Bumpsteer- Check my angles.

[Eyedoc]

Be kind because I'm gradually learning my way around my new bronco. Having the usual bumpsteer and wandering issues. I have been scouring threads and have a good idea of what should be checked, but I wanted opinions on my track/drag angle. I have a 3.5" lift, track bar lowering bracket, and drop down pitman arm. Recent alignment was good per PO (no detailed printout, but I do have a receipt from the service). 33" tires that I recently decreased the pressure to 25 psi with improvement in wandering. Power steering was added by PO. I did notice the passenger tie rod dust cover seems disfigured, but there doesn't seem to be any play. I was going to change out the springs for something a little softer, but I'm afraid it will make things worse. Let me know what you think!

 

[DirtDonk]

Some of the boot issue is likely due to rotational movement of the tie rod.
Your angles aren't as bad as some, but they're not perfect either. Could be the steering box, could be the pitman arm, could be the trackbar bracket, could be the angle of the tie-rod/draglink, or it could be all of the above.

I would start by loosening all three adjusting sleeves and rotating the tie-rod up just a little more so that the angle on the draglink's grease fitting is just a bit higher up.
Really looks like you're close on that, but it could benefit in your case from a little more I think.

Your pitman arm is for a full-size truck and does not have quite as much drop as a Bronco-specific arm does. If you need to, you could substitute the different arm to get the angle of the draglink a little lower to help match it to the trackbar better.
You could also drill a hole a little higher up on the drop bracket to raise the trackbar angle, but that's kind of going in the wrong direction so I like the other ways first.

Good luck.

Got more pics of the steering box from the side?

Paul

 

[Eyedoc]

Thanks for the help DirtDonk. That is great advice and I will start by rotating the tie rod up. Here are some pics as requested...

 

[Dannyboy71]

I am by no means any kind of an expert, but in one of the photos I can see what looks like your c bushing is cracked in half. Not sure if it hurts anything but could be a factor. I am sure that more will chime that are more knowledgeable.

 

[dave67fd]

I would change the C bushing/s. Also looks like your shock hoops aren't welded to the frame and guessing maybe your track bar drop bracket isin't either. Check it..If not you could be getting some movement there a well. Stabilizer is on backwards but not likely an issue or real concern.

Think you could do away with the rear mounted shocks with those Bilsteins. Move the front mounted Bilsteins in their place.

 

[Eyedoc]

Good finds! The C bushing is from Duff and it is not cracked into the "meat" of the bushing, only the outer cup has the crack. The shock hoops and track bar drop bracket are not welded yet, but I'm not seeing any play and I'm not taking it off-road any time soon. I do plan to weld them on in the near future. I'm going to try the easy stuff first (rotating the tie rod, replacing the pitman arm) and if I have to move to dropping the axle I will.

 

[Eyedoc]

BTW- Can't believe I missed the backwards stabilizer, Dave! This is why I love this forum. Some times you just need another set of eyes.

 

[Viperwolf1]

Your pitman arm is for a full-size truck and does not have quite as much drop as a Bronco-specific arm does. If you need to, you could substitute the different arm to get the angle of the draglink a little lower to help match it to the trackbar better.

Not only that but also the twist is in the wrong direction which is putting that rod end in a nasty bind. That end is probably bad at this point.

 

[Eyedoc]

Thanks Viperwolf! I think I'm definitely going to change the pitman arm now. Between you and Paul I think it isn't doing me any favors.

 

[Slednut10]

Think you could do away with the rear mounted shocks with those Bilsteins. Move the front mounted Bilsteins in their place.

Do this before changing your springs. The Bilsteins work really well by themselves and that could save you a few bucks to spend elsewhere. Don't wait to weld that trackbar drop bracket. Just the little bit of flex you get translates into lots more at the wheels much like a slightly worn trackbar bushing.

 

[Eyedoc]

Pardon my Noob question...So I can leave off the rear shock and only run the Bilstein in the rear position? Seems like a simple switch. Anything to watch out for?

 

[Justafordguy]

I would go ahead and replace those C bushings. They are cheap and you can make sure you put 7 degree bushings in.

 

[DirtDonk]

The crack in the C-bushing is not keeping it from doing it's job or making it likely to ever fall out, but it wouldn't hurt to make sure you have the most you can get anyway. If for no other reason than it would look more functional than something having a big crack.
Unusual for the bushings to do that anyway I would think. If you do change them at some point down the road, make sure to clean any excess slag/rust/gunk off of the pads before installing new ones.

Your tie-rod is actually at a halfway decent angle. But I think it would benefit from that little extra twist you're going to give it. Besides, it's a cheap and easy experiment.
I notice that the cotter pin in the rod end stud is not inside the castellations (slots) of the nut. By any chance can you see a second, lower hole to utilize? If not, I would drill one so that the cotter pin has a chance to do it's job.

They're correct that the trackbar bracket should be welded. Just that little tiny bit of flex that is there but you can't see normally is enough to give you a tiny bit of wandering.

I see the box is one of the modern replacements. If it's the one with 4.5 turns lock-to-lock you should keep it. If it's the quicker 3-turn box though, I could see why you think it's twitchy on a Bronco.
Easy to check. Just turn left then right all the way to the locks (just momentarily) and count the turns.

In fact, some things you should always do on modified Broncos if you didn't do the mods yourself are to verify that the steering box is centered (not the wheel, but the box) when the vehicle is rolling straight ahead. If not, it could get twitchy.
And following up that test with "the test" where a helper turns the steering wheel back and forth (tires fully on the ground only) while you watch for any monkey motion or excess play is mandatory on EB's.
Seems like you said you did that recently(?), or was that someone else I was thinking of.

Paul

 

[Eyedoc]

Paul,

Had my wife help me with "the test" the other day and didn't find anything strange.

I have a new drop pitman arm in the mail as we speak.

I'm going to check the box tonight to see what I have and make sure it is centered. Do you just count the turns and go halfway back to find center?

I'm also going to rotate the tie rod tonight to see if I can get a better angle.

I'll check on the cotter pin to see if it can be in a better place.

Per SledNut I also plan on trying the Bilsteins by themselves.

Thanks for all the help!! I need to find a way to buy everyone a round of beers. ;D

Michael

 

[DirtDonk]

Ok, that was you talking about it then. Good.
One thing you may not have noticed then, in case you weren't looking super close, was some moving in the trackbar bracket. Maybe yours is super solid, but every other one that we've ever looked at that was not welded had extra movement. It was hard to see, but it was there.
It just goes to show that as far as the trackbar is concerned, even a tiny bit of side-to-side movement is bad.
Same for tie-rod ends everywhere. They're designed to pivot, but should have zero play in them. If you can see a tie-rod, a drag-link or a trackbar move even a fraction of an inch side-to-side, it's in need of some TLC

For finding the box center, I would wait until you get the pitman arm so you can kill two birds with one wrench. Since the linkage can limit total travel, you want the box disconnected from the steering linkage while finding center.
But then yes, you just turn it all the way one way till it stops (doesn't matter which way first), then go back all the way to the other side stop while counting the turns. If it helps to visualize, put some tape and a mark at some point of reference so you can be exact.
Once you find how many total turns just go back exactly half way. So if your box has exactly 4.250 turns lock to lock, you go back 2.125 turns and there you are.
If the steering wheel is exactly centered at this point, great. One less thing you have to mess with.
However, if it's pointing off to the side somewhere, you will need to either remove the steering wheel and re-center it, or if you find it easier you can unbolt the steering shaft from the steering box itself and turn the shaft. Both have 36 splines usually, so you can get your fine adjustments down to about 10° at a time. Hopefully one of those falls in the sweet spot.

Once the box is centered, you can install the new pitman arm pointed straight back along the frame. Early models with manual steering, and some very early power equipped models, had the arm pointed slightly (1 spline in fact) to the driver's side.
Later power steering trucks had the arm oriented straight back. Your new arm probably does not have the indexing feature, so you can put it anywhere you want. I would point it straight back and be consistent with the later '73 and up rigs.

Regarding mounting the shocks in the different positions, you will need to verify the length and mounting are compatible. Easy to do though.
Got pics of the tops of the shocks and their mounts while we're on the subject?

Thanks

Paul

 

[WILDHORSES]

I didn't have time to read everything so I'm pretty sure Paul has already covered this stuff but just incase.

I would start with a drop pitman designed for this lift WH #1275 or equivalent. The angle in that drag is quite a bit steeper than the track bar.

If your wheeling cut to a TRO (tie rod over) the knuckle. Just my .02

Jim

 

[Eyedoc]

Well, I tried to adjust the angle on the tie rod, but there are only 2 adjustment sleeves. So that is not going to work. Good thing the drop pitman arm is in the mail.

I also took off the rear mounted shocks and SURPRISE- they are worthless. So the Bilsteins will be going on the rear mount. Travels are the same.

Paul, Definitely got 4+ full rotations out of the steering wheel, but will iron everything out when I get the pitman arm.

Now I noticed something that I need help on. Notice in the picture of the front end how the radius arm caps and bottom of the shocks are lower on the passenger side compared to the tie rod? It's not an illusion. Could this be an issue? The c bushing on the passenger side also seems to be at more of an angle than the driver side. Maybe C bushing mounted backwards?

Won't be off roading any time soon WH!

Thanks again everyone.

 

[WILDHORSES]

Now I noticed something that I need help on. Notice in the picture of the front end how the radius arm caps and bottom of the shocks are lower on the passenger side compared to the tie rod? It's not an illusion. Could this be an issue? The c bushing on the passenger side also seems to be at more of an angle than the driver side. Maybe C bushing mounted backwards?

Won't be off roading any time soon WH!

Thanks again everyone.

Not an issue unless it just bugs you to look at it. It's almost not noticeable without you mentioning it. The C cap would end up in the same spot no matter what you do with the bushings. The only way to "fix" it is to remove and re-weld the shock tab in the position you want. I would mock it up and tack the mount in place and double check it before really burning it in. Also to keep from melting your C-bushings you would need to weld the shock tab on the cap with it removed from the arm. A lot of work for what would appear to be 90% cosmetic. Good luck!

Jim

 

[DirtDonk]

Well, I tried to adjust the angle on the tie rod, but there are only 2 adjustment sleeves. So that is not going to work. Good thing the drop pitman arm is in the mail.

Oops, sorry 'bout that. I only saw the adjustable draglink and jumped in my mind to the conclusion you had the fully adjustable setup. Even though it's clear in one of your first pics that it's not.
Obviously with just the one tie-rod adjuster your angle is where it's going to be. The good news is that it is in fact the stock angle which is pretty optimized already.
Just not ideal for matching the trackbar with mismatched components like the pitman arm.
As you said, good thing the new one's on the way!

Now I noticed something that I need help on. Notice in the picture of the front end how the radius arm caps and bottom of the shocks are lower on the passenger side compared to the tie rod? It's not an illusion. Could this be an issue? The c bushing on the passenger side also seems to be at more of an angle than the driver side. Maybe C bushing mounted backwards?

Yes.
I'll add to what Jim said in that while the cap and bolts will stay the same no matter what you do, if a bushing is in backwards, or if one side has more offset than the other, or if something is physically different in the knuckles from side to side, it would show up like this.
Looking at your alignment specs, is the side where the rod looks higher than the bolts the side with more caster? Is there quite a bit of difference between the sides?
If the side where the bar is higher is the one with more caster, that will lift the steering arm and the tie-rod up slightly.

Wonder if that bushing is split from some other reason then?
You're right to think it shouldn't be that way, but Jim's right that it's likely not a big deal in itself, unless you see a big split between the caster numbers. But I say it's worth digging into a bit more.
Did you ever post up what your readings were after getting up on the rack?

Paul

 

[Jdgephar]

Does anyone have a measurement of the drop of the drop pitman arm? I'm suspecting that I may have the wrong drop arm myself.