74 C4, d20+adapter questions (pics)

[Scott M]

(Finally splurged to be a contributor, ha) starting on the 74 i picked up, it came w/ no t-case and has been sitting in a dirty newmexico field for a few years. so,

-What parts are missing in order to put on t-case? from what i can tell from the pics at http://www.azbronco.com/dana20.htm, that shaft is the output from the trans, and i need all the parts in the picture (input shaft, seal, bearing, main drive gear, and the two snap rings; right? then the t-case should go on.
-Should I do anything to trans since this has been sitting open? my understanding is that the adapter is open to the trans, so does that mean it could have dirt and windblown crap in it?
-if there's more to trans/adapter/t-case than what is shown in the pics at http://www.azbronco.com/dana20.htm show, does anyone have a link to a better exploded diagram?

thanks, scott

 

[iwlbcnu]

Yep, you are missing the adapter output shaft.
I couldn't get the link to come up.

 

[Scott M]

is "output adapter",

the same as "input shaft" or "spud shaft". problem is i don't have a good exploded view or parts book (hint, hint), and so its hard to make heads or tails of the old posts. there should also be a bearing and maindrive gear held on that shaft by snap rings, right? and if i've read correctly, the "input shaft" will be a piece that is specific to either manual or auto trans, so i need to find the right one.

 

[Scott M]

c'mon guys, i need some help here

i know somebody can give me a couple of quick-ass answers to my questions.

 

[67ster]

You are missing the d-20 input parts that are c-4 specific only .

 

[a67and77]

check out my post on nmeb ;D

 

[Grunt1058]

Scott,

I got a C4/D20 Adapter and D20 all seperated and sitting on my bench. Come take a look at them live and in person. I'm sure you'll find what you need in my pile o parts. But, you can't have my adapter... ;D ;D

 

[Scott M]

This is it?

The PO showed up w/ the following parts, as well as the case. Anyways, the one closeup is the piece, I think. Although I don't recognize the tapered housing part from the exploded diagram i've seen.

So, is the is the right part? Is it useable in this condition, aside from cleaning the rust, replacing bearing and seal? And if its right it just slides on the output shaft of trans and the gear splines into the t-case?

 

[73stallion]

the part in the center of your first pic is what you need. clean it up, install a new bearing and seal, slide it into the t-case opening. don't forget to put the 13 roller bearings in the t-case before you put it in. then just slide the whole thing into the rear of the C-4.

good luck!

 

[Scott M]

Hey 73,

Is the roller bearing different than the bearing (#7065) shown in this diagram? If so, is it a part i can get a parts store or what? (Like I said earlier, a good diagram of the adapter/t-case would sure help).

and you're saying for easiest install; bolt the adapter housing to the t-case w/ adapter installed, then put whole thing on the trans?

 

[73stallion]

these are the roller bearings i'm referring to;

http://broncograveyard.com/bronco/i-11676_dana_20_input_shaft_needle_bearings.htm

they go in the hollow gear in the t'case to keep the spud shaft centered.

put the spud shaft/bearing/bearing retainer together and slide the assembly into the t-case opening (don't forget the big o'ring), then bolt the t-case to the tranny adapter housing.

did that make sense?

 

[Scott M]

yeah, great

thankyou. although i'm a little foggy on the roller bearing thing (although i've seen about a million posts on it). but i'm sure it'll be clear once i get a new t-case and have everything in front of me.

 

[BwoncoHowie]

thankyou. although i'm a little foggy on the roller bearing thing (although i've seen about a million posts on it). but i'm sure it'll be clear once i get a new t-case and have everything in front of me.

The 13 rollers are a pilot bearing for the spud shaft, they install into the intermediate shaft input gear assembly of the transfer case before the spud shaft goes in.

I find it best to assemble the spud shaft assembly and adapter housing to the transfer case first, then install that completed assembly to your C-4. It seems that who ever took yours apart did it backwards. I would have separated the cast iron adapter housing from the transmission case first before disassembling the rest.

Although the pic is for a manual trans, you get the idea of the finished transfer case assembly

 

[jeffdukovac]

Nice chopper in the background, any larger pics?

Jeff

 

[Scott M]

jeffdukovac, you talking to me?

Oh, just realized you're probably talking about the pics on the wall in the background. Yeah, there are some in my gallery. That there's my baby. She's usually undergoes some kinda transformation every couple of months, but you'll get the gist from the gallery. If ya want any details or close ups email me.

by the way, i got a nice, complete 96" shovel sitting on my workbench. i should probably find a home for it before i do something stupid, like buy another frame to put it in.

thanks everybody else for the help. think I'm getting close. But just to make sure, one last question: aside from that adapter (spudshaft, gear, etc.), the t-case will be the same for either auto or manual. just thinking ahead to when i pic up a t-case; it shouldn't matter where it came from?

 

[67ster]

I have wondered the very same thing as the T and J shift have a slightly different low range ratio. I have been told the bull gear that runs on the spud shaft is the same for either style , what do our esteemed panel of experts have to say ?

 

[Bronconut]

I took a C4 set up out of a 76 (J-shift) and put it in my 68 (T-shift). Unbolted the J-shift T/C from the adapter and bolted the T-shift right up. If there is a difference I didn't notice it. Been running it like this for about 10 years. Some people also say there is a difference in the driveshafts between auto and manual, but I'm not sure why.

 

[iwlbcnu]

T case is the same for both. T shift is a lower gear ratio, but must not affect the mating gear to the spud shaft.

 

[73stallion]

here's a link that shows the roller bearings in place (hope this works);

http://www.lonestar-ebc.com-tcaseneedlebear.jpg

 

[BwoncoHowie]

thanks everybody else for the help. think I'm getting close. But just to make sure, one last question: aside from that adapter (spudshaft, gear, etc.), the t-case will be the same for either auto or manual. just thinking ahead to when i pic up a t-case; it shouldn't matter where it came from?

The shaft and housings are different on the manual and automatic versions and will not interchange. some have used a manual spud shaft on the C-4, but you have to grind a bunch of material off the spud shaft to make it work. The unwelcome side effect to doing this makes the internal splines shorter than the automatic spud shaft, hence full spline surface area and penetration is not possible.