help for a squirrely ride

[4x4man514]

hey guys, so heres my question. when i first built my bronco 20 years ago i built it for the trail. 4 inches in the front 5 in the back with 37s. i had the bc bronco(i think) rear spring rockers. and extended radius arms in the front. it was definitely a lil loose on the rd but managable.

well i had a fire and had to start over. i still have the same lift with the same rockers in the rear. in the front now i have stock radius arms but i now have a wristed axle. i finally got it on the rd and even at 20mph its scary the way it wanders around

i finally got it on the rd and even at 20mph its scary the way it wanders around. since my rebuild i did a full frame off restoration so its safe to say this ol girl has seen her last trail. pavement princess for sure. so i know alot of this looseness can be eliminated with these upgrades

my question is, what do yall think is causing my biggest issue? what should i try to eliminate first? i didnt think these changes would make it ride that much worse( or maybe its the fact i havent driven an eb in 20 yrs and have forgotten lol.) or do yall think it could be more of an alignment issue?

thanks a bunch!
kevin

 

[JB Fab]

Wristed axle and spring rockers are not your friend if you want road manners.....
I removed the spring rockers from one of our Broncos after 20 years, it reduced the on-road pucker-factor significantly.

 

[EPB72]

Yeah spring rockers are a little scary,, I was passenger in friends bronco on the rubicon about 20 years ago and quite the experience, not to mention the ride up there from shingle springs to loon lake what a roller coaster ride ,,,

 

[4x4man514]

lol. yea i remember riding my friends around in my first version bronco. those guys were scared to death. but i was used to it and knew it was the body rolling more than anything, now im the chickens##t. lol

so the wristed axle doesnt make THAT much difference? i hope so. the rockers will be the easiest thing to swap out.

 

[ntsqd]

After removing the rockers I'd go back to the long radius arms and a solid axle housing, but I'm biased that direction to start with.

What are your Caster numbers? Stock arms and that much lift I'll bet they're not good.

 

[4x4man514]

After removing the rockers I'd go back to the long radius arms and a solid axle housing, but I'm biased that direction to start with.

What are your Caster numbers? Stock arms and that much lift I'll bet they're not good.

i put the lift on a while back and i cant remember what c bushings i put in it so it might be the caster. i dont know how to check it without going to an alignment shop. heck i worried about finding a shop that knows how to do the alignment on an older vehicle.

 

[ntsqd]

They likely can't do an adjustment unless it needs the Toe changed (& that being off can make it squirrely), but they can put it on their machine and get you all of the alignment numbers.

 

[4x4man514]

Hey guys im gonna bring my old thread back up for one more question. I forgot to mention my rear shocks are also mounted in the center positiin of a shock hoop so i know that will be a contributing factor too.

So my qustionn is. How much difference does that make as compared to the spring rockers?

I have blocks on the way to replace the rockers but should i try to move the shocks back to the original mounts before i swap the rockers out? Or do you feel that the shock mounting isnt really makung much of a difference? Thanks!

 

[Broncobowsher]

It could be so much. You probably have every single possible bad thing for road manors. When in the day where we actually beat these rigs on trails and everyone was going after as much flex as possible, even if it wasn't even benificial. And a race to see who could get the lowest crawl ratio.

Looking at the rear, yes, great place to find issues. The spring rockers. They were cool until they weren't. Inboard mounted shocks, were great for articulation and ok enough for straight action, but were a pivot point for body roll. See what happens with a set of blocks. I'm also going to say check all the spring and shackle bushings while back there. After 20 years there is a good chance they are going bad.

Wristed housing. Was just thinking of that the other week. How it was the trick go to piece after the wristed arm was briefly the hot ticket before people were bending the unwristed arm. Was wondering what ever happened to all those housings? Guess you found one. While at the front, don't forget the usual suspects. Track bar bushings, drop track bar bracket starting to tear the frame. And the cracked frame at the steering box. The common problems of when these were modified for wheeling and wheeled hard. I would start with the modern solution of a modern front sway bar. It will only take a minute to lay a bead on the pivot and un-wrist he housing. Couple heavy tabs and a big bolt and you could make it selectable.

I hope you are not running around on 20 year old tires. I just pulled a truck out of storage that has 10 year old 37s on it and it is spooky at about 30 MPH.

 

[73azbronco]

Wristed axle and spring rockers are not your friend if you want road manners.....
I removed the spring rockers from one of our Broncos after 20 years, it reduced the on-road pucker-factor significantly.

Ditto, sell the wristed go back to solid, sorry, ditch the rotating spring perch. both primarily for flex.. I don't have wristed but have the awesome bump steer from some poor tie rod install.

 

[4x4man514]

It could be so much. You probably have every single possible bad thing for road manors. When in the day where we actually beat these rigs on trails and everyone was going after as much flex as possible, even if it wasn't even benificial. And a race to see who could get the lowest crawl ratio.

Looking at the rear, yes, great place to find issues. The spring rockers. They were cool until they weren't. Inboard mounted shocks, were great for articulation and ok enough for straight action, but were a pivot point for body roll. See what happens with a set of blocks. I'm also going to say check all the spring and shackle bushings while back there. After 20 years there is a good chance they are going bad.

Wristed housing. Was just thinking of that the other week. How it was the trick go to piece after the wristed arm was briefly the hot ticket before people were bending the unwristed arm. Was wondering what ever happened to all those housings? Guess you found one. While at the front, don't forget the usual suspects. Track bar bushings, drop track bar bracket starting to tear the frame. And the cracked frame at the steering box. The common problems of when these were modified for wheeling and wheeled hard. I would start with the modern solution of a modern front sway bar. It will only take a minute to lay a bead on the pivot and un-wrist he housing. Couple heavy tabs and a big bolt and you could make it selectable.

I hope you are not running around on 20 year old tires. I just pulled a truck out of storage that has 10 year old 37s on it and it is spooky at about 30 MPH.

Thanks! Yea your right there is prolly no need for any of this stuff now. Since ive had my fire years ago my rebuild has taken 15 to 20 years to complete. And now im going in a different direction. Amm my bushings and mounts should be solid. They are old but been in a garage the whole time. My 37s are only a couple yrs old but no use yet. I built my wristed axle many years ago but I have another unmolested front housing ill prolly just swap all my guts out with or maybe use your tab idea. I gotta get my caster right first but gotta find an alignment shop for that so im looking at the rear first. Shouldnt be too hard to get all tjat right. I havent seen or heard of any modern sway bars. Do you have any recommendations?

It is funny how much has changed with all of us over the years! Lol

 

[4x4man514]

Ditto, sell the wristed go back to solid, sorry, ditch the rotating spring perch. both primarily for flex.. I don't have wristed but. have the awesome bump steer from some poor tie rod install.

Man i hope my bumpsteer isnt bad. It was scary on my last eb. Had to snatch it to the right hard to get out of the death wobble that the bumpsteer caused

I have a raised bracket in the pumpkin for the track bar so that the angle isnt extreme. But havent really driven it much since all these changes.

 

[73azbronco]

Raised track bar mount on axle, not pumpkin?

I mean I have seen that but only on severe built severe jacked up riggs

 

[4x4man514]

Well yea. Axle i meant. My bad. NOT a drop bracket on frame

 

[DirtDonk]

Got any pics of your steering setup? From side to side, and the box?
Just curious what the setup is.

Thanks

Paul

 

[4x4man514]

Got any pics of your steering setup? From side to side, and the box?
Just curious what the setup is.

Thanks

Paul

Ill try to get some this morning

 

[4x4man514]

Ill try to get some this morning

 

[DirtDonk]

Even though they’re very dark, that helps a lot.

With four and a half inches of lift on a bronco you really do have to have everything perfect.
Is your tie-rod over the knuckle, or under? Looks like it’s still under but I’m not sure.
What is that large flat plate that looks to be bolted to the diff cover on the driver side?
Have you had the steering stabilizer shock off to test it?
What is the age (not the mileage) of your tires, and what tire pressures are you running?
With large tires, with aggressive tread, and heavily offset Wheels, every little input is going to be exaggerated because of the leverage factor against the Steering system.
Are you in the top hole of your trackbar Riser?
If so, I would get a dropped track bar bracket as well. A lot of people want to avoid that, but you have no choice at this point. You need to better match the angle of the track bar to the drag link.
Even though a shorter track bar can get away with a little bit of a steeper angle, your mismatch between the drag leg and track bar is too great I believe.
And at this point too, the overall angle of the track bar is too steep, I think, and is greatly contributing to your squirrel handling.

 

[DirtDonk]

Speaking of tires…
Are those 20 year-old tires? If so, they’re probably a decent contributor to this problem as well.

 

[DirtDonk]

I don’t remember if it’s been discussed here yet or not, but can’t a wristed axle housing be locked in place?
I know everybody says get rid of it, and I totally agree. But if it can be locked in place instead, then you’re not out all of that previous work and investment.
Not until you could find somebody that wants to buy a wrested axle for their crawler.
And get a decent amount of your money back.