water coming out of the line then yes you can and will have issues. Fix them by the suggestions I stated earlier.

We switched to waterborne paint last year and we had our shop air tested. They said because the drier the air is the faster waterbourne will dry. The test resulted in 10% which they said was very decent. Reason why it was so low is because of the rotary compressor we have. I asked them how high have they seen and they said 20-30% was very common. The less water in the line the better. We got an RTI filter system and now have less than 1%. I immediately noticed a tremendous difference in the appearance of the clear.

 

[Jc.av8r]

You all rock. Thank you!

 

[allenfahey]

Be sure you use a good quality primer from an actual paint shop, the cheap crap at Autozone won't cut it when a professional shop paints your car. Better yet if you know who is going to do the final paint work ask them what primer you use, that way you know it will be compatible with their paint.

It's good advise to use a quality 2 part primer but it isn't really critical that you use the same brand primer as the paint. For instance if I wanted to spray a PPG 2K primer that is going to dry 100% and then sand it. Then I apply Glasurit paint on it I won't have any compatibility issues because that is a mechanical bond. However I would not use a PPG sealer then apply Glasurit paint because that is a chemical bond and can cause problems. As well as using X brand paint and then use another brand clear. Will it cause problems? It could but why risk it??

Another note about compatibility... Make sure to read the TDS (techical data sheets) that will tell you all about the substrates to apply it over, what if anything needs to be applied on it prior, mix ratios, dry times, tip size, ect. For instance, most epoxy tds sheets will tell you not to apply an etching prior to it because of compatibility issues. Wherever you buy you primer, ask them for the TDS sheet and read it. Many times you can find the TDS online in a PDF file by doing a search for example "Spies 5400 TDS"

 

[rastiss]

Its amazing the difference my kaeser refrigerated drier made added with transair aluminum tubing(dissipates heat and doesn't corrode) along with a desiccant drier. Our air tools last so much longer too! Haven't had an air quality issue in over 13 years. These systems are high priced but worth every penny IMHO. Added in prevost airhose. Absolutely zero measurable contamination. It amazes me how so many pro shops have still never upgraded their air systems.

 

[rastiss]

It's good advise to use a quality 2 part primer but it isn't really critical that you use the same brand primer as the paint. For instance if I wanted to spray a PPG 2K primer that is going to dry 100% and then sand it. Then I apply Glasurit paint on it I won't have any compatibility issues because that is a mechanical bond. However I would not use a PPG sealer then apply Glasurit paint because that is a chemical bond and can cause problems. As well as using X brand paint and then use another brand clear. Will it cause problems? It could but why risk it??

Another note about compatibility... Make sure to read the TDS (techical data sheets) that will tell you all about the substrates to apply it over, what if anything needs to be applied on it prior, mix ratios, dry times, tip size, ect. For instance, most epoxy tds sheets will tell you not to apply an etching prior to it because of compatibility issues. Wherever you buy you primer, ask them for the TDS sheet and read it. Many times you can find the TDS online in a PDF file by doing a search for example "Spies 5400 TDS"

^^^^^^what he said

 

[Ohio Bronco 21]

Excellent info here. I painted a Bronco a few years ago with the autozone duplicolor system. Primer, color, clear. First time I had ever did it. Cam out really good but I found that the biggest Pain to be the huge amount of prep time on the body. Its all in the prep.

 

[mtp71174]

You can do it yourself and there is a proper way of doing it.
1) stripping the fast way is to chem strip the paint what you would use is aircraft stripper found at paint supply stores using rubber gloves and a putty knive apply it let it sit scrape off reapply more scrape repeat until down to metal then wash off wisth water hose
2) use a obitoral sander (da) with 80 grit remove the rest of the paint you can 36 or 40 grit to grind out and body filler.

Note you can skip step one and just grind the paint off not fun or $ wise I think a gallon cost around $50.00 my truck had two paint jobs and I did both quarter panels and both fenders.

3) primer on the parts bare metal will flash rust.
standard primer is porus this means it still can rust.
epoxy primer is a two part primer that needs to be mixed then sprayed once it is done you can leave your parts in the rain with no problem. DON'T
I used an etching primer again bought at paint stores in spray can form around $12.00 a can and paint your parts this keeps them from flash rusting.
epoxy prime is the best, etching primer will do the job also