Smoking battery cable? Dreaded "click" when trying to start?

[msweb]

Just came home from a wonderful evening over at Tuff68's. WONDERFUL people and wow, BEAUTIFUL Bronco and another on the way (which hopefully will NOT be Pink Panther Pink!).

I was going to drive My Bronco over but discovered a leaking freeze plug. Went to move it into the garage for the night but she wouldn't start. Cranked up once but stalled, then seemed like a dead battery. I growl, put the charger on and head over to David and Rachel's place for a cookout that was awesome.

So I get home with a belly full of great food and want to put the Bronco in the garage. The battery is fully charged but still won't crank. Sounds like bad solenoid so I jump it across the terminals with a screwdriver (wonder how many times a day someone does that...). Every time I make contact I hear the click and the negative battery cable starts smokin! My mother is there, she says yeah, did that last time you tried to start it (before leaving earlier - tried to jump it with the boost pack but no luck).

Drove around all over the place last night, had a great time w/o any problems. She ran good, never went over 190 and the next day has a leaking freeze plug and smoking hot battery cables???

Why won't she start (won't crank at all, just the dreaded "click")? Battery terminals are clean and tight and yes, I know, it's a crappy kind of terminal but it's always worked!

Smoke was coming from just behind the clamp holding the cable to the terminal. Any ideas what's up?

 

[DirtDonk]

Doesn't sound like current is your problem. If you've got enough flowing from the battery to smoke the wire, you've got power and connections.
Sounds like either a frozen starter or the engine is jammed up somehow.

Was that freeze plug leaking for any reason you could determine? Any chance fluid got into your cylinders? Better pull all the plugs first, then try to turn it over by hand with the bolt on the crank. Just to be sure the engine is free to rotate.

If it rotates fine, pull the starter and "bench-test" it. Which usually consists of putting your foot on it to hold it down and clamping jumper cables to the body and touching the positive to the post! Crude, but works.

Paul

 

[DirtDonk]

What kind of starter is it?

Maybe you should clean and check the cables anyway. The other reason you can get a smoking cable is that one of them is of insuficient size or has some excess resistance in it. So don't go by my first statement, but double and triple-check your connections for sure.

Paul

 

[Viperwolf1]

I answered in your other thread that it sounded like a bad starter but I thought you meant the whole neg cable was smoking. Now that I see the cheesy clamp I change my answer to the clamp.

 

[DirtDonk]

And in that second pic, what are we looking at exactly? I know it's the alternator side, but is that large wire the only negative cable, or is that small wire anything we need to know about too?

Paul

 

[msweb]

Was that freeze plug leaking for any reason you could determine? Any chance fluid got into your cylinders? Absolutely no idea why it's leaking.

If it rotates fine, pull the starter and "bench-test" it. Which usually consists of putting your foot on it to hold it down and clamping jumper cables to the body and touching the positive to the post! Crude, but works.

I can do that - come stand on it for me?

;D ;D ;D

 

[Broncoman]

Was that freeze plug leaking for any reason you could determine? Any chance fluid got into your cylinders? Absolutely no idea why it's leaking.

If it rotates fine, pull the starter and "bench-test" it. Which usually consists of putting your foot on it to hold it down and clamping jumper cables to the body and touching the positive to the post! Crude, but works.

I can do that - come stand on it for me?

;D ;D ;D

i can lend a foot or two....haha

 

[msweb]

And in that second pic, what are we looking at exactly? I know it's the alternator side, but is that large wire the only negative cable, or is that small wire anything we need to know about too?

Paul

First pic - small wire is actually behind the cable, not attached there. I think thats the wire for my T-stat...

Second pic - Cylinder Head, freeze plug in the front of it. Small wire is oil pressure sending wire - I think

 

[L&D's Broncos]

Smoke?

Smoke when you try to start is just showing you the source of a bad connection. Clean the connection and /or change and see if it still does it. If so /sometimes/ you can take a BFH and hit side of starter and then try it and if it starts or at least tries then starter is shorted out. Less destructive way would be remove starter and put in vise (if available) and use jumpers or pack to connect positive to terminal on starter and touch ground to housing of starter anywhere on steel part. Dead short will only get smoke, if it spins over short is in wiring to starter. Which you should thoroughly check before removal anyway. ( You might note how to do test in vehicle but I did not want to go there because some people will get run over laying under their vehicle fumbling with starter and stick shift) Long answer for quick test....HTH

 

[msweb]

i can lend a foot or two....haha

Sold - see ya tomorrow. I'll be here. He pretty much accepted my offer on the engine but is going to double check and make sure it's complete with harness and computer. I'm gonna ask him if it has a starter too, lol!

Dang - will a starter from a 302/C6 work with a 302/C4??

It never ends...........

 

[Viperwolf1]

Dang - will a starter from a 302/C6 work with a 302/C4??

It should be fine.

 

[HoosierDaddy]

Doesn't sound like current is your problem. If you've got enough flowing from the battery to smoke the wire, you've got power and connections.
Paul

WRONG ..... You are assuming an overcurrent situation ....poor connections cause arcing ,which causes heat , which leads to hot wires .
HoosierDaddy = electrician w/ 14 years under his belt ....

I did have the same issues as this , it was those battery terminals that are pictured above. Took them off , cleaned everything up ( both the cable and fitting) reassembled , ensureing a good tight connection and everything works fine. I don't recall if I had to re-arch the compression plate or not , but look to see that the plate is not bottoming out before the cable is really tight in the compression area.


edit : now that I read further , I see your retraction .... sorry

According to Greaseball at Broncodriver mag. , those cable ends should not be used , but I still have them , but they do need to be maintained. Everytime you mess with them , be gentle and inspect them before you finish. They seem to be touchy.

 

[msweb]

Okay, I'm going up to the garage and gonna take apart the cheap crummy terminal, clean it all up and see if that's it. Then I'll go buy a new one tomorrow. I've already got something in my house that's touchy and needs maintenance.... %)

 

[DirtDonk]

but they do need to be maintained. Everytime you mess with them , be gentle and inspect them before you finish. They seem to be touchy.

Definitely. I've used them to good effect, but usually change them out a lot sooner than I might a more robust type. They sure can be a lifesaver sometimes though!

Definitely show them some TLC and for sure check the condition of the wire/cable past the initial strands that you see. When the wire's end is un-sealed that way, over a period of time (how long have they been in service BTW?) corrosion can build up unseen and cause all sorts of fun for you.
Yours actually look pretty clean, but that's just a picture and only you can tell for sure.

Good luck. Or more appropriately, GET BACK TO WORK!!!!


Paul

 

[DirtDonk]

Clean and inspect all 6 ends.
Positive from battery to relay.
Positive from relay to starter.
Negative from battery to engine block.

Which leads (an electrical pun?) to the next loaded question. It's 10:46 in TN, do you know where your grounds are?????
Things are looking a little grimey in there. Do you have good ground connections to all pertinent components? Battery, frame, engine, body? And extras to each other in certain cases?

Just checkin' there maintenance-man.

Paul

 

[msweb]

Wire brushed everything, took apart and cleaned cheesy clamp and flattened out the compression plate to ensure a good connection when tightened. Clamped everything down, fumbled around in the dark for the keys that I dropped, grabbed a toad instead which may as well have been a hot battery cable.... Found the keys and tried to start. Click.

I'm going to bed. To be continued......

 

[66Bronco]

I had the same exact problem with the Silver Fox. Negative battery cable would smoke and it would start. I replaced all of the battery cables and the problem went away. I did also rework some of the wiring on back of the alternator since part of the wire harness had melted.


-Terry

 

[RangerRob]

Have you tried another battery? Mine did something similar last week but the battery just died. Went in to a restaurant to pick up some to go food in the running Bronco, came back out 5 minutes later and click.....

Jumping, cleaning the terminals, and holding my mouth right to get it to start all had the same result.....nothing. Threw a different battery in there and it fired right up.

Checked the voltage of the bad battery and it was less than 6 volts. Threw it on the charger overnight and it was at 12.86 volts so I decided to try it in the Bronco again. Turned the key and got a click and groan. Dead battery.

On the hunt for a permanent replacement now......

 

[HoosierDaddy]

On the hunt for a permanent replacement now......

DEKA - got tired of relying on warrantys with the other brands.

 

[msweb]

We didn't get a chance to look into it today but after bumping the key a few times, Anthony was able to get her started. Shut it off, tried again and click....... bump it a few times and it kicked right over and started up.

So......... We pulled her into the garage and fixed the freeze-plug. Turns out it actually had a hole in the middle of it, not leaking around the edges like I thought it was!