twin sticked d20 front case not goin into low

[RedNeckRea]

picked up my bronc-ho with the case already twin sticked. since I bought it, i haven't been able to get the front into low.

seein as I don't have access to a lift/shop or hardly any of my usual tools, and it has been a while since I had a case apart, i was wondering if anyone could give me some ideas as to why i'd be able to get the rear in low but not the front. the PO of the case said it wasn't the easiest shift for him, but that he was always able to get the front in. i've tried the front ---> neutral, rear ---> neutral, rear ---> low, attempt to put front in while fiddling with the tranny and no luck. also tried shifting front case to low first, with rear in N but no movement on the front stick.

PO said he used to put the front case in low before the rear. i have tried applying some pressure to the rear shifter while it's in neutral to see if that helps...no luck. also tried rolling slowly forward while trying to shift, rolling slowly in reverse while trying to shift...both to no avail.

at this point it looks like I will have to drop the case to figure out what's goin on. any advice for what to look for when I drop the case? it's been a while since I took apart anything other than a yota case...any particular tools or gaskets i'll need, or does everything seal up with RTV? plan is to unbolt from tranny, clean exposed shift rails or any dirt or grime i didn't get off the first time, and bench test until i can get it to work. don't want to get into the internals unless I have to.

 

[Viperwolf1]

Look for interference with the front shifter (floor or something underneath) or a loose front shift fork set screw. You might be able to fix the screw by just removing the bottom cover and fishing a 3/16" allen up there to tighten it.

 

[RedNeckRea]

Look for interference with the front shifter (floor or something underneath) or a loose front shift fork set screw. You might be able to fix the screw by just removing the bottom cover and fishing a 3/16" allen up there to tighten it.

at first i thought it might be interference from the sheet metal screw holding the shift boot down, but i double checked and there's no interferance from anything I can see. i'll have to check the front shift fork set screw when I get under there.

 

[iwlbcnu]

Have you tried it while moving or just sitting still? Mine is pretty funny and you always have to play with it. I always have better luck with the front if the rear is in N.

 

[RedNeckRea]

Have you tried it while moving or just sitting still? Mine is pretty funny and you always have to play with it. I always have better luck with the front if the rear is in N.

i have tried everything that I can think of that I have seen in the rock crawling world (former judge/marshall for we-rock, so it's quite a bit). sitting still on flat ground, rolling forward, rolling backward, sitting still with front end up hill, sitting still ass end up hill....

i've even tried every combination of lever action i can think of. start off with both cases in neutral and shifting both the front or rear first. start off with front case in neutral, rear case in hi and trying to shift the front case to low (obviously done at a stop). rear case in low, front case in neutral trying to shift front case into low.

i should mention the front case shifts into hi range very easily and stays...haven't had it pop out yet (knock on wood). but any forward movement is like trying to push a brick wall.

 

[Pokey71]

PO said he used to put the front case in low before the rear.

Rear in low first. Front in low second.

So it should be


START:
F - Neutral
R - High

F - Neutral
R - Neutral

F - Neutral
R - Low

F - Low
R - Low
And youre done

Make sure the rear is fully engaged before shifting into front low.

 

[JB Fab]

If you have a "T" type case, and the shift-rails are not modified or the pill removed, you will not be able to put the front in low, untill the rear is in low first,

Jon

 

[RedNeckRea]

If you have a "T" type case, and the shift-rails are not modified or the pill removed, you will not be able to put the front in low, untill the rear is in low first,

Jon

any easy way to determine j and t shift cases if it's already been twin sticked without pullin the case? cause like I said, the PO said he used to shift the front in first

 

[Viperwolf1]

any easy way to determine j and t shift cases if it's already been twin sticked without pullin the case? cause like I said, the PO said he used to shift the front in first

Look at the portion of the shift rails that sticks out the front. If the front can be shifted into gear first it's either a J or a pill-removed T.

 

[RedNeckRea]

Look at the portion of the shift rails that sticks out the front. If the front can be shifted into gear first it's either a J or a pill-removed T.

based on that pic, and one I found while searching that showed a cut down jshift for twin sticks, it appears I've got a tshift. gonna try droppin the case tomorrow, any advice for what might be causing the binding? any particular gaskets I need or can i just use RTV to seal everything up?

 

[Viperwolf1]

I'd start by just removing the lower cover. Then look inside while someone else shifts between front neutral and front low. No sense pulling it out if you don't have to.

 

[RedNeckRea]

I'd start by just removing the lower cover. Then look inside while someone else shifts between front neutral and front low. No sense pulling it out if you don't have to.

So I double checked and can't find any interferance outside of the case. I've pulled the side cover, but can't get up into the 3/16" allen bolt to see if it's loose (just looking it doesn't appear loose, but eyes can be deceiving). The only thing me and my buddy see that might be an issue is that the where the shifter meets the case has some slop. The rear shifter is nice and tight where it meets the case. The front shifter has some side to side slop (note this is just the shifter, not the part coming out of the case).

 

[Viperwolf1]

Look at the rail and the fork. Have your buddy move the shifter back and forth and make sure the fork is moving with the rail. They should act as one solid piece of steel.

Side slop in the shifter is not critical unless it's excessive.

 

[RedNeckRea]

Look at the rail and the fork. Have your buddy move the shifter back and forth and make sure the fork is moving with the rail. They should act as one solid piece of steel.

Side slop in the shifter is not critical unless it's excessive.

everything moves as one as far as the fork/rail...and everything shifts clean and easy when you pull back on the shifter to go from neutral to high range. when I try to push the shifter forward from neutral to low range (tried with rear case in neutral and then in low range), even with me trying to push on the shift fork inside the case and my buddy pushing on the shifter in the cab...absolutely zero forward movement.

one thing that does have me very disapointed, but glad I found it, is the fact that the low range gears for the rear portion of the case and the center gear are prettly badly damaged. if I had a decent camera I would have taken pictures, but it seems like one of the POs liked to run in 2low and it doesn't seem to have very good tooth engagement because it's the rear portion of the center case gear and the front portion of the rear gear.

 

[Viperwolf1]

It might be time to do some exploratory surgery then. Only thing I can figure is maybe something is jammed in the shift rail. I've seen the balls get worn enough to become football shaped. Might be a good time to remove the pills too.

 

[73azbronco]

Even if that allen screw seems tight, it might not be tight as it is interference fit, try tightening it or at least have someone move the shift lever while you look at the shift fork, does it move on the fork rail? Are the shift fork "ends" bent? lastly, have you tried moving it into gear by using some big pliers on the shifter rail putting the plier on the rail outside of the case? Can you get the fork to move by hand inside the case?

if you can't get it into gear by hand with it opened, there be something wrong, but you know that, sorry.