Question for the 351 Cleveland guys

[bax]

What is the oil seal?

Thanks for all your help!

Harmonic balancer oil seal

 

[GrillMaster]

Pandora's Water Pump

Well got the pan off but can't get it out. Stuck between the transmission and the cross member. Dropped the trackbar and next I think I have to loosen the colectors and the motor mounts and raise the engine a couple inches to hopefully get the pan out. Any more ideas Bax?

Oh yeah and the timing chain was really loose so I am going to replace that as well.

Love the motor but that timing cover seems like a poor design!

DOH! frustration setting in.... need a beer... or 12!

 

[bax]

Kirk, you are not alone. This is from one of my posts. I am doing the same thing.

so I pulled the pan.( Note to all 400 guys) Put your motor as far far back as it will go.) pulling the pan was a pain. First I had to remove the exhaust. my pipe crosses over /under the pan to the passenger side. It's in the way big time. So with that removed down comes the pan. In your dreams! My pan hits the track bar before it clears the pump, and the front of the pan hangs up on the frame / cross-member. If the motor was back another 1/4'' the pan would have enough room. after some %#@*& and some ^%&* I got the pan to come down.

I feel your pain. Now go jack the motor up.

 

[GrillMaster]

Been following your post and feel your frustrations to say the least!

How can I press on the lower timing gear? Replaced it when I saw how stretched the chain was. Do I need to get a degree wheel and find TDC etc, etc to set it or Can I just put it back on in the same location since the cam and crank have not moved?

Also... I have the same problem with the motor being forward 1/4" inch too much. How did you get your pan out? Trying to avoid taking off the headers motor mounts if possible. Track bar is off and trans front plate is loose but between the headers.

Thanks,
Kirk

 

[bax]

Been following your post and feel your frustrations to say the least!

How can I press on the lower timing gear? Replaced it when I saw how stretched the chain was. Do I need to get a degree wheel and find TDC etc, etc to set it or Can I just put it back on in the same location since the cam and crank have not moved?

Also... I have the same problem with the motor being forward 1/4" inch too much. How did you get your pan out? Trying to avoid taking off the headers motor mounts if possible. Track bar is off and trans front plate is loose but between the headers.

Thanks,
Kirk

This has me worried. Did you line up the 2 gears before you took the old chain off? if you did not do this I dont think you should go forward with the install even if you marked where the timing positions were. If you did line up the 2 gears and have not moved the crank or cam you should have no problem putting the assembly together. As far as using a degree wheel goes I would say use one. It's always good to know where you are at cam timing wise. with that said you can just install the set and not worry about it. Most every set is not off more than a degree or two. But 2 degrees retarded will run different than 2 degrees advanced. if it is a performance build degree the cam.
As far as my oil pan goes I dont know what to tell you. I am sure both of our trucks are a little different. I was able to pry the rear of the pan down enough to clear the bell housing. the track bar had to come off and I had to move a brake line. The pan just did come out. How much room do you need in the front? You could take the motor mount bolts out of the block and then take the trans crosmember bolts out. The motor will slide back about a half inch. Just an idea.
bax

 

[GrillMaster]

i lined them up and put them back on in the same position so I should be OK. I need to find something to press the bottom gear the rest of the way onto the crank. I guess I will have to get out the engine hoist if I have to take out motor mounts tans x-member bolts and I may have to take off the headers to get to them. About to go give it another go.

 

[OX1]

i lined them up and put them back on in the same position so I should be OK. I need to find something to press the bottom gear the rest of the way onto the crank. I guess I will have to get out the engine hoist if I have to take out motor mounts tans x-member bolts and I may have to take off the headers to get to them. About to go give it another go.

Usually, that lower gear will just slide on or at worst, light taps with a rubber hammer may be needed.

 

[bax]

The balancer will push it on too.

 

[bax]

No hoist needed just remove the bolts and find a good pry point. You are not moving that far. A floor jack would help if it's lined up right.

 

[GrillMaster]

My motor is too far forward. It needs to come out. I surrender! Neighbors are bitchin at me can't pull it in the driveway. Taking it somewhere to have it done. Anyone know someone good in Los Angeles?

 

[bax]

Dude! that just sucks!!! I hate neighbors! Are you doing this in the street? No one around will help you? Come on locals, give him a hand.

 

[Desert Thrasher]

To pull my pan I always had to lift the front of the engine completely out of the mounts. I usually lifted the front suspension almost all the way till just before the tires came off the ground also. It should come out, keep trying.

 

[GrillMaster]

I had the motor mounts undone and the front jacked up and still couldn't get it back in. Maybe I need a bigger lift I was considering pulling the motor out. All this for a water pump!

Got the HOA at my condo all pissed, it was out there for a week in pieces. Most of the residents are retired old people with nothing better to do than complain. I already have two projects in the garage and was working in my driveway in front of my garage. Never buy a condo! Will be buying a home soon with a back yard.

Ended up sending it to an friend of a friend at Cox Performance in South Gate. Hope they do a good job putting it back together for me and don’t charge me too much.

 

[Desert Thrasher]

Bummer to hear that, I hope it all works out for you.
On the positive side, its good to know that you caught the loose timing chain before it went out.
Good luck.

 

[GrillMaster]

Finally got the bronco back from my mechanic at Cox Performance in South Gate. I have to say I was impressed with their work but it was good that I got an estimate ($400) otherwise they would have probably charged me three/four times as much. Seems he had a hard time as well and ended up removing most of the front suspension and dropping the front axel to get the oil pan back in. Took two guys with a lift about three full days to complete the job. Money well spent in my opinion. Gave him a generous tip and was on my way. I hope I never have to remove that pan again! or at least until I have a larger work space. Thanks to everyone for all the help on the most frustrating automotive project to date!

 

[Desert Thrasher]

Good to hear you got it done finally. Im still amazed that our trucks can be that different from the factory.

 

[bax]

Glad you got it fixed. My pan was a pain but not as bad as yours. I let the front end droop and jacked up the engine off the mounts just a little and the pan fit right in. I am with you. I hope I don't have to do that again.

 

[GrillMaster]

Now I have a slow leak from the rear main seal and I am contemplating calling him and asking him to redo it since I did spend $400 and a $70 tip. What do you think?

It will leave a 4" puddle of oil overnight.

 

[bax]

Yes take it back, have them fix it.

 

[GrillMaster]

He said it will leak do to wobble in the crank and that the two piece seals always leak. Have you heard of this before? It didnt leak before I removed the pan. Is there a 1 peice rear main seal for this motor?

Said he would take a look at it for me. But don't think he is going to drop the front end again to change the gasket. Said he used permatex. He is a friend usually will not make this type of repair due to many of them leaking.

Anyone else had this problem? Bax?