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Transmission ID help

GreenSpirit

Newbie
Joined
May 31, 2021
Messages
4
The PO of my 76 installed a 4 speed manual transmission and I am looking for help identifying what it is. There are some stamps on the transmission HOUSING as well as a metal badge. The badge has these stamps in the below order. Any ideas? Thanks

RTS AC HD20
E4TRCA 0414
 

DirtDonk

Contributor
Bronco Guru
Joined
Nov 3, 2003
Messages
48,743
Interesting swap. I don’t know numbers very well, but I’m sure there are some here that can decipher the codes.
One line that sticks out to me though, is the “E4T” section.
That would indicate a truck transmission from an ‘84 or newer vehicle.

Have you driven it yet? Can you describe the shift pattern, or do you know if it has an overdrive fourth gear?
Does it have an ultra low granny gear first, or does it feel like a normal first gear?
And does it have shift arms and rods and rails on the side, or does the shift lever go straight down into the top?
Those aren’t automatically determining factors necessarily, but I’m curious about them.
And now I’m subscribed so if somebody comes up with an actual answer for you, I’ll be able to find out too!

Good luck.
 

Broncobowsher

Total hack
Joined
Jun 4, 2002
Messages
35,392
NP435/T18s were still available new into the 80s.
There is also the overdrive toploader.

Really don't know the numbers. I would do the same thing you can do, type them into your favorite search engine and see what shows up.
 

jamesroney

Sr. Member
Joined
Sep 11, 2007
Messages
1,914
Loc.
Fremont, CA
Just for you @DirtDonk

Rwd Aluminum case
E4TR-CA, RTS-AC
1984 Ford Rwd 300L6
Case = Aluminum
Input = 10 splines, 21 teeth
4th mainshaft = 20 teeth
2nd mainshaft = 29 teeth
1st mainshaft = 32 teeth
Cluster = 32-43-23-15 teeth

You might know it as a T170-RTS. It's a light duty, Aluminum case Top loading 3 speed with overdrive transmission. It is somewhat similar to the Ford toploader, except that 3rd gear is the overdrive gear, and 4th gear is straight thru. So it shifts 1-2-4-3. Obviously, the operator doesn't know that.

It is not strong, it is not plentiful, it is not really anything.

Toploaders are durable in direct proportion to their gear ratios. Close ratio toploaders are very durable. As the ratios get wider, the torque multiplication increases, and the gears get weaker. Wide ratio toploaders are weaker. The Jeep and T176 based transmission are even weaker.
 
OP
OP
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GreenSpirit

Newbie
Joined
May 31, 2021
Messages
4
Just for you @DirtDonk

Rwd Aluminum case
E4TR-CA, RTS-AC
1984 Ford Rwd 300L6
Case = Aluminum
Input = 10 splines, 21 teeth
4th mainshaft = 20 teeth
2nd mainshaft = 29 teeth
1st mainshaft = 32 teeth
Cluster = 32-43-23-15 teeth

You might know it as a T170-RTS. It's a light duty, Aluminum case Top loading 3 speed with overdrive transmission. It is somewhat similar to the Ford toploader, except that 3rd gear is the overdrive gear, and 4th gear is straight thru. So it shifts 1-2-4-3. Obviously, the operator doesn't know that.

It is not strong, it is not plentiful, it is not really anything.

Toploaders are durable in direct proportion to their gear ratios. Close ratio toploaders are very durable. As the ratios get wider, the torque multiplication increases, and the gears get weaker. Wide ratio toploaders are weaker. The Jeep and T176 based transmission are even weaker.
Thanks for your time, I have had this truck for over twenty years but did not realize what I had until a year ago when I had to pull the tranny off to replace the clutch kit. The PO used this truck as a daily driver and wanted to run interstate speeds so I guess that's why he replaced the stock tranny? When in first gear the shifter almost touches the dash. Can you please explain the 1-2-4-3 shift pattern you mentioned. I have always shifted 1-2-3-4 rarely using the 4th speed in the city when driving under 50 mph. What is the difference between the overdrive gear and the straight thru gear?
 

jamesroney

Sr. Member
Joined
Sep 11, 2007
Messages
1,914
Loc.
Fremont, CA
Thanks for your time, I have had this truck for over twenty years but did not realize what I had until a year ago when I had to pull the tranny off to replace the clutch kit. The PO used this truck as a daily driver and wanted to run interstate speeds so I guess that's why he replaced the stock tranny? When in first gear the shifter almost touches the dash. Can you please explain the 1-2-4-3 shift pattern you mentioned. I have always shifted 1-2-3-4 rarely using the 4th speed in the city when driving under 50 mph. What is the difference between the overdrive gear and the straight thru gear?
Yup, lots of people want an overdrive transmission in the pursuit of better drive-ability and fuel economy.

The 4 speed manual transmission was a logical extension to the 3 speed manual gearbox that was prevalent from the 1890's to the 1940's. The 4 speed manual was available as early as the 1930's in the VW Beetle, but the US market didn't really get a 4 speed manual until the late 40's. For almost 100 years, the purpose of a transmission was to provide a gear REDUCTION in the drive train to produce more torque at lower speed, and allow you to keep the vehicle in the power band as you gain speed.

So in a typical 4 speed, first gear is the highest gear reduction, then 2nd, then 3rd, and finally 4th. But 4th gear isn't really a gear at all. 4th is "straight thru" or just a solid coupling. So in every 4 speed transmission built until about 1975... 4th gear is 1:1, or straight thru. Once you reach cruising speed, and the input shaft is coupled to the output shaft...you have reached maximum strength, and efficiency, and all of the gears inside the transmission are just idling and spinning and basically doing nothing. This is the ideal configuration for maximum durability at maximum exposure. So if you are going to drive at sustained speed on the highway...you want to be in "direct"

The traditional Ford Toploader 4 speed transmission follows this convention. First gear is typically 2.32, second is 1.69, third is 1.29 and fourth is 1:1. This is the configuration that everybody understands. And if you pull the top cover on a toploader, you can see the gears get smaller on the shaft as you vies it from back to front. The back gear has 32 teeth, then second has 28, then third has 25, and fourth has 23. Every T10, T98, T18, NP435, M20, M21, SM420, SM465, A833, you name it...follows this convention. Fast forward to the gas "shortage" of the 1970's and it became desirable to reduce engine RPM in search of improved fuel economy. Someone figured out that they could achieve an "overdrive" configuration" where the output shaft rotated faster than the input shaft by placing a large gear on the countershaft and a small gear on the main shaft...in the location traditionally reserved for "3rd gear." Your RTS (Remote Tower Shift) transmission is configured this way. So you get a 1:1 gear "reduction" in the fourth position, and an overdrive in the 3rd position. In order to achieve a logical shifting sequence, the 3-4 shift rail has to move backwards compared to normal.

There's a LOT of chicken vs egg in the discussion. Everyone understands the standard H-pattern (first toward the dash, second toward the seat, third toward the dash, fourth toward the seat) but it is an evolution that follows the shift rail mechanical logic. The shift rail on your T98 puts 4th toward the seat because the rail needs to move forward to engage 4th. So in order to keep the H pattern in your RTS, the 3-4 shift rail moves backwards. Nobody knows that it is happening, and it is transparent to the user. But it confuses the heck out of the service tech when the transmission shift tower moves backwards.

Hope that helps.
 
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OP
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GreenSpirit

Newbie
Joined
May 31, 2021
Messages
4
I owe you a beer or twelve for this education! So have I been driving this bronco wrong for the past 20 years? I am ashamed to say I rarely drive my Bronco these days and am lucky to get it out one or two weekends a month before the summer heat makes driving it to much of a hassle. I never take it on the interstate and most driving is done around 35-45mph in town. With that said I shift from 1st downward to 2nd based on feel of the engine revving not so much what the RPM gauge is saying. Then shift up to third by the dash for cruising in the 35-45 mph range. There is a open stretch of Hwy at the end of my route home with a 55mph speed limit and occasional I have to shift down towards the seat to 4th to keep up with traffic. At this point I am in the 55mph range roughly. So should I be going from 2nd gear to 4th gear for cruising in that 35-45 mph range skipping the "overdrive" 3rd gear?
 

jamesroney

Sr. Member
Joined
Sep 11, 2007
Messages
1,914
Loc.
Fremont, CA
I owe you a beer or twelve for this education! So have I been driving this bronco wrong for the past 20 years? I am ashamed to say I rarely drive my Bronco these days and am lucky to get it out one or two weekends a month before the summer heat makes driving it to much of a hassle. I never take it on the interstate and most driving is done around 35-45mph in town. With that said I shift from 1st downward to 2nd based on feel of the engine revving not so much what the RPM gauge is saying. Then shift up to third by the dash for cruising in the 35-45 mph range. There is a open stretch of Hwy at the end of my route home with a 55mph speed limit and occasional I have to shift down towards the seat to 4th to keep up with traffic. At this point I am in the 55mph range roughly. So should I be going from 2nd gear to 4th gear for cruising in that 35-45 mph range skipping the "overdrive" 3rd gear?
@GreenSpirit No, that's not it at all! You should keep doing what you've always done. (dash, seat, dash, seat.)

You've been doing it right for 2 decades. Sorry for the confusion.

If you ever disassemble the transmission, and have to service the shift tower...that is the ONLY time you will care about which way the shift rail goes.

If you find yourself in a situation where you are towing 20,000 pounds across the country on the highway, your transmission will last longer in "3rd."
 
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OP
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GreenSpirit

Newbie
Joined
May 31, 2021
Messages
4
Thanks for the clarification. I started trying to ID the transmission as I recently started hearing a rattling sound from the tranny or bellhousing area that has me concerned. I noticed oil dripping from the tranny plug and am thinking the fluid level might be low or even gone. If the transmission fluid is low should it just be topped off or should a complete change be done? No that you have identified my transmission I can research what type of fluid should go in.
 
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