Explorer Alt wiring w/ mini starter & solenoid on fender

[DirtDonk]

No, that's just a molded insulator. A fusible link is a piece of wire about 3" long.

Yes, they can be. And certainly any retrofit ones you buy at the parts store are going to be that way.
If not the connector itself though, then where is it on an EB? All the charge wire is of the same size along it's length (outer jacket size anyway), so a smaller section is not easily visible. And it's hard to believe that, even in their light-bulb's darkest hour, Ford would put an oft-burned fusible link down inside the taped portion of the harness with other wires. So visually at least, there is no obvious link spot after that molded "block" at the connector.
Is there a short section of wire that the manuf. somehow manages to make of a smaller gauge under the same size casing? If so, seems like an expensive way to make wire. Maybe the whole section, from the relay to the 3-wire connector farther up the line?
Since most of the meltdowns I've seen (not just Fords) have occured right there at the molded rubber piece, and finding the block all soft and half-melted seemed to be a good indication of a meltdown, and when fixing it was done by simply cutting off the end and renewing it with an add-on link (that short wire you were referring to), it seemed natural that this would be where the link was.

However, I'm sure I'm guilty of assuming that this was the case, since I've never pulled the wire apart, and assumed the smaller gauge wire was molded in right there at the connector.
And, just like in this case, I've certainly been guilty of assuming things before!

Paul

 

[mattt]

The fusible link for the battery side is as I mentioned previously, in the ring. The one for the alternator might just have been inside that old molded rubber "strain relief" that held all the alternator wires. I don't know this, but it's a distinct possibility.




You don't actually have to take the ammeter out of the loop when both wires are hooked to the solenoid. It just automatically becomes inactive. This way you don't have to unplug anything or re-wire anything. You can unplug the wires, remove them from the ammeter's inductive loop, then re-connect the two halves, but that's not necessary.
By hooking the battery charge wire to the battery directly, the ammeter is not doing much work (if any) anyway. By hooking the old Black output from the alternator there too, you basically already deactivated the ammeter.




Either one. Usually it's put straight to the alternator's output though, as that is the most convenient. There is a theoretical advantage to putting it closer to the battery itself, but there doesn't seem to be any downside to putting it straight to the alternator. The distance from there to the battery is just not that great.

Paul

Thanks for the explanation. As I read this message the light bulb went on and it all started to make sense. In stock form, with the black-yellow stripe coming from the alternator and going right to the ampmeter that was how the ampmeter worked. Now with that wire going to the side of the solenoid, it is just reading voltage of the system. I still may take the wire out of the loop just to be safe. My reason for asking about taking the ampmeter out was that being mentioned in the tech article.

I looked at the ring terminal on the solid black with small yellow wire, and yes, the yellow went to the old regulator. The black rubber around the ring terminal has some mark on it, but I can't make it out....it may be a fusible link. I may have remembered where the other fusible link was....when I disconnected the wire going thru the ampmeter loop a few years ago by accident....that connection right there may have been a fusible link. I don't think it was just a std. bullet connector.

Mega fuse question...is there a stand alone single mega fuse holder available? And I only need to fusible link/mega fuse the 2 power feed wires(large gauge black & black-yellow stripe) to the Bronco haress, correct? Any others that need fuse protection when swapping in an Explorer serp setup?

Steve83.....what I started with is a '94 351w Lightning engine, and I have most all of the stock cables. I'm not using the Lightning harness as I'm going Mass Air with Mustang 5.0 ECU. I wanted to use the stock Lightning fuse/relay box and tie that to the Mustang 5.0 harness, but the fuse/relay box came up missing recently at my harness guy's place. I have the starter/battery/solenoid cable that shows in your link and plan to use it. Length wise it's very good for the Bronco with a remote solenoid mounted up near the battery. Does that battery/starter cable setup require a different solenoid than an 89-93 Mustang would have used? That's what I have. It appears to all be compatible, but I'm double and triple checking myself so I don't smoke something right off the bat. Thanks again guys!

 

[Steve83]

And it's hard to believe that, even in their light-bulb's darkest hour, Ford would put an oft-burned fusible link down inside the taped portion of the harness with other wires.

They did that as late as '91 on F-series & Broncos. There's one buried in the dash harness that's virtually impossible to find without pulling the dash & shredding the harness. I've run across them a few times when I rewired my '83 for EFI, and when I stripped the '88 harness in Frank's '75. They also put one under the FP relay in '87-91 trucks, but it's easy to find if you know it's there.

 

[DirtDonk]

Well, as usual, the "hard to believe" turns out to be the norm with these things!
Where did you run across the one on the '75? Do you remember? And was it for the main charging system, or some other circuits?

Paul

 

[Steve83]

Man, that was too long ago... It's in there somewhere:



It's the switched power feed to the EEC PWR relay & the ignition system, so not very important!

 

[mattt]

I re-read the tech article tonight and caught something I missed before. Tech article says....and the output goes directly via a heavy battery cable to the battery positive. That’s it.

There is no mention of a mega fuse in the text of the article, but both Ryan's diagram and the modified bronco schematic show a mega fuse in the main charge wire. Does anyone have a pic of a free standing mega fuse so I have an idea what I'm looking for. Also...what amp fuse in it?

 

[Viperwolf1]

I re-read the tech article tonight and caught something I missed before. Tech article says....and the output goes directly via a heavy battery cable to the battery positive. That’s it.

There is no mention of a mega fuse in the text of the article, but both Ryan's diagram and the modified bronco schematic show a mega fuse in the main charge wire. Does anyone have a pic of a free standing mega fuse so I have an idea what I'm looking for. Also...what amp fuse in it?

Ryan has the megafuse in his products pages. If you use one pick a fuse that has a little greater rating than the alt output rating. For example: 130 amp alt=150 amp fuse

 

[mattt]

Cool....thanks for directing me where to see a mega fuse, now I know what to get. Now....to clarify from the tech article...Is the mega fuse in the charge wire a must have item, or is it not mentioned in the text because it's not always ran? It does show on both wiring pictures in the article. Does the large gauge charge wire have to go direct to + side of battery, or can it go to the battery + side of the starter solenoid just as well?

 

[Viperwolf1]

Cool....thanks for directing me where to see a mega fuse, now I know what to get. Now....to clarify from the tech article...Is the mega fuse in the charge wire a must have item, or is it not mentioned in the text because it's not always ran? It does show on both wiring pictures in the article. Does the large gauge charge wire have to go direct to + side of battery, or can it go to the battery + side of the starter solenoid just as well?

I'm not sure what tech article you're talking about.

The fuse is optional. It can provide isolation and prevent a fire between the battery and the alternator if one of them fails catastrophically.

Battery or starter solenoid is fine.

 

[mattt]

I'm not sure what tech article you're talking about.

The fuse is optional. It can provide isolation and prevent a fire between the battery and the alternator if one of them fails catastrophically.

Battery or starter solenoid is fine.

The tech article here, Explorer serp swap. Are you running a mega fuse?

 

[Viperwolf1]

The tech article here, Explorer serp swap. Are you running a mega fuse?

Yes I am.

 

[DirtDonk]

I'd say that most don't run one. I'd also say that it's a good idea, and more and more of us here are.
Ford uses them on the at least some of the Explorers (undoubtedly other vehicles too), and it seems like cheap insurance to me. A bit awkward to run sometimes, but not that bad.

Paul

 

[Steve83]

That last thumbnail in post #13 shows each type of modern fuse. Ryan sells the fuses & holders at VERY reasonable prices (many parts stores I've checked don't even offer them). When I converted Frank's to 3G, it was a rush job so I just slipped the fuse over the starter relay stud & then onto an isolation post, and it sort of hangs out. But it has been working fine for a few years now, so I haven't gotten around to mounting it correctly yet.

 

[DirtDonk]

Temporary, unless it works!

Paul

 

[mattt]

Well....if it's good enough for the Ford factory, it's good enough for me. I did some exploratory digging in an Explorer today and found that the factory used a 12g fusible link for the alternator charge wire vs. a Mega fuse. It goes from the large gauge black-orange stripe to 12g fusible link to two wires to one ring terminal. Why two wires....no idea whatsoever! But it's going on mine...wish me luck.

It looks like late 90's is when the factory changed over to Mega Fuses....saw a few in later generation vehicles in a nice little plastic case that is part of the fuse/relay box or main harness plug. They were all 175a. It appears that Ford did away with the remote starter solenoid at the same time as none of these later gen vehicles had one that I could see.

 

[DirtDonk]

Glad you did some dig, er, I mean "research" on this mattt. Thanks
It's kind of what we suspected, but I never bothered to look at what year did what. I knew that the Mountaineer we used for the last donor had a Mega-Fuse. I'm pretty sure it was a '98, but don't know any more than that.
I'd wondered when Ford had changed the starter circuit, but wasn't sure.

Now, I don't know this, but I was under the impression that the dual-wires WERE the fusible link wires, and there were two of them because of the overall load on the circuit called for that much protection. And for protecting a 150 or so amp circuit, just one 12 gauge wire isn't going to cut it I wouldn't think.

Thanks

Paul

 

[mattt]

You are correct, the dual wires are the part of the fusible link. The shrink tubing where the 2 smaller wires join the 1 large black-orange stripe factory wire says fuselink 12ga. I went and looked closer and both of the wires that attach to the ring also say fuselink 12ga. The Explorer I got this from was either a 96 or 97.
Now I'm getting why they split the feed into 2 wires....so if something goes "haywire" they will melt. I wasn't thinking 1 small gauge wire to handle the load, I was thinking 1 large gauge wire all the way to the ring terminal. I suppose you couldn't get much of a fusible link out of 1 large gauge wire.


I need a little clarification on the wire that used to feed the ampmeter. In the Explorer Serp tech article here, it shows that wire "terminated" in Figure 6B. However, I think it was Broncobowsher that mentioned it needing to have +12v or the EB goes dead....which was my experience when I dis-connected it once in the past. So, is the tech article not correct? The text part of the article makes no mention of that wire.
I'm assuming both large gauge wires that came up to the starter solenoid and alternator in the factory wire harness need +12v....correct?

 

[DirtDonk]

No, the only one that needs to keep 12v to it is the one that is already at the starter solenoid (Black w/red).
You do know that they're one big long wire "loop" from the alternator, through the ammeter and then back out to the starter relay/solenoid? The fuse box, headlight switch, and maybe some other items, are tapped into it under the dash, but basically you can consider it one long wire. That's why you're going to all this trouble anyway.

The end that used to go to the back of the alternator (Black w/yellow) can be handled in different ways.
1. It can be terminated (as in the article) by either cutting and capping, or removing it at the firewall connector (on '70 and earlier models only), by re-routing it to the starter relay with the other end, just to get it out of the way, while keeping it handy for future use, or, by mounting a power stud (terminal block) under the hood to power other accessories from. Since it's still hooked directly to the battery, from the other end at the solenoid, it's a perfect source of power for things like ARB compressors and stuff.

That's the reason you need to do something safe with it. Because even though it's no longer getting the charge current from the alternator, it's still always hot because it's other end is hooked to the battery.

So that's why you disconnect it and just have to decide whether you might need it in the future. If not, cut it and cap it wherever it's clean and convenient and won't ever come in contact with anything.

Paul

 

[mattt]

Got it. I just looked at the wiring schematic that Steve posted and I see how it is one big loop as you mention. I think I'll just attach it to the solenoid + side with a fuselink as VW and BB mentioned on page 1 & 2 of this thread. Thanks for pointing out what it is....a big loop.....it got me to look at the schematic and get a good handle on the wire harness.

 

[Steve83]

It appears that Ford did away with the remote starter solenoid at the same time as none of these later gen vehicles had one that I could see.

They just switched from the older-style HD relay to a smaller Bosch/ISO relay in the fuse box. It's still there, and doing the same thing - just smaller.