Another rear main seal question

[jerry]

As I plan for a transmission replacement in my '70, I'm going to get in there and replace the rear main seal.

I feel bad for asking this, but am really not finding the answer. Is there a repair sleeve (w install tool) available for the rear seal? If so, can someone point me towards a specific part number please

I'm inclined to stick with the stock "rope" seal, unless the new "rubber" two piece seal is that much better. If so - pointers towards the install process (which seems to be: grind down or otherwise remove the pin in the rear cap, sealing its hole with a dab of sealant) and the best brand / part # to use would be appreciated.

Thank you,

Jerry

 

[PDQ]

I'll follow this and really want to see you win this, as this same rear seal project resulted in a new crate motor for me....

Could never get the old one out even with the Sneaky Pete tool, and all the other legit suggestions, and ended up just boogering up the ends trying to push the old one out. Then it became, well, if you're going to pull the crank, you should put a new bottom end in it, and, well, if you go with a new bottom end, you may as well rebuild the thing, and, well, if you are going to rebuild it, then a new crate motor may be just as cost effective......

So I have a great 302 in my garage to rebuild some day, including that $%&^ rear main seal!

Didn't answer your question, but just gave me flashbacks to my attempt at this. Which I don't think is the norm just so you know that too!

 

[ba123]

I got the Felpro on e that came with an install tool thing on it.

BS40644

although no idea if that one is the same for a stock engine.

 

[jerry]

I got the Felpro on e that came with an install tool thing on it.

BS40644

although no idea if that one is the same for a stock engine.

If the pic on Amazon is to be believed, that's a one piece. Would work in my 88 Fox Body...

 

[Timmy390]

The last time I bought a repair sleeve/speedi sleeve they measured the OD of the shaft to determine what size was needed. Got it at NAPA......was for a yoke......

Tim

 

[Timmy390]

I've never changed a rope seal but after some reading.....I would pull the engine and put it on my engine stand to do the job.

Tim

 

[jerry]

I'll follow this and really want to see you win this, as this same rear seal project resulted in a new crate motor for me....

Could never get the old one out even with the Sneaky Pete tool, and all the other legit suggestions, and ended up just boogering up the ends trying to push the old one out. Then it became, well, if you're going to pull the crank, you should put a new bottom end in it, and, well, if you go with a new bottom end, you may as well rebuild the thing, and, well, if you are going to rebuild it, then a new crate motor may be just as cost effective......

So I have a great 302 in my garage to rebuild some day, including that $%&^ rear main seal!

Didn't answer your question, but just gave me flashbacks to my attempt at this. Which I don't think is the norm just so you know that too!

I appreciate that - thank you!

I've never changed a rope seal but after some reading.....I would pull the engine and put it on my engine stand to do the job.

Tim

So I'm going to revise my original statement - after looking at a couple of videos (such as this

) to refresh my memory - It's been a couple decades since I've had the oil pan off), it's pretty clear there's no such thing as a repair sleeve for the rear.

Trans will be coming out, so my plan is to do it under the car. I'll post more later.

Thank you guys!

 

[Timmy390]

it's pretty clear there's no such thing as a repair sleeve for the rear.

Jegs begs to differ.....

https://www.jegs.com/i/Clevite/695/...MI2vnm08rGgwMVT11_AB0i-wBtEAQYAiABEgIJQvD_BwE

Tim

 

[Teal68]

You won't be able to replace a rope seal with the crank in the engine, or at least I don't see how it could be possible. (EDIT: I stand corrected per Wild Horse 75's comment below. I just personally never had luck.) Two piece Viton or rubber seal is what you'll need if the crank is to stay installed. Definitely remove the pin. You should be able to drive it out, and then put some sealant. You most likely will have to loosen the 4 remaining bearing caps some to get the upper piece of the seal into the block. You also might have to rotate the crank slightly by hand while worming it in there too. I keep a piece of stiff copper wire around to help push sometimes. The copper won't mar the crank if you slip. Offset ends about 3/8". Use a very small amount of sealant at the ends of the seals and edge of the main cap. That's all I got! Good luck!

 

[Teal68]

I appreciate that - thank you!

So I'm going to revise my original statement - after looking at a couple of videos (such as this

) to refresh my memory - It's been a couple decades since I've had the oil pan off), it's pretty clear there's no such thing as a repair sleeve for the rear.

Trans will be coming out, so my plan is to do it under the car. I'll post more later.

Thank you guys!

You can put a sleeve on the crank, but the tranny will have to be out so you can drive it on.

 

[Wild horse 75]

Rope seals absolutely can be replaced with the engine in the frame. I’ve done it many times. There are special tools to pull the new seal through. You will need to loosen off the rest of the main caps to make your life easier. I’d also pop the belt off so you aren’t fighting belt tension as well. And as others recommended I would replace it with a lip seal. Rope seals never worked that well anyway.

 

[Teal68]

Rope seals absolutely can be replaced with the engine in the frame. I’ve done it many times. There are special tools to pull the new seal through. You will need to loosen off the rest of the main caps to make your life easier. I’d also pop the belt off so you aren’t fighting belt tension as well. And as others recommended I would replace it with a lip seal. Rope seals never worked that well anyway.

Good info. You got me curious....so I did some research. For me the edge of the rope seals like to catch on the block.

 

[jerry]

Jegs begs to differ.....

https://www.jegs.com/i/Clevite/695/...MI2vnm08rGgwMVT11_AB0i-wBtEAQYAiABEgIJQvD_BwE

Tim

I've seen those... But still looks like a later model 5.0 application.
So here's the back end of a 5.0:

No oil pan pull, but clearly you have to pull engine or transmission to do.

Now a 302 with a two piece seal:

Entirely different.

 

[jerry]

Rope seals absolutely can be replaced with the engine in the frame. I’ve done it many times. There are special tools to pull the new seal through. You will need to loosen off the rest of the main caps to make your life easier. I’d also pop the belt off so you aren’t fighting belt tension as well. And as others recommended I would replace it with a lip seal. Rope seals never worked that well anyway.

I have the "sneaky pete" tool. (Lisle 27000) and did order the two piece lip seal to replace.

And thank you for the reminder on the rest of the main caps and belt drive - makes sense.

Thank you!

 

[jerry]

You won't be able to replace a rope seal with the crank in the engine, or at least I don't see how it could be possible. (EDIT: I stand corrected per Wild Horse 75's comment below. I just personally never had luck.) Two piece Viton or rubber seal is what you'll need if the crank is to stay installed. Definitely remove the pin. You should be able to drive it out, and then put some sealant. You most likely will have to loosen the 4 remaining bearing caps some to get the upper piece of the seal into the block. You also might have to rotate the crank slightly by hand while worming it in there too. I keep a piece of stiff copper wire around to help push sometimes. The copper won't mar the crank if you slip. Offset ends about 3/8". Use a very small amount of sealant at the ends of the seals and edge of the main cap. That's all I got! Good luck!

Cranking the crank is a good tip, and also makes sense.
Copper wire is also a good idea - don't know if I would have readily thought of that.
I also know the best practice is to "offset" the seal slightly.

Much appreciated!