Explorer Balancer - please provide some sanity

[bannind]

Ok, background and then questions at the bottom. Any assistance anyone can provide would be great.

I currently have a 67 with a 289 in it. A little while ago I pulled off the front dress and started to replace it with the mustang serpentine. Purchased a new Professional Products 280z balancer and such - got everything to line up, was almost ready to start it back up. Then before I had a chance to finish it all up, I ran across a complete explorer serpentine setup (2 actually) at a price I could not pass up - so I bought it.
So I take the explorer balancer to a local machine shop, with my original balancer as a reference. Conversation goes as follows -
"how can I help you today."
"well, I would like this balancer (hand tech the explorer balancer) rebalanced to 28ounces exactly like this balancer (hand tech original balancer)"
*tech looks at both mumbling under breath*
"can't do it, I just can't take out that much weight. And I would need the crank so I could index it properly - what are you trying to do?"
(I inform tech of my intentions with explorer serpentine setup)
"why don't you just bolt the pulley's to your original balancer"
*I resist the temptation to cause harm to tech over stupid question - and then proceed to point out the fact that it is a one-piece unit and such*
"well - I can't remove 600 grams of weight. Maybe we could counter weight it with a mallory setup, but that would be 300$"
"thanks anyways I will continue to look at my options"

So here are my questions.

1. What must I say so that the next machine shop understands better what I am trying to do?
2. Do they actually need the crank to do this?
3. If so, does that mean I would have torn my engine up if I would have started it with the Proffessional Products balancer on it?
4. This shouldn't cost 300$ should it?
5. Should I say screw it and use the mustang or will it be worth the trouble to actually get this explorer setup on?

Suggestions? I have the original setup, a mustang setup and 2 explorer setups on the floor of the garage - and 1 wife who is very pissed off over all the money in the garage with nothing running. Provide me some sanity after this mornings setbacks.

thanks,
dan

 

[bfoldy]

Wait! Isn't the Explorer balancer 28oz. also?

 

[trailpsycho]

No, the Explorer is a 50 oz imbalance, just like the Mustang. And, No, you dont want to try to run it on your 28 Oz imbalanced motor.

Unfortunately, I dont think there is a bright light here. You may find someone who WILL take the weight out of the balancer, but that doesnt mean you should. The PP or other dual weighted harmonic balancer is engineered to do what it does. I dont blame the guy for not wanting to be responsible for potentially compromising the integrity of the unit and potentially doing alot of damage to your engine by having it come apart, however, unlikely that may be. I actually could not find a shop that wanted to rebalance my flywheel from 28 to 50 OZ and I contacted several...here in supposedly the racing capital of the world....The NAPA solution was easier and cheaper--in cost of my time. I kept getting the "well, so-and-so used to do that, but they're out of business" or "why in the hell..."

As to what you should do...make your wife happy, sell off the Explorer set-ups and buy yourself something nice for the truck and use the rest to take her out to dinner and some other date-like activity that she might enjoy.

Hopefully, someone else will have some better news.

 

[bannind]

NAPA solution? Do they have a version of the balancer you can buy with the 28oz?

 

[lars]

There's an easy solution: send it to Damper Dudes in Redding, CA. That's what they do for a living. The Explorer 28 oz-in rebalance has been done by them plenty of times. You won't be the first to have a Bronco with Exploder front dress on the old style imbalance. Do a Google search on their name to get contact info.

 

[bigmuddy]

Along the same lines, what do you guys do about using a timing marker with the exploder balancer? Is the funny looking timing ring removable? I too now have and exploder serpenting sitting on the floor and am trying to cross all my T's before I tear it apart.

thanks Ben

 

[bigmuddy]

explorer balancer

whoops forgot to subscribe to the thread %)

 

[pondscum]

I do not believe the exploder balancer is meant to be taken apart and put back together. As far as using the balancer on the 302 I would say no. There is a small length difference in the balancers and the crank pulleys. I put v-belts on my 5.0 by cutting and welding a pulley which is a bit of a trick, but, building a spacer to go between the pulley and the balancer would be very easy for a machine shop and you could just use longer bolts and still do what bigmuddy was saying about treating the wife. Oh, the hole in the center of the pulleys (both 5.0 and 302 ) is the same. The difference between the 3 and 4 bolt pattern can be easily overcome with a drill press.

 

[bigmuddy]

No I didn't mean take it apart, rather just remove the ring gear for the e-timing deal that the exploder ran. I have no plans for running that part and so was thinking I could maybe remove it and run a regular timing marker. Not sure if that through anything off or not.

Do what Lars mentioned and send it to damper dudes and should be fine with the rest.

Ben

 

[lars]

Along the same lines, what do you guys do about using a timing marker with the exploder balancer? Is the funny looking timing ring removable? I too now have and exploder serpenting sitting on the floor and am trying to cross all my T's before I tear it apart.

thanks Ben

There was a thread on here within the last few days where someone (I think it was Marschariot) posted a pic of his home made timing pointer that he used with his Exploder setup. Before I went distributorless, I just had the factory timing pointer/crank position sensor bolted in place with no wires going to it. If you have one, it works fine, unless you object to having the sensor buried in the pointer.

 

[Broncobowsher]

It can be done. I had my Explorer balncer rebalanced for the 28oz-in of my stroker kit in my Ranger. Just need to find a more compitent machine shop. No heavy metal, just drill a little metal out. Nice and smooth all the way up to 6600 revised fuel cut.

No need to remove the 36-1 tooth ring. Since you will be running an Explorer balancer with an Explorer timing cover (the only way it will work) then the timing marks will line up. I used factory Explorer marks and to time mine.

 

[bannind]

Well - I called the dude at Damper Dudes and... Without hesitation after speaking with, I sent him both the old damper as reference and the new one. Hopefully he can kick out quickly. He asked all the right questions and made me feel comfortable with the work he was going to do..

We will see how it turns out.

 

[bigmuddy]

Broncobowsher/Lars thanks as always! I didn't get the exploder timing pointer, guess I need to look at ordering one?

Ben

 

[trailpsycho]

NAPA solution? Do they have a version of the balancer you can buy with the 28oz?

I was making reference to the flywheel. Rather than having my 28 ounce flywheel rebalanced to 50 oz for use with the new Explorer 5.0, I just bought a 91 F-150 164 tooth 50 oz flywheel (for a manual transmission). Sorry to confuse. Anyway, I am glad that Lars chimed in...he is always in the know when it comes to anything Explorer. I hope that Dampner Dude can fix you up properly. Cheers!