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Uneven ride height

robsim111

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Joined
Mar 3, 2016
Messages
41
My Bronco has a severe uneven ride heigh from rear to front. It is even worse now that I put a 900 pound motor in it. I have a 5.5" lift kit (Rancho I believe?) and I want to make sure the rear leaf springs are installed properly from back to front. I've added pictures and labeled them so maybe some insight will help. The part of the spring going towards the front has a downward curve in it before it curves back up into the mount. I've seen people install them both ways on these forums, but I cannot tell which way is the correct way. I've also removed the thick extra spring from the pack in order to lower it a little, but it's still pretty bad. EDIT: I have a 6 degree shim which doesn't help



 
Last edited:

gr8scott

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Jul 1, 2011
Messages
1,890
I want to make sure the rear leaf springs are installed properly from back to front.

Typically the double wrapped end goes to the front, i.e, they're on backwards. So spin them around,
get the rest of the body on and see what it does. Are you planning on running a full top?

If it's still raked after fully assembled you may need to source taller front coils, especially with that nearly half-ton engine installed.
 

DirtDonk

Contributor
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Nov 3, 2003
Messages
51,619
My Bronco has a severe uneven ride heigh from rear to front.
Hi Rob. Quite a few things you got going on here.
First off, there’s no such thing as “ride height” because ride height can’t be achieved when the vehicle isn’t even assembled yet.
You can’t check anything, verify anything, finalize anything, or fully finish setting up anything, until the vehicle is fully assembled.
So whether you have a problem or not, we don’t know yet. So you shouldn’t worry about it yet.
It is even worse now that I put a 900 pound motor in it.
Probably not actually 900 pounds. But of course it’s not gonna sit anywhere near what you expect when you overweight the front end and underweight the rear end.
So like I said above, there’s nothing that you can check or worry about yet.
I have a 5.5" lift kit (Rancho I believe?)
No such thing. The tallest lift Rancho ever made for an early Bronco was 3 inches.
At least that’s the case since the 80s. Before that, they did have 6 inch lifts for Chevy trucks, and there may have been tall lifts like that for Ford trucks. But it’s been over 40 years since anything like that has come across their product line.
So a 5 1/2 would have to come from one of the other companies. Are there any markings on the springs? Can you show us a better picture of the overall spring? How many leaves are in the pack total?
I don’t actually see a double wrap eye. But I can’t view them well from my phone. Can you take a better picture of the spring eye as it sits in the front hanger and rear shackle?
and I want to make sure the rear leaf springs are installed properly from back to front.
If they have a Military double wrap, then, as was said, the double wrap always goes to the hard mount to the frame.
The factory spring was oriented just as yours are, with the “Berlin Eye” to the front spring hanger.
The part of the spring going towards the front has a downward curve in it before it curves back up into the mount.
That’s the Berlin eye I was referring to. If it’s a single wrap at the other end, then your springs are installed correctly. If it’s a double wrap, however, you should reverse them.
A double wrap is where the eye of the second leaf wraps around the eye of the top leaf.
I've also removed the thick extra spring from the pack in order to lower it a little, but it's still pretty bad.
Having an extra thick leaf makes it sound like a standard pair of springs. Was that thick lower leaf in full contact with the upper leaves throughout its curve? Or were there gaps at the end?
EDIT: I have a 6 degree shim which doesn't help.
No, normally wouldn’t. Shimming can change the angle and effective length of the driveshaft. But not radically affect the height that the springs hold the frame.
Those are for correcting driveshaft angle anyway. Which of course you can’t check and won’t know until the full way to the vehicle is on the body frame and springs.
 
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robsim111

New Member
Joined
Mar 3, 2016
Messages
41
Hi Rob. Quite a few things you got going on here.
First off, there’s no such thing as “ride height” because ride height can’t be achieved when the vehicle isn’t even assembled yet.
You can’t check anything, verify anything, finalize anything, or fully finish setting up anything, until the vehicle is fully assembled.
So whether you have a problem or not, we don’t know yet. So you shouldn’t worry about it yet.

Probably not actually 900 pounds. But of course it’s not gonna sit anywhere near what you expect when you overweight the front end and underweight the rear end.
So like I said above, there’s nothing that you can check or worry about yet.

No such thing. The tallest lift Rancho ever made for an early Bronco was 3 inches.
At least that’s the case since the 80s. Before that, they did have 6 inch lifts for Chevy trucks, and there may have been tall lifts like that for Ford trucks. But it’s been over 40 years since anything like that has come across their product line.
So a 5 1/2 would have to come from one of the other companies. Are there any markings on the springs? Can you show us a better picture of the overall spring? How many leaves are in the pack total?
I don’t actually see a double wrap eye. But I can’t view them well from my phone. Can you take a better picture of the spring eye as it sits in the front hanger and rear shackle?

If they have a Military double wrap, then, as was said, the double wrap always goes to the hard mount to the frame.
The factory spring was oriented just as yours are, with the “Berlin Eye” to the front spring hanger.

That’s the Berlin eye I was referring to. If it’s a single wrap at the other end, then your springs are installed correctly. If it’s a double wrap, however, you should reverse them.
A double wrap is where the eye of the second leaf wraps around the eye of the top leaf.

Having an extra thick leaf makes it sound like a standard pair of springs. Was that thick lower leaf in full contact with the upper leaves throughout its curve? Or were there gaps at the end?

No, normally wouldn’t. Shimming can change the angle and effective length of the driveshaft. But not radically affect the height that the springs hold the frame.
Those are for correcting driveshaft angle anyway. Which of course you can’t check and won’t know until the full way to the vehicle is on the body frame and springs.

I appreciate the feedback. Normally wouldn't want to disagree, but I am going to have to.

1. The motor is a 3.9l cummins and weights about 850 pounds full of fluids and accessories.
2. They are not double wrapped, but I wanted to make sure that they were still oriented correctly. The springs may not be Rancho, but the shocks definitely were. However, measurements before I added my cummins would have put it right at a 5.5" lift. The kit, however, is 15 years or older. The bottom spring did not touch, but the shims DID add height.
3. The Bronco is at max loaded weight on the rear (the tailgate is on), as I'm only running bimini top. If anything, when I add my doors and windshield frame, it will sag even more towards the front.

What I am taking away though is that I either need larger springs or a spacer to place under the spring to bring it up a couple inches and larger tires so it doesn't look awkard. I will take more pictures of the actual leaf springs so that I can get an accurate assessment. I really wanted to lower it down, but I may be SOL without doing something a lot more costly.
 

DirtDonk

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Nov 3, 2003
Messages
51,619
Ha ha! Wouldn’t be the first time a diesel install messed me up.
So I guess you’re definitely gonna have to shore up the front. Or lower the rear.
Perhaps multiple shocks up front as well, or some beefed up custom valved units.
If you like the height in the front as it sits now, however, you can always lower the rear instead.

Since the rear springs have no double wrap, then they are orientated correctly. I don’t think it’s a huge difference one way or the other, but the factory did put the curved eye in the front.

What about that thick lower leaf? Factory design springs have five or six leaves as opposed to the 8, 9, 10, or 11 leaves of the modern replacements.

As the vehicle sits right now, with the engine installed, measure between the top of the axle and the bottom of the frame rail as a reference point.
Stock Bronco is roughly 7 inches, so anything you have over that is the amount of effective lift you have with the existing springs.
Was the diesel engine in it before, or did you install it for this project? If you just installed it, then adding Rancho coils, if that’s not already what you have, is not a bad idea.
Even though they were only 3 inches of lift, they were also among the stiffest springs ever used in Broncos. Very healthy and should be able to hold up that engine very well. Then you just have to control the movement with good shocks.
While you’re taking pictures then, grab a couple of shots of the front coil springs too please.

And good luck with the overall project! Sounds like an interesting one.
 
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robsim111

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Joined
Mar 3, 2016
Messages
41
Ha ha! Wouldn’t be the first time a diesel install messed me up.
So I guess you’re definitely gonna have to shore up the front. Or lower the rear.
Perhaps multiple shocks up front as well, or some beefed up custom valved units.
If you like the height in the front as it sits now, however, you can always lower the rear instead.

Since the rear springs have no double wrap, then they are orientated correctly. I don’t think it’s a huge difference one way or the other, but the factory did put the curved eye in the front.

What about that thick lower leaf? Factory design springs have five or six leaves as opposed to the 8, 9, 10, or 11 leaves of the modern replacements.

As the vehicle sits right now, with the engine installed, measure between the top of the axle and the bottom of the frame rail as a reference point.
Stock Bronco is roughly 7 inches, so anything you have over that is the amount of effective lift you have with the existing springs.
Was the diesel engine in it before, or did you install it for this project? If you just installed it, then adding Rancho coils, if that’s not already what you have, is not a bad idea.
Even though they were only 3 inches of lift, they were also among the stiffest springs ever used in Broncos. Very healthy and should be able to hold up that engine very well. Then you just have to control the movement with good shocks.
While you’re taking pictures then, grab a couple of shots of the front coil springs too please.

And good luck with the overall project! Sounds like an interesting one.
I appreciate the input. It is the old style thick springs. It's definitely an old lift kit. I put a crate 302 in it about 5 years ago, and took it to a body shop to fix my sloppy body work and paint job (I was doing a poor mans restoration) and the guy left it out for 2 hurricanes and completely ruined the Bronco. I ended up having it sand blasted and I restarted from scratch with a nut and bolt restoration at my house. I'll get new measurements, but it was 6.5 in the rear (It was level prior to shimming it) and 5.5 in the front prior to my 302 replacement with a Cummins. I have not remeasured the front though since I put a new motor in it, but it has definitely dropped more.

Do you know if there is a measurement for springs? I would like to know what a new 5.5" lift spring measures versus mine. I

I'll get more pictures tonight.
 

DirtDonk

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Bronco Guru
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Messages
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Very few actual free-height and installed-height measurements for coils. Even fewer (if any!) for leaf packs.
And since every spring almost, is different from every other brand, one company's specifications do not correlate to another's.
It's one of the reasons we use installed height measuring the vehicle, rather than the spring.
From the top of the axle tube to the bottom of the frame rail would be 7" in front and 6" in the back, when stock springs are installed. Withing half an inch either way.
Your measurements would seem to indicate a roughly stock height Bronco, with a bit of sag in the front.

Moog used to publish their Cargo Coil specs in the catalog, so may have continued that on their website. Might look there to see.
But Moog CC's are variable rate and so will not have the same installed height dimensions as a linear rate coil would.
One other measurement that is often included is "wire diameter" which is the size of the coil winding itself. So one that is 5/8" diameter is almost always a heavier rate then one that is 9/16" diameter. But that might also depend on the type of steel and where it was sourced and when. I don't know spring science, but a spring made in the US twenty years ago might not be the same as one made in Vietnam or Mexico yesterday.
But heavier does not always equate to a stiffer ride. Depends on the coil spacing as well. Fewer windings with wider gaps between them, will ride stiffer than one with more windings closer together.

Rancho used to (and probably still does) show their specs in the back of the catalog. Find the coil number and find the spec. I don't want to exaggerate, but it seems like it was something like 625lbs rated. Very stiff compared to other Bronco springs.
That's because the "3 inch lift Bronco" springs were actually "1.5 inch F150" springs used as leveling coils. Made to carry a LOT more weight over the front end than Broncos had.

Sorry to hear about your (unfortunately all too common) body shop nightmare.

Paul
 
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