Duff's monster 4-link install *PROBLEM*

[chuzie]

It is my understanding that the outboard hoops were replaced by the inboard to make the setup more stable. I agree that no one kit is going to be completely universal as there is WAY too much variation amongst the rigs. That being said, these kits need to provide that flexibility for the end user to modify them within a wide tolerance of configuration parameters (i.e. don't have the shock tabs already welded to the lower truss so as to provide the option of placement to maximize travel.) Sure, most rigs may end up placing the tabs in the stock position, but in cases like me, for whatever reason, I need to be able to adjust without having to hack the system apart after the fact.

 

[SpareParts]

It is offered as a complete kit, not pieces to build your own 4 link. It sounds Iike you should have looked into it more before you bought it. The problem sounds like it don't work after you wanted to lower it and modify it from the way it was intended.

 

[chuzie]

RTFT!!!

Seriously?

I researched it for about 2 months before I bought it; hours of conversations with Duff's and folks online. I am pretty sure I did my part with the research. To say that an issue with the system is due to my lack of research is not reasonable, especially in this circumstance. Further, who said anything about me having lowered it? I haven't lpwered or modified squat. The setup is installed per Duff's instructions and will NOT be modified until they figure out how to rectify THEIR issue.

I weighed the options of a pre-built kit versus fabricating my own and decided the kit was worth the $$$ with the understanding that it actually worked.

Are you on Duff's PR staff or what?

I am not knocking the kit. It is a badass kit. It just needs some fixes from the factory before it is truly ready for the public.

 

[Monster Mike]

what does RTFT stand for?

 

[chuzie]

Sorry, military habit. It is adapted from RTFQ (read the fu**ing question) to RTFT (read the fu**ing thread)

 

[Monster Mike]

Sorry, military habit. It is adapted from RTFQ (read the fu**ing question) to RTFT (read the fu**ing thread)

ha ha ok, dont go pirate on us here. lots of guys skim over threads and say things before they have all there facts straight or just make assumptions.

happens all the time.

I like how thourough you are, hope you get everything worked out.

 

[chuzie]

You're probably right; bad habit I guess. Anyway, SpareParts, didn't mean to bite your head off there bro; my apologies. Just frustrated with the whole situation with the investment made considering the return, or lack thereof. If you go through the entire thread, you will better understand what the situation is.

-Mike

 

[rtreads]

Good question. I think that would be great, but the front and rear coils are not interchangeable so obtaining a 4.5" rear coil is not an option.

Not true. Call coilsprings.com. They just made me custom coils for the front of my 2010 F150 to carry a 680lb plow and have a built in 2" leveling kit. They can build anything!!

 

[ET]

I'm wondering if maybe the trust/link mounts is fab up wrong. The other pix I've seen the lower link mount is lower then center of axle tube. Yours is obviously high and maybe that raised the coil mount. Just a thought.

Eugene

 

[SpareParts]

Chuize, I don't work for Duffs. I live in Missouri! I understand your frustration and I did just skim the thread. As I stated, I have wheeled with their rig and it works really well as indicated in my pics. With the talk of the difference height coils, I guess I assumed that you were changing heights of the lift. I have not installed their kit so I do not have first hand experience on how it goes on. Hope you can figure out where the difference lies and make the kit work for you.

David

 

[chuzie]

I have not seen other examples of these kits in action but you may have a good point about the fab of the mounts. I know it is not our placement of the truss on the axle housing since they build it almost like a glove. We couldn't have screwed up the placement of the upper mount either since there is a measurement and reference point during installation.

In the end, I think we will end up moving the lower mounts lower and the upper crossmember forward a bit. I think all four shock mounts will have to be lowered. The outboards bottom out before the inboards, but just barely, so an outboard only fix will then shift the issue to the inboards.

The only question I have about changing the angle of the shocks is how such a change will affect the stability / damping of the system. What is the critical angle at which the shocks significantly lose effectiveness?

 

[Monster Mike]

Im no expert so my two cents would be that anything past a 45 degree angle is gonna be pretty ineffective

I was wondering if there was a difference in how this 4 link works with eb axles and full width axles. are you running full width chuzie?

it seems the 4 link works well with full width as far as the outboard shock mounts are concerned.

Im running eb axles with spring rockers and I have nowhere to hang outboard shocks that are effective. I would have to cut into the body to make it work and I cant bring myself to do that

 

[chuzie]

I am running a '75 EB 9". I have been told that the outboard mounts would have solved this issue but then the stability factor comes in to play. I love the setup though. I can stuff the tires and extend them to kingdom come. Once this issue gets resolved, it will be even better.

 

[SpareParts]

Outboard shocks will make it more stable. I looked back over the thread, you have been using the Bronco for the past year? Without fixing the shock bottoming out problem? Everything you do to the suspension, with the coil tower mounting height, upper shock mounting height, weight of rig, tire size and unsprung weight of rig...... All of this will effect the amount of travel you will have. This is where the "kit" stops in my opinion and the installer has to make the appropriate changes to make it work with his rig. Sometimes that would mean a shock would be to long? The mounting angle doesn't work with your set up? In my opinion, they could have sent out bump stops and limiting straps. That would keep the suspension from getting as much flex and limiting the amount of "responsibility" of the installer. This would not let you gain the most travel and benifits of going with a 4 link system. I think that is part of owning and modifying your bronco, dialing in your own setup to get them maximum gain from your modifications.

 

[chuzie]

I agree completely with the responsibility facet. The kit has been on for a year and I just have not had the time to address any issues or fully test it as Uncle Sam has me gone all the time. That being said, the rig has been tested off road twice. The shock issue did not come up until the second test this past October. So we are now in the phase of researching options to make the necessary modifications to correct the problem. When we initially fitted the system a year ago, we did not see the shocks as an issue until we recently tested them. So my shock has been leaking for about 2 months and the rig has not been driven since. I just wish the upper coil mount issue was where the problem stopped. I don't think this will take much effort to fix, but i do want it done right.

 

[SpareParts]

It takes a couple of outings to work out the kinks.

 

[blazinchuck]

i personally think we need to ditch the entire upper/lower shock mount system...id rather see the dual shock out-board set up. right now we are limited upwards due to the floor...once we move to the complete out board set up...then the upper shock points move up into the fender well area or close to it. stability shouldnt have jack to do about them moving the shocks where they are now...thats silly

 

[blazinchuck]

also...as for bump stops, a lot of vendors really missed the boat...almost no front bump stop works with the different versions of arms out there, i had to lose my front ones so i could install the duff front lower coil buckets. a more effective stop should come off the flat top side of the duff/cage arms...i made a set for my last crawler(worked great)


no reason duff couldnt have provided a rear bump as well for the linked kit

crappy pics of front bump and rear(leaf springs tho)

 

[SpareParts]

They could supply a bump stop, however the mounting of it to be affective would still be up to the individual rig. Too many variables like I mentioned before. If you are installing a 4 link kit, most people have modified their rigs heavily beyond stock at that point. So exhausts systems, fuel tanks, body lifts, wheel well cut outs, tires sizes......all have an effect on where the bump stop is mounted.

 

[Casey835]

Something like the stock axle shock mount would give you a little more but I dont think it would still be enough. You do have at least a 2" body lift right? I know its a stupid question- just sayin or askin. I had to move my top mount forward enough to avoid the shock from hitting the lower coil seat. I might have 6" of shock extended if im lucky.