Front suspension

[DirtDonk]

Ok got it get everything at ride height first.

Yep. You'll find that this is a good starting point for MANY aspects of a build.

So you said previously that I have to set up everything to make sure it all works together. I definitely want to put long radius arms would you want to install them first,or just tack weld all the frame brackets in place?

Assuming the instructions that come with the arms dictate a bracket location right up front, I would tack weld them in that position, then re-check everything when more stuff is installed.
If no instructions, then definitely ONLY tack weld them until you're very close to complete. And long before you do any specialty coating to the frame and axles!

If I do go with a track bar riser how do you riser up the drag link by flipping the tie rod?

Again, mock-up, mock-up, mock-up. And then some more mocking up!
Since you're trying to match the length (if possible) and the exact angle of one bar to the other, you won't know if going TRO is the best/only way to achieve that, until you're at that point. No one-answer to most of the questions you'll have.
Not until more stuff is together, assuming any other changes to the steering system such as non stock box and non-stock Pitman arm and non-stock steering linkages.
Of course, keeping the frame/axle relationship at ride height is still critical. If you're going to be doing this stuff before the vehicle is fully assembled, then lock the two together without the springs in place.
Take metal tubing and weld some in-between the frame and axles. Whether to the frame, to each axle corner, or both, does not really matter. Only safety and consistency count at that stage. If you want to use wood 4x4's that's cool too. Just anchor them in place somehow, so that you can be messing with the frame and moving things around without dislodging them.

If you go this route, welding/clamping metal tubing might be the best bet.

If I go with the drop bracket would you want to reinforce the frame in any way?

Depends. How are you going to be using the vehicle again? What size tires?
My '71 has been through the Rubicon multiple times, as well as many other trails over it's 45+ years in my care. And every time but the first time were with an old-school (from the mid-'80's) trackbar drop bracket. No cracks, chips, or mutilations have ever occurred.
Yes, plenty of them have experienced compromised frames in that area. But also plenty have cracked frames without them, just due to the steering box putting stress into it. The first cracked frame I ever found was on a stock height Bronco.
If it's within your power to reinforce the frame, by all means do so. But then again, you might consider it even if you do not run a drop bracket.

Paul

 

[Chris99]

Yep. You'll find that this is a good starting point for MANY aspects of a build.

Assuming the instructions that come with the arms dictate a bracket location right up front, I would tack weld them in that position, then re-check everything when more stuff is installed.
If no instructions, then definitely ONLY tack weld them until you're very close to complete. And long before you do any specialty coating to the frame and axles!

Again, mock-up, mock-up, mock-up. And then some more mocking up!
Since you're trying to match the length (if possible) and the exact angle of one bar to the other, you won't know if going TRO is the best/only way to achieve that, until you're at that point. No one-answer to most of the questions you'll have.
Not until more stuff is together, assuming any other changes to the steering system such as non stock box and non-stock Pitman arm and non-stock steering linkages.
Of course, keeping the frame/axle relationship at ride height is still critical. If you're going to be doing this stuff before the vehicle is fully assembled, then lock the two together without the springs in place.
Take metal tubing and weld some in-between the frame and axles. Whether to the frame, to each axle corner, or both, does not really matter. Only safety and consistency count at that stage. If you want to use wood 4x4's that's cool too. Just anchor them in place somehow, so that you can be messing with the frame and moving things around without dislodging them.

If you go this route, welding/clamping metal tubing might be the best bet.

Depends. How are you going to be using the vehicle again? What size tires?
My '71 has been through the Rubicon multiple times, as well as many other trails over it's 45+ years in my care. And every time but the first time were with an old-school (from the mid-'80's) trackbar drop bracket. No cracks, chips, or mutilations have ever occurred.
Yes, plenty of them have experienced compromised frames in that area. But also plenty have cracked frames without them, just due to the steering box putting stress into it. The first cracked frame I ever found was on a stock height Bronco.
If it's within your power to reinforce the frame, by all means do so. But then again, you might consider it even if you do not run a drop bracket.

Paul

Need some advice if the trac bar and drag link looks ok . I think I have the frame sitting pretty close to ride height .

 

[DirtDonk]

Need some advice if the trac bar and drag link looks ok.

It’s pretty good, but it looks like the riser and could go up one more hole.
Of course, it’s hard to tell from here. But you can verify by measuring the center of the lower trackbar pivot point to the ground. Then do the same thing to the upper.
Then measure the lower pivot point of the drag link, the best you can, to the ground and same for the upper.
Compare the measurements to verify parallelism.

I think I have the frame sitting pretty close to ride height .

How close is pretty close? How much lift are you running?
You’re using the measurement between the top of the axle tube in the bottom of the frame rail as your reference point? So approximately 7 inches plus whatever you are lift is would be the go to point.

 

[Chris99]

It’s pretty good, but it looks like the riser and could go up one more hole.
Of course, it’s hard to tell from here. But you can verify by measuring the center of the lower trackbar pivot point to the ground. Then do the same thing to the upper.
Then measure the lower pivot point of the drag link, the best you can, to the ground and same for the upper.
Compare the measurements to verify parallelism.

How close is pretty close? How much lift are you running?
You’re using the measurement between the top of the axle tube in the bottom of the frame rail as your reference point? So approximately 7 inches plus whatever you are lift is would be the go to point.

I’m running a 3.5in lift. I measured for the top or the axle tube to the bottom of the frame it at 10 1/2 inches it kind of hard to get a really straight measurement but I think it’s within a 1/16 or an 1/8. I put some metal tube to bolt in where the spring go.

Sorry I’m a little confused on how you verify the parallelism ? I moved the bolt to the top hole but it seems really flat or is this better?

 

[DirtDonk]

Regarding the measuring, I was probably just making it more complicated, but I thought that doing it from the ground as being a more consistent and easy way to measure the distance between the two pairs of pivot points.
The only other way (that I can think of) is to measure directly between the upper pair of pivot points, and between the lower pair.
You can’t measure between a section of the bar, because the bar has a slight curve to it.

Basically, just measure between the lower drag link mount and the lower track bar mount and compare that measurement between the upper drag link mount and upper truck bar mount.
If they are the same, your bars are parallel.

 

[Chris99]

Regarding the measuring, I was probably just making it more complicated, but I thought that doing it from the ground as being a more consistent and easy way to measure the distance between the two pairs of pivot points.
The only other way (that I can think of) is to measure directly between the upper pair of pivot points, and between the lower pair.
You can’t measure between a section of the bar, because the bar has a slight curve to it.

Basically, just measure between the lower drag link mount and the lower track bar mount and compare that measurement between the upper drag link mount and upper truck bar mount.
If they are the same, your bars are parallel.

Ok so I measured the distance between the upper and lower trac bar and drag link seems pretty close. But idk how perfect it has to be? If I measure from the ground would you just subtract one measurement from other and that would be the difference? I also put an angle finder on the on the trac bar and drag link would this also tell you if they’re running parallel to each other? I feel like the trac bar is to far from the drag link if I pull it in the upper hole. Here is some more pictures.

 

[DirtDonk]

Ok so I measured the distance between the upper and lower trac bar and drag link seems pretty close. But idk how perfect it has to be?

Not perfect necessarily. But as close as you can get it.

If I measure from the ground would you just subtract one measurement from other and that would be the difference?

I suppose that’s one way to put it. Probably the same as what I’m suggesting, but you’re not necessarily needing to subtract one from the other, as much as compare one to the other.
You’re looking for the difference between the drag link and track bar to be the same at the lower pivot as they are at the upper pivot.
If the measurements are the same, they are parallel.

I also put an angle finder on the on the trac bar and drag link would this also tell you if they’re running parallel to each other?

No. That’s what I was mentioning earlier as the whole reason for using the pivot points as your reference.
Primarily because, while the track bar is mostly straight, the drag link is anything but straight. So an angle measurement means nothing.
If you could create a straight edge between the upper and lower mounts, that angle would be accurate and could then compare to the track bar.
Otherwise angles are meaningless.

I feel like the trac bar is to far from the drag link if I pull it in the upper hole. Here is some more pictures.

Well, they look close from here, but it’s hard to say. Pictures lie.
So use your own judgment and your own measurements and your own comparisons.

One reason I don’t like risers in a situation like this is because I really don’t like parallelograms. I can’t tell you that there’s any issue with them, and I think others have done geometry calculations to prove that there’s no difference between a parallelogram and two parallel lines in the same plane.