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Title/frame vin question

aklb43

Jr. Member
Joined
Nov 27, 2009
Messages
135
So I did a frame off restore but instead of using the fram that had a matching vin to my title, I used a frame I bought and put everything onto it. I never thought it would really matter which frame I used since the fram vin is buried under there. I also don’t intend to sell the truck. Will I run into any issues? I still have the frame with the matching vin, and it’s not to late to use it, but it would be a pain A$$ to restore it and move all my junk onto it.
 

B RON CO

Contributor
Bronco Guru
Joined
Jun 29, 2016
Messages
2,420
Loc.
Statesville, NC
Hi, you have to find out the story in your state.
Here in New York they just look at the paperwork and take your money.
We are not scrutinized over Vin plates.
Good luck
 

Broncobowsher

Total hack
Joined
Jun 4, 2002
Messages
35,064
Varies.
Do you have any paperwork on the frame you are now using?

Things could be fine, or they could get very ugly. There is no clear answer other than it is possible. Even if you register it and everything goes smooth, some years in the future things may happen you never expect. And if there is ever question and they find the VIN on the frame, things could get interesting and not in a good way. Last auction I was at there were officials from the auction going through the cars and doing a bunch of documentation. I am sure it was a CYA on there part.

At this point I would start with where did the frame come from?
 
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aklb43

aklb43

Jr. Member
Joined
Nov 27, 2009
Messages
135
Definitely gonna hold onto the original frame now. Honestly, if I remember right, I don’t even think you can make out the vin stamp on the frame I used in the restore due to the por-15 covering it up mostly.
 

bmc69

Contributor
Bronco Guru
Joined
Jun 11, 2004
Messages
11,872
The only "legal" VIN on an EB is the one stamped on the frame in two places. That's 100% of the reason why you can buy the other VIN tags and stickers from Marti. Simple.

That aside, the "inspectors" in many states will simply go by the tag that is easiest to find.
 

Slowleak

Bronco Guru
Joined
Sep 12, 2013
Messages
3,766
Loc.
Georgia
If it was me, I would do it the legal way and not have to worry about potential issues. Talk to the DMV before you find out the hard way what those issues might be.
 

Gupster88

Contributor
Guppy
Joined
Jan 15, 2019
Messages
817
Loc.
Tillamook OR
Thought I would jump in on this conversation with another question. I have a 75 frame I bought with a couple of other broncos. Has VIN clearly marked U15GLV00004. Thinking of building from ground up. Can I simply get a Marti report for this with new tags and then apply for a replacement title ? Anyone have a clear answer here. Thanks , Jeff
 

fordguy

Contributor
Bronco Guru
Joined
Jan 23, 2005
Messages
5,552
I looked at a bronco for sale today, no glovebox vin, but a vin tag on the inner kick panel drivers side. title is bonded and the owner lost it. he will talk to the DMV next week. Forgot to look at the frame to see if they matched. I know the one vin location in the engine bay area, where is the other one? also interesting number on this bronco, A00505. That is the earliest number i have seen on a bronco up close and personal.
 
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garberz

Bronco Influencer
Joined
Jun 24, 2007
Messages
6,859
Loc.
Conejo Valley, Ca.
I looked at a bronco for sale today, no glovebox vin, but a vin tag on the inner kick panel drivers side. title is bonded and the owner lost it. he will talk to the DMV next week. Forgot to look at the frame to see if they matched. I know the one vin location in the engine bay area, where is the other one? also interesting number on this bronco, A00505. That is the earliest number i have seen on a bronco up close and personal.

66’ and 67’ have the vin tag on the drivers kick panel. The glove box tag started in 68’.

Mark
 

Slowleak

Bronco Guru
Joined
Sep 12, 2013
Messages
3,766
Loc.
Georgia
I looked at a bronco for sale today, no glovebox vin, but a vin tag on the inner kick panel drivers side. title is bonded and the owner lost it. he will talk to the DMV next week. Forgot to look at the frame to see if they matched. I know the one vin location in the engine bay area, where is the other one? also interesting number on this bronco, A00505. That is the earliest number i have seen on a bronco up close and personal.


The vin# is stamped on the passenger side frame rail in two places.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=c7x7YPKc7sc&feature=youtu.be
 

okie4570

Contributor
Bronco Guru
Joined
Jul 16, 2012
Messages
9,283
Loc.
NW OK
I looked at a bronco for sale today, no glovebox vin, but a vin tag on the inner kick panel drivers side. title is bonded and the owner lost it. he will talk to the DMV next week. Forgot to look at the frame to see if they matched. I know the one vin location in the engine bay area, where is the other one? also interesting number on this bronco, A00505. That is the earliest number i have seen on a bronco up close and personal.

That's about as early 67' and they come :)
 

Viperwolf1

Contributor
electron whisperer
Joined
Aug 23, 2007
Messages
24,335
The only "legal" VIN on an EB is the one stamped on the frame in two places. That's 100% of the reason why you can buy the other VIN tags and stickers from Marti. Simple.

That aside, the "inspectors" in many states will simply go by the tag that is easiest to find.

Exactly. The warranty tag on the kickpanel or glovebox door is actually a warranty tag, not a VIN plate like those on later vehicle dash panels. Frame has the only real VIN. Many people, including DMV employees, don't realize the difference. Some people take advantage of that.

Thought I would jump in on this conversation with another question. I have a 75 frame I bought with a couple of other broncos. Has VIN clearly marked U15GLV00004. Thinking of building from ground up. Can I simply get a Marti report for this with new tags and then apply for a replacement title ? Anyone have a clear answer here. Thanks , Jeff

Legally speaking, you can't buy buy a frame (or whole vehicle) without a matching title or a title without a matching frame from an individual. Some people think it's ok to sell glovebox doors with titles but that's actually illegal also. There is probably a good chance that VIN is currently in use somewhere because someone else has the title and glovebox door on a Bronco with a different frame and possibly body. Getting a title issued to you sets you up for a possible future legal battle with that other individual. You might win the battle but it might not be cheap or easy if both vehicles get towed and impounded for a month or two while the authorities figure out the situation.
 
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aklb43

aklb43

Jr. Member
Joined
Nov 27, 2009
Messages
135
dang

Might be worth having the frame with the matching vin blasted and then coat it in por-15 just to avoid the potential BS in the future. Only bummer is taking the time to transfer everything over and weld on the the f-250 shock mounts. If it was going to be a trail rig like i intend, I wouldn't go through the hassle, but my body guy has turned the tub into a work of art...at my cost, but just saying.
 

bronkenn

Contributor
Bronco Guy
Joined
Apr 27, 2017
Messages
2,667
Loc.
Southeast Ohio
Might want to call your local sheriff's office and run the numbers to see if there are any problems. I did this with a frame I bought and it came back registered to a truck somewhere. It would be a bummer to build that work of art body and set it on someone else's frame then they come by later on with title to your Bronco. Ken
 

blubuckaroo

Grease Monkey
Joined
Jun 11, 2007
Messages
11,795
Loc.
Ridgefield WA
Shouldn't be a problem. Many Bronco have frames with replaced bodies, and vice-versa.
Just make sure you keep the titles for both.
 

jamesroney

Contributor
Sr. Member
Joined
Sep 11, 2007
Messages
1,824
Loc.
Fremont, CA
So I did a frame off restore but instead of using the fram that had a matching vin to my title, I used a frame I bought and put everything onto it. I never thought it would really matter which frame I used since the fram vin is buried under there. I also don’t intend to sell the truck. Will I run into any issues? I still have the frame with the matching vin, and it’s not to late to use it, but it would be a pain A$$ to restore it and move all my junk onto it.

As these vehicles increase in value, this is going to become a bigger problem. Vehicle provenance, Title, and VIN issues are largely irrelevant in a $2,500 Rusted out Bronco project. But as we see Broncos approach $100K...you start to hit the threshold where financial legal remedies become more commonplace.

It is not an unreasonable expectation that your Bronco will someday be sold, re-sold, inherited, or otherwise end up in the hands of someone who would reasonably assume that the title matches the Vehicle. When and if that happens...you (or your estate) have perpetuated a fraud.

For 15-20 years, people in California have been claiming that their 76-77 Broncos are actually 1975 and earlier to circumvent the draconian, arbitrary and capricious emission control rules. This was generally done on cheap Broncos, where the owner would keep clean paper (good titles) on both VINS. The scenario would be if you owned a 77, but couldn't get smog...you would buy a 66-75...Title and register it...and then swap over the warranty plate. Since the intent was solely to subvert the SMOG requirements, there was no legal intent to defraud anyone. No harm, no foul.

Fast forward to 2018...and now there are a bunch of really nice, rust free California Bronco's with 76-77 Frames and VINS, and 66-75 Titles. After a couple of subsequent owners...the 76-77 paperwork is long gone. And the Title no longer matches the Frame VIN. On an $85,000 truck!!!

The notion of having a vehicle impounded might seem ridiculous, but consider this scenario...Let's say that your Bronco is taken for a joy ride. Lets say that the thief's remove the license plates. Let's say that you report the Bronco stolen. Now imagine that your Bronco is found on the side of the road, and impounded by Law Enforcement. It will go to the impound lot, and the frame VIN will be used for identification. That number will come back to the last registered owner...and that is not you! The impound lot will eventually do the Lien Sale, and you will never even be notified. There are a lot of much worse things that can happen.

Do yourself a favor, and get a title that matches your frame VIN. Do that by either making the frame match your paper, or get paper that matches your frame. PM me offline if you need help.
 

Gupster88

Contributor
Guppy
Joined
Jan 15, 2019
Messages
817
Loc.
Tillamook OR
Could someone tell me where the second stamped VIN is on frame. Besides the one below firewall on passengers side? Thanks
 
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